Vikings Cruise to an Easy Win
by Anthony21 on Nov 22, 2009 4:09 PM CST
in Minnesota Vikings 2009 Season
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PrintWhen Tarvaris Jackson is getting some third quarter playing time, and it's not because Brett Favre has been knocked out of the game, you know the Vikings have controlled the game and are winning convincingly. That was the case this afternoon, as the Vikings dominated the Seahawks in the first half and cruised to an easy win.
Sure, there were a few early stumbles, and the game remained scoreless after the first quarter. And for such a decisive win, Adrian Peterson's production was surprisingly limited by a Seattle defense that was committed to stuffing the run. But Brett Favre delivered one of his most efficient performances since becoming a Viking, completing a combined 19 passes to Visanthe Shiancoe, Percy Harvin and Sidney Rice. And the defensive effort by the Vikings was tremendous. The numbers tell the story of just how good this team was on defense.
The Vikings finished the game with 28 first downs; the Seahawks managed just 10, and many of those came after the result of the game was no longer in doubt. Seattle went 1/10 on third downs, but even more importantly, they finished the game with four rushing yards on 13 attempts. Their leading rusher, Justin Forsett, finished the game with nine rushing yards on nine attempts. If you want to see the story of this game, just look at the box score.
Matt Hasselbeck was fairly productive -- when Seattle actually had the ball. And the Seahawks didn't have the ball for long. The Vikings offense was on the field for over 42 minutes, finishing within striking distance of possessing the football for 75% of the game. Such dominance in a team's time of possession would normally imply an outstanding performance on the ground, but today, Favre was brilliant in controlling the tempo of the game.
If anything, Adrian Peterson's performance was below-average (by his standards). 24 carries for 82 yards, and he had a number of carries that either went for no gain or actually lost some yards. Seattle was completely focused on stopping the run, but they paid the price in the form of Favre's 213 yards and four touchdowns. This game just displays that teams need to pick their poison when facing the Vikings: Concentrate resources on stopping Adrian, and they risk Brett having a big day through the air. You can either get beat on the ground by the most exciting running back in the game, or you can get beat through the air by an MVP candidate. Your choice.
And on that note, I should add that the MVP chant was loud and clear at the Metrodome today. We knew Brett would be a great addition to this offense -- but I doubt anyone anticipated Brett being so efficient.
After Sidney caught a jump ball in the endzone from Favre, the win was sealed and T-Jack entered the game for about a quarter of playing time. Aside from a pass that probably should have been picked but somehow ended up in the hands of Sidney Rice, the mistakes were few and far between for Action Jackson. His final stat line: 6/8, 77 yards and a touchdown. He picked up right where Favre left off, in terms of running an efficient offense, controlling the ball, and controlling the pace of the game. Tarvaris did a nice job out there.
The 9-1 Vikings are at home against Chicago next weekend -- the 10-0 Saints are at home against the Patriots next Monday. The race for homefield has accomplished the unthinkable: We'll become Pats fans next week.
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Travaris looked much better
Its always easy to criticize a player but it sure looked to me as if Travaris was more confident in his decision making. In fact he looked almost Farve like in his strong throws. I would like to think that he has learned from Farve and is becoming a more confident QB. It’s always hard to tell in a blowout victory but every step in the right direction is just one step in insuring the long range plans of the Vikes.
Something Chilly said after the game.
He said on the postgame show that he put T-Jack in and the offense didn’t take a step back at all. Out of the many bright spots from this game, I’m especially pleased with Tarvaris.
T-Jack Anxiety Syndrome
Only struck hard once; that tipped pass that could have turned into an interception, but SuperSid lunged in to make it a Vikings gainer. Really would like that sort of thing to stop.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
TJ's passer rating was 3 points higher than Favre's
by medicineball on Nov 22, 2009 4:53 PM CST up reply actions
lol
Maybe we should start TJ next week
(All kidding aside – I have wondered if resting Favre once we clinch division might be more important than sewing up home field. After all, NO looks like they’ll get it anyway, and Dallas and Arizona aren’t posing much of a threat for the #2 seed.)
If we beat Arizona
We’re going to be pretty much a lock for #2, because we’ll own the head-to-head tiebreaker and Dallas has a HARD schedule remaining (and almost lost to sorry Washington today)
I’d definitely consider it, if I were Chilly.
So what?
He was throwing against a team which had probably expected the Vikes to run the clock out. It reminded me a lot of the preseason game that started off with 11 consecutive pass plays a couple of years ago. Yeah, TJ is OK when the team is expecting AP or CT and just wants to get off the field (which is why the playcalling was so terrible for so long), but he didn’t prove anything today.
Downplay his performance...
..all you want, but he did better than just OK.
Just OK
Here is a breakdown of the 8 passes he attempted:
1st-and-10 to AP (incomplete)
2nd-and-12 to Rice for 9 yds
3rd-and-3 to Rice for 8 yds (ruling reversed)
1st-and-10 to Shiancoe for 10 yds
2nd-and-9 to AP (incomplete)
3rd-and-9 to Harvin for 16 yds
2nd-and-11 to Rice for 34 yd TD
3-4 of those had the element of surprise working in TJ’s favor. The best of those was the 16 yd pass to Harvin on 3rd-and-9 because it was the only time that the ‘Hawks knew that the Vikings would pass. All QBs have the occasional lucky throw that gets tipped into the arms of a teammate who makes a great run to the end zone, but it’s usually not 1/8 of a good QB’s success.
I was glad that he ran once for 6 yds, although it was on 3rd-and-10 and one such attempt per half isn’t going to scare the D into loosening up the coverage anyway. Still, it was much better than an INT.
He does well in preseason games and garbage time
especially when the D is expecting the run, I’ll give him that.
TD pass to Rice...
…was not a lucky throw that was tipped as far as I can recall. I thought Rice ran a hook pattern and TJ delivered it on time?
Worst of all
the 2nd-and-12 tipped pass that Rice bailed TJ out on looked like it was actually meant for Shiancoe, who was double-covered…and the fact that a DE, Patrick Kerney, made the play. Kerney’s a fine DE, but what kind of QB makes him look like a great coverage guy?
KC Viking makes a valid point IMO.
I was at the game and one nice thing about being there in person is you can really study different aspects of the team’s play. I was not fixed on Jackson for all of his pass plays, but the ones I did concentrate on I saw the same QB from last year, the one that has a strong arm, can scramble, and who still has not learned to look his receivers off.
While I was not disappointed in the outcome, I was disappointed that more of Favre’s understanding of the QB position had not rubbed off on him. I believe that Jackson is a solid backup and probably could have been good enough as a starter to repeat as division champs. I did not see improvement from the past.
But maybe it’s just lack of game-time experience this year. Maybe this is all he has to offer. In any case, I really do want to see the kid succeed.
"Skol pa fiskande"
You had me confused as to which pass you were talking about...
…because of this “All QBs have the occasional lucky throw that gets tipped into the arms of a teammate who makes a great run to the end zone, but it’s usually not 1/8 of a good QB’s success.”
The play calling was limited the last 2 seasons
Because T.Jack was young, inexperienced and not Brett Favre. Chilly had to limit things with T.Jack in the past b/c when he opened things up T.Jack made mistakes.
He may have gained some valuable experience the last few seasons and be better for it. Learning from Favre can’t hurt, especially when it comes to finding a second option and getting the ball out quickly.
I agree he didn’t prove a lot but he did show he will be a decent backup and has a solid understanding of the offence.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
R4F doesnt agreee with you
Purple Haze is the worlds greatest Natural Resource.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Nov 22, 2009 7:55 PM CST up reply actions
Ive made this point in the past and will continue to make it, while as a starter, Jackson has shown improvements, but also shown me reasons why I think he would not make a long term starting QB. In games as a back-up, such as today, he does and did very well. Same thing last year, started out shaky, got benched, came in as a back-up towards the end but as a starter, failed in the final game. At this point, I think the jury is still out on T.J. with alot of people. for me, I am thinking more of he will be gone thru F.A. or trade.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 22, 2009 7:20 PM CST up reply actions
Tarvaris is at the very least a solid backup QB
At the very least, Tarvaris is a solid backup QB in the NFL.
If you don’t admit that, you need to stop hating this guy. He is a good Viking.
by medicineball on Nov 22, 2009 8:03 PM CST up reply actions
Thats what I was alluding too, he will be a good back-up. As far as hating, how am I hating him? Did I say he sucked arse? He was an idiot? No, if you re-read, will see that I did admit he has shown improvements, but at this point, I still don’t see him as our long term starter.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 22, 2009 10:01 PM CST up reply actions
I'm with you...
I saw nothing from TJ in a nothing role that makes me anxious to keep this guy around. He still looked indecisive, threw the ball at bad angles, behind receivers, and if it wasn’t for Rice, he’d have at least one less reception and no TD (Rice made that TD happen). Not saying I hate the guy, but I’m with VFNM that I’m more than happy to see TJ leave after the year… and that if Favre misses any time this year, we’re in trouble. But so far, so good, nice that this is the least of our worries to talk about in week 10. Nice win today.
by San Diego Viking on Nov 22, 2009 10:49 PM CST up reply actions
Would you trade TJ for Jay Cutler?
Because that would be a horrible trade for the Vikings.
by medicineball on Nov 22, 2009 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
How in the hell did Cutler get involved in a discussion about T.J.? I wouldnt trade Hershall Walker for Cutler
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 23, 2009 10:51 AM CST up reply actions
Revised opinion
If you had asked me that question earlier in the year, I would have said, “In heart-beat, and twice on Sundays.”
That was before I got to see what Cutler looked like outside of his set piece in Denver, but worse, got to see how his attitude would have made him a cancer on the best Viking squad I’ve seen since the ’70s.
So… as I chomp on my share of the crow-pie on this issue, my answer today would be ‘No’. Not because of talent (all things being equal, he’s better than T-Jack), but because of attitude.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
+100
My feelings too. At first I was pro Cutler, then seeing how he handled things in Denver made me change my mind and fast. Being in New Mexico, the two dominant teams that are followed here are the Cowboys and the Broncos. Most people are now happy to have Orton. Perhaps not the greatest QB, but has kept the mistakes and attitude to a minimum. While as I stated already, Cutler has already been fined for abusive behavior towards Ref’s. I am very glad the Vikings as well as many others saw what he really is, and hence why I think he is on the road to a Leaf like meltdown. As I stated, I don’t know how in the world Cutler got involve din this conversation, perhaps a version of a poison pill to poison the topic, I dont know. but no, I would rather have Ty Detmer as our QB then Cutler anyday
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 23, 2009 11:11 PM CST up reply actions
Rice saved two throws — caught the deflected pass and the impressive shoe string catch.
I saw nothing from TJ in a nothing role that makes me anxious to keep this guy around.
I agree with this, but on other hand I can’t truly judge Jackson until I see how he deals with the pressure of a “real” game situation.
That is true
And that’s what I am basing my assesment off of when he had those real games. Again, Favre could be showing him the ropes, but up to the kid to absorb that or not, just like Sage and neither one of them would get enough blood flowing in my body to impress my girlfriend at this moment.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 23, 2009 10:52 AM CST up reply actions
so I guess you didnt watch any games over the last 3 years
TJack ’flashed" potential at times. But has never been consistent enough to earn the role of a starting QB in this league
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
Rich Gannon
Rich Gannon played several times for the Vikings from 1987 to 1993 and flashed potential, but was never consistent enough to earn a starting job.
Then the Vikings let him go. Gannon went on to become a great NFL quarterback. He won the MVP award and led the Raiders to the Super Bowl.
Go down the list of Super Bowl winning quarterbacks. Many of them had rough starts to their careers. A rough start is no reason at all to give up on Tarvaris. We have plenty of reasons to like his future potential as the Vikings starting quarterback at some point in the future.
That said, who knows? At this point, it’s fine. Jackson should be resigned, but that can wait a while.
by medicineball on Nov 23, 2009 11:39 AM CST up reply actions
By the way, regarding Vikings history
In my view, one of the biggest mistakes in Vikings history is letting Rich Gannon go. That is why I am so active in defending Tarvaris Jackson. I don’t want to see the Vikings make another mistake like that.
by medicineball on Nov 23, 2009 11:42 AM CST up reply actions
As I stated
TJack has not shown the consistency to be considered a legit starter. Is it possible that the light will go on and he develops into a solid starter? Yes. Does he have the physical tools? Absolutely. Do I think he will pan out as a solid starter for us and take us to the playoffs regularly? My gut says no. He had the same tools we have this year, minus Harvin, and lost his job to Gus after starting 0-2. I am not totally giving up on him, he’s a decent back-up. I just think we will need another option after Favre retires.
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
And another point
Peyton Manning, Troy Aikman, John Elway and Steve Young all struggled early in their careers as well…there is no mistaking Rich Gannon or TJack for that matter with this group of guys.
After 3 years, the whole world knew that Manning, Aikman, Elway and Young had “it.” I Doubt anyone thinks TJack has “it” at this point in his career.
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
Confidence
First, I believe T-Jack has “it.”
Second, nobody thought Rich Gannon had “it” and then he went out and proved everyone wrong.
Third, the only thing holding T-Jack back right now is confidence. He is a guy who lacks confidence right now. I see him getting the confidence he needs and being great.
by medicineball on Nov 23, 2009 4:22 PM CST up reply actions
Fair assessment. I truly wonder if Jackson was hurt by being thrown into fire too quickly; it’s easier to tear down confidence than build it up. The human mind can be a fickle thing and I hope his confidence returns…but it might not be with the Vikings after the QB carousal we’ve had until Favre signed. Bringing in all those guys to “bring competition” might or might not have shaken Jackson’s confidence to the point that he is always looking over his shoulder while in Minnesota.
That has always been my thought, Jackson, while physical skills, lacked mental and got thrown in waaaaay fast. One of the reasons for my harshness about Chilly and being a QB “guru”. As for Gannon, he showed ALOT more promise and consistency by then then did T.J. and I knew back then it was a mistake to let him go. Just like I thought it was a mistake to trade Brad Johnson and rely on 1/2 year wonder Cunningham. So far though, while some improvement, more an improvement I would see in an journeyman, not a starting QB. While yes, who knows what will happen after Favre retires for good, but so far, not changing my opinion until I see otherwise.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 23, 2009 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
Super Bowl winning quarterbacks
We should not repeat the mistakes of Vikings history. The Vikings have never won a Super Bowl. We should do what Super Bowl winning teams have done.
In the history of the Super Bowl, most starting quarterbacks on the winning side were drafted by that team. Very, very few were signed as free agents or traded for.
As for Brad Johnson, he went on to pick up his Super Bowl ring with our former division rival, Tampa Bay. People wanted to trade him after his first playoff game, the debacle down in Dallas. Yet, he proved everybody wrong and turned out to be a great competitor and plenty good enough to be a winner and a champion. Then we brought him back. He was good for a while but by then he was getting old.
Part of the problem was that Denny Green’s offense back in the 90s didn’t fit the WCO-oriented Gannon and Johnson.
by medicineball on Nov 23, 2009 11:38 PM CST up reply actions
He got worse because of a system that he did not know by a first year Coach who just got an extension this year. You already shot yourself in the foot by claiming he didn’t fit Greens offense as it was Green who gave him the starting job and he was doing fine 20TD’s, 12INTs. 3,000+ yards the year before he got injured. Also, then Bucs coach Grudens offense was the same as Green since both were taught under the same style of offense that Bill Walsh employed. Green directly with Walsh, Gruden under Holmgren who used to work under Walsh. So that won’t work. It comes down too the fact that whether or not teams draft a QB and go to the Super Bowl or teams grab a F.A. and go to the Super Bowl, so far, T.J. is not fitting the mold till otherwise proven he can improve under pressure.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 23, 2009 11:52 PM CST up reply actions
Patience
We need to have patience. The only thing holding Jackson back is a lack of confidence.
Dennis Green’s offense in Minnesota was not the WCO. It was a Redskins-inspired offense that focused on long pass plays. Brad Johnson and Gannon were both better fits with the WCO that the Bucs and Raiders ran, than they were running Green’s preferred offense. The bottom line is that the Green/Tice offense as they implemented it did not win the Super Bowl. The WCO has been used by Super Bowl winning teams, including the Bucs of several years ago. The Redskins won the Super Bowl with their offense but that was decades ago. The Redskins offense doesn’t win championships anymore.
My point is that Green made a mistake in installing that offense. If he had kept the Jerry Burns/WCO system the Vikings had when he arrived, Cris Carter would still have prospered, and we would have had two championship quarterbacks on the team in Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon without the need to hunt around FA or drafting Culpepper when we did. That would have freed up money and draft picks to get more defensive talent.
The ’98 team lost primarily because the defense did not have enough large players to stop the run. If you score 27 points in the conference championship game, your defense should be able to hold your opponent to less than that. One key mistake was cutting Gilbert Brown (“The Gravedigger”) after the Vikings drafted him and had him in training camp. The only reason Green cut Brown was for his weight. Well, Gilbert Brown would have been the type of run-stopping defensive player we could have really used in the ’98 NFC Championship game. The bottom line though is that Green was excellent at drafting and developing offensive players, and not so good with defensive players.
Dennis Green needlessly parted ways with multiple high talent guys like Chris Doleman, Rich Gannon, Gary Zimmerman, Terry Allen, Kirk Lowdermilk, and Randall McDaniel. The list is actually longer, especially when you factor in all the decent DBs that were lost—two to the Steelers alone—over the Green/Tice era.
If you want to win the Super Bowl, you KEEP a high-potential quarterback who is developing. You DO NOT let that guy go. The same goes for any position, but is especially true for quarterbacks.
Tarvaris Jackson is the #2 quarterback on the Vikings for a reason. He is good. He has beat out a lot of competition over the years. He has the potential to be a very good NFL quarterback. Have patience.
by medicineball on Nov 24, 2009 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
Patience?
This is a business. I would argue that Childress has had more patience than most would. He stuck with TJack, despite every critic in the world saying he shouldnt. Yes he brought in Gus, Bollinger, Brad, and yes TJack beat out all of them at some point, however Childress knew that this time around the business would affect him as well. That’s why he went out to get Favre, because he didnt want to risk his job again with TJack at the helm.
The whole point about the system works here too, not just with Gannon. TJack is not a West Coast guy. It’s too complex for him. The offensive coaches have had to simplify it for him. He’s more of a shotgun, read half the field kind of guy.
These arguements about Favre having a better scenario this year are funny. Last year, TJack and AP saw 9 in the box on almost every play. That should have been like a dream come true for TJack. The defense was loading the box to stop AP. Did TJack make the defenses pay? Why were 9 in the box in the first place? The defense did not fear our passing game!
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
Not according to Favre
In his last post-game press conference, Favre said he asks T-Jack questions a lot.
T-Jack only lacks confidence. Everything else he has got or will have soon.
by medicineball on Nov 24, 2009 5:32 PM CST up reply actions
Confidence?
What’s holding him back from having confidence? And isn’t confidence a part of “it?” Either he has “it” or he doesn’t.
Funny that you bring up confidence, because the rest of the vikings right now has more confidence in themselves than ever before. Why? #4, that’s why. Just listen to the way they talk, Shank, heck even guys on the defense are glowing with confidence because of Favre. Needless to say, even though many players are friends with TJack, they never had this much confidence with him under center as they do now.
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
Confidence
What’s holding him back from having confidence? And isn’t confidence a part of "it?" Either he has "it" or he doesn’t.
Much is made these days about QBs and ‘confidence’, and a lot about how this or that QB who’s doing poorly, has ‘confidence’ issues. I’m not buying into it, myself. As you said, either a QB has “It”, or he doesn’t. If he’s been a QB since high school, and through college, if he doesn’t have “It” by the time he gets to the NFL, I don’t think he should be a professional QB.
As Medicineball noted, a person’s confidence can change over time, but if QB doesn’t have confidence in himself and his ability, he’s probably damaged beyond recovery.
Having confidence in his receivers, and vice versa, is another issue entirely, and then there’s confidence in the O-line, that they can hold off the opposition for another second to give the QB time to make the pass. This sort of confidence does indeed fluctuate a lot, no issues there at all.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Benched?
Take another look at the 0-2 start.
Missed most of the preseason because of injury. This didn’t allow TJ to get timing down with Berrian or anyone else for that matter. TJ was also slightly injured and Rice wasn’t used the way he should have.
First 2 games: Multiple dropped passes in the endzone that should have been routine catches. In both games, had the receivers and TE caught the balls the Vikes would have won.
Eagles game: young QB not ready for the looks that the Eagles give you. He just wasn’t ready for that game. Can’t put the blame solely on TJ. He should have spent the first 2 seasons learning coming out of such a small school. Chilly in his infinite wisdom tossed him to the wolves without the tools to succeed!
I don’t know if he is the future, but give him the tools to succeed and he may just do that. Open up the playbook and allow him the chance. You can tell he hasn’t been given that opportunity yet.
He didn't have the same Sidney Rice...
…Favre has this year or Visanthe Shiancoe for what it’s worth. He also had the dynamic Troy Williamson the year before.
They're like the NFL's equivalent of the Yankees.
Gross.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
Um...yeah
Can’t I just hope the Saints lose and not root for NE?
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?" -Joe Kapp
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 22, 2009 4:42 PM CST up reply actions
Awesome, dominant win guys
Pretty much what was expected.
Not sure I fully agree with your analysis on the start. Seahawks D looked rock-solid but obviously you can’t continue being that good if you’re on the field that much, so you could say your D beat our D. Favre’s dink-and-dunk passing games to everyone-but-his-receivers in the 1st quarter is hardly the stuff of legend. But once our D was worn out, you guys steamrolled.
You could call the 1st quarter “spunky” from the Seahawks, and then the dominance showed. Outplayed in every facet of the game. About as dominant as one can win.
Boring Game
That was a boring game today, and I’m happy with that. I don’t need Vikings in-game drama every week.
by Midnight Rambler on Nov 22, 2009 4:32 PM CST reply actions
MN TD's are never "boring" IMHO.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?" -Joe Kapp
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 22, 2009 4:43 PM CST up reply actions
The Vikings pass D is better than you thought even without Winfield. Either that or they have improved. I think we will both take it.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
82.3
That was Hasselbeck’s passer rating. It was slightly better than the Vikings’ 23rd-ranked season average of 89.1, but still below average. Yes, that could represent a slight improvement for the pass defense, but I still want to see the secondary shut down a contender (or even a couple of pretenders) before I believe.
The Vikes gave up 4 total rushing yards the entire game. They were going to get a little offence from somewhere.
So Hasselbeck got 231yards with no TDs and 1INT. If that is the output every QB puts up against the Vikes for the rest of the year they won’t lose again.
However this was the Seahawks so I won’t get too excited.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
Every game for the rest of the season can be like this one, and I wouldn't complain :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Spreading the wealth
Didn’t he just!? It’s so obvious now that even the announcers were ready with stat-lines on the spread across the receivers. No team can key on any one receiver with Favre doing this, it almost guarantees at least one receiver has to be left open if the try to stuff the box. And I’m sure it’s making a huge difference in morale too; it’s gotta suck when you’re capable of being a good receiver but all you ever end up doing is blocking for the ‘stars’. Smart QB play.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I liked seeing...
the WRs getting together in the EZ – they were all there congratulating the TD pretty quickly.
That group has gelled and just keeps getting better!
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 22, 2009 10:47 PM CST up reply actions
Race for # 1 Seed
I was just looking at the Vikings and Saints remaining schedules, and I have to give the edge in the race for the # 1 seed to New Orleans. They get their toughest remaining opponents, New England and Dallas, at home.
The Vikings, meanwhile, have to play at Arizona and at Chicago. Not that the Bears are that good, but that game will be outdoors in December, which I think will have a levelling effect. The Vikings also have a tough home game against Cincinatti.
My guess is when all is said and done the Saints will maintain their one-game lead over Minnesota. I don’t think New Orleans will go 16-0, but it is not impossible, either. The Vikings could win all of their remaining games, but I don’t think they will.
However, I do believe that the Vikings can beat New Orleans in the Superdome. The Saints are a good team, but I think they’ve beneffited a bit from a rather soft NFC South schedule, and are not quite as good as their 14-2/15-1 finish might indicate.
by Midnight Rambler on Nov 22, 2009 4:37 PM CST reply actions
My only hope for that game (if it happens)
No fluky plays that cost us the game
No fluky officiating calls that cost us the game
No injuries
Just a hot Brees against a hot Favre!
Wow! It’s kind of scary, actually…
The Saints will lose
We may not get the #1 seed. They do have the edge in schedule that’s for sure. We can beat them at the Superdome. I don’t expect Favre to go untouched but Brees will face the most pressure he has faced all year. The pressure of winning a championship game and our defense will be the best he has faced. Got nothing against the Saints, I just believe that we have a better team. Favre has been in a lot of big games and he has all the weapons all with a solid defense. How many big games has Drew Brees really been in? That is why we will win.
hello from a Saints fan
Got nothing against the Saints, I just believe that we have a better team.
Well, I’ve got nothing against the Vikings, I also believe we just have a better team. I’m hoping for a Vikings/Saints NFC Championship game for the sole reason of throwing it in Roger Goodell’s face after the whole Starcaps-Gate debacle. It would have to be at least a mild embarrassment for him that the two teams most effected by the suspensions he tried to levy out go the farthest in their conference. Needless to say, I didn’t agree with the league trying to suspend the players involved in this.
I actually like the Vikings and have been a long time Favre fan. If the NFC championship does end with these two teams, I just hope it gets played in New Orleans. I can’t believe Midnight Rambler actually believes the Saints have played a soft NFC schedule to date. The Vikings schedule this year looks a helluva lot easier than the Saints when looking at the NFC West and North. Out of those two divisions, the only true test for you guys will be the Cardinals, and with them you never know which Cardinals team will show up.
Well anyway, good luck the rest of the season (except if you face the Saints).
"I said this early on that this was a good football team, they just maybe had to have a stick put in certain parts of their body to play a little harder in certain places to where we’re able to take interceptions and score touchdowns."--Gregg Williams
by David "Satch" Kelly on Nov 23, 2009 12:50 PM CST up reply actions
I'm a Long Time Saints Fan..........
and a long time BF fan, having watched him since his first game, which was against Tulane, and a come frm behind thriller.
I don’t know who I’m going to root for if they wind up playing each other in the NFC championship – I think the teams are about equal, with the Vikings maybe being a little better. If they play in NO that should even it up, but you never know what’s going to happen in football.
Sidney Rice limped off the field after he caught a TD pass – I hope he’s okay.
They’re the two most fun teams to watch because of their great offenses. Or maybe I just think that, because I’m their fan?
What will be will be.
by MissButterfly on Nov 23, 2009 2:29 PM CST up reply actions
El Sid...
had cramps in his leg. he was running around like a madman on routes and blocking for others.
He came back on the field and caught another TD pass from TJack that was 95% Sid.
He’s OK!
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 23, 2009 2:31 PM CST up reply actions
That's Good to Hear.....
I didn’t see the Vikings game,just some highlights – Sidney Rice is one of my faves!
by MissButterfly on Nov 23, 2009 4:40 PM CST up reply actions
soft "NFC SOUTH" schedule
Bucs, Falcons, Panthers twice. Is what I think he was referring to. But same was said about our schedule early in the season. I’ve always said that you cant control who you play, all you can control is the outcome.
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
+100 on starcaps
The Viking D is better than the Saints. Sharper has slowed off his torrid start.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
GOODELL?
i think he’s an idiot……………a paper collar……….does not know football……….and won’t admit that the nfl was liabelly negligent in it’s decsions regarding the known facts in this star-caps fiasco………but the important thing is………i believe the saints are a mirror image of the 98 vikes………GREAT offense but the defense is playing loose because of the big leads………….not sure but it could be masking some of the saints d………they have given up some big yards on the ground in the last couple of weeks………..we’ll see
If going 6-10, 8-8, 10-6 and start 9-1 this season sucks for a coach what do you say about a coach who shows no improvment. Are they shot on site?
Everyone just can’t come in and be Mike Tomlin and win a SB in their second year as head coach. Its not like Chilly walked into the greatest situation being asked to change the entire culture of the team, after sex boat, lack of character…
Like I’ve said before the playbook was limited the last few years b/c obviously so was T.Jack. When he opened things up too much(whether it be T.Jack or Gus) mistakes and turnovers piled up. He has drafted great overall, heck I don’t think any team has drafted better than the Vikes in the past 3-4 years and Chilly had as much to do with drafting players as anyone in the organization.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
Goodell?
why do you use…….so many periods…….to make……..a point………
by Midnight Rambler on Nov 23, 2009 6:55 PM CST up reply actions
I like to use the elipses... (three dots)
not sure what 8 or more dots means.
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 23, 2009 7:44 PM CST up reply actions
maybe......
because ………it …………annoys……….you………………go……….vikes…………….
Believe It
“I can’t believe Midnight Rambler actually believes the Saints have played a soft NFC schedule to date.”
Believe it.
Thus far, the Saints have beaten teams like Carolina, Tampa Bay, St. Louis, Atlanta, the Jets, and the Bills. The Saints, whom I acknowledged are a good team, have benefitted from playing the soft matchups against their own division and the cellar-dwellers of the NFC West and AFC East. The closest thing New Orleans has to “signature wins” are over Philly and the Giants.
The Patriots are easily the best team the Saints will face in the regular season, and they catch them at the Superdome. Then more easy wins against the likes of Washington, Carolina, and Tampa Bay.
by Midnight Rambler on Nov 23, 2009 6:54 PM CST up reply actions
why don't you,
tell us how you really feel !
like ONLY you can.
take a kid fishing, it's good for the soul. not only yours, but the child's as well !
What Favre means to the team.
Truly the Minnesota Vikings were a fine football team before Brett Favre joined the ranks. Truly the Minnesota Vikings are good without him. But what are the Minnesota Vikings with Brett Favre under center? Super Bowl champions. Brett has started 301 consecutive games. Do you realize that there are players who enterered the league after Brett, retired, went to the announcers booth and retired from there too? And Brett is still playing. Do you realize that Brett is the highest rated QB in the league after nine games this season? And then he posts a 146 rating today against Seattle. Do you realize that Brett owns all the big QB records? Do you realize that his teammates love him? He makes them better. I watched him for 16 seasons in Green Bay. He was Green Bay. When they dumped him I left the Pack . Brett knows what it takes to win a Super Bowl. No one has ever won league MVP three times except Brett. He is having a banner year in Minnesota. Minnesota is stacked – yes – but you can bet your bottom dollar that Brett makes Minnesota twice the team they are without him. I watched him single handedly dismantle New England and Tennessee last year. He took New York to 8-3 by his sheer will to win. And then his arm went south. Minnesota, realize what you have. Appreciate it. He’s going to take you to the Super Bowl and I think he’ll win it for you this year.
by ExPackerTurnedVike on Nov 22, 2009 5:40 PM CST reply actions
Yes, we understand what we have in #4...
and HELL cooled another 35 degrees today…
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 22, 2009 6:57 PM CST up reply actions
I laughed out loud
Purple Haze is the worlds greatest Natural Resource.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Nov 22, 2009 7:59 PM CST up reply actions
You don't have to tell us,
because R4F will never let us forget it. Not that we would, of course.
"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
You guys are Super Bowl champions? Wow, that's quick.
Also Peyton also has 3 MVPs.
by Thomas Beekers on Nov 23, 2009 8:27 AM CST up reply actions
ExPackerTurned...Thanks and all but
No player is bigger than an organization. The Pack had to plan for their future and would have jeopardized it by keeping Favre around for too long and losing Rodgers to free agency, which by now they surely would have.
If the shoe was on the other foot and Favre had 16 seasons and the same success with the Vikes, I still would have gotten sick of the back and forth will I won’t I retire dragging on for 3 plus seasons. It strained the organization and no I don’t know what went on between Ted Thompson and Favre, but going back and forth for 3 plus seasons was Favre’s doing. So near the end Ted just wanted an answer. The patience they had for all that Favre had brought to the Pack had been drained after years of uncertanty and the thought of losing Rodgers just to keep Favre around a season or two longer scared them.
Favre was coming off one good season out of his last four and would hit age 39 come mid season. Rodgers has shown in just his first 2 seasons that he can be great and had been waiting for 4 years.
Favre said the relationship strained and he needed to move on and so did the Packers. Favre understood that, but you can’t. Wanna come and jump on the Viking bandwagon, get off we don’t want ya. Its our time now so be loyal to you team and take your lumps!
I hate the Packers but,
I respect people that are loyal to their franchise, not ones that think any player is bigger than it.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
Sorry, Favre was coming off one good season in his last three in Green Bay, not four.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
And I don't care who you respect,
and I particularly don’t care to take advice from somebody who thinks that they can decide who I can and cannot root for.
“I don’t know what went on between Ted Thompson and Favre, but going back and forth for 3 plus seasons was Favre’s doing.”
Interesting conjunction of assertions there – you “don’t know what went on,” but you still know it was all Favre’s fault. We’ve been through this a million times and I’m not going to go through it again, but I would suggest you do some research before you reach any conclusions about everything that happened. There is a lot to this story, and many (very many) of us reached a different conclusion about who was disloyal to the organization and will not root for that team as long as that person is there.
You are a fan of almost every team in Michigan and… the Vikings. An odd combination, but not beyond reason; maybe you live in Ironwood or Ontonagon. I don’t know and I don’t care and I certainly am not going to tell you who you can or cannot root for.
If you happen to run into me on the bandwagon, feel free to try to shove me off. Until then, I’m staying. Have a nice day.
by Migrant lurker on Nov 24, 2009 8:18 AM CST up reply actions
Root for whoever you want, but jumping ship takes away from a bitter rivalry. Under no circumstance would I ever root for Green Bay and I certanly don't want them rooting for the Vikes. Favre's your enemy now. Add to the rivalry.
Favre said he felt pressure to make a decision in the final year, but admitted the waivering the previous two seasons was on him because he said he wasent sure if he wanted to do it anymore.
So no, I don’t know what went on the last season, but Favre admitted to starting the retirment talk himself 3 seasons before he left GB.
When someone tells me they have been a die hard fan of any team for 16plus years I like the loyalty and respect it, even if I don’t like the team. By turning your back on a franchise because its best player left means you think a player can be bigger than a franchise and I will never agree with that. Its just wrong. The Green Bay Packers gave him as much as he did them, whether it be money or a chance to still play in his final seasons their after two dissapointing ones. After his 29INT season, followed by a 18TD-18INT season, at age 37, many other teams would thought about moving on. Can you blame them for drafting a QB to invest in their future when they do have an aging QB?
I have had to sit through many rough Viking seasons, but stayed loyal and that is what makes a season like this so sweet.
I live 5 minutes from Detroit in Windsor ONT, so yes I love the Pistons, like the Wings and Tigers sure. My father loved the Vikes throught the 70’s and I grew up watching them. Its not rocket science to see that the Lions never gave me a reason to care, but I grew up following the Vikes from day one. Not everyone has to be a die hard fan, but when you say you are for 16 years then let one player (I don’t care who it is) make you switch you really were never a Packer fan.
But, I must say you did state that “Favre was Green Bay”, so you are in fack Brett Favre fan. The rivalry has been great over the years and I like it. I just hate when people switch sides, because a situation didn’t work out in the way they wanted.
Years back Randy Moss almost went to Green Bay, not the same, but under no circumstances would you catch me cheering for my #1 rival!
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
I wasn't the original poster that you replied to,
but I was another former Packer’s fan who is now rooting for the Vikes, so I replied. I’ve been a Packer’s fan for a lot longer than 16 years. I grew up in the UP (not Ironwood, but we played them every year). Tommy Izzo was a 12 year old kid in my neighborhood who used to fill in on pickup basketball games occasionally when I was in high school (and Steve Mariucci’s dad delivered our fuel oil); that should give you my home town.
We got the Tigers on radio (still a life long fan) and the Packers on TV, which was strictly Green Bay stations at that time. So I’ve been a fan of both since 1961. I’ve lived not just through the Lombardi years and the Favre years, but also the 25 years of frustration in between. I think I have some perspective on how much Brett meant to the team, and an earned perspective on how much respect he may have deserved.
What is clear to me, in retrospect, is that from the moment Ted Thompson took over as GM, he decided that a then 35 year old Favre was on his way out, and that he was going to do everything he could to hasten that departure and mold his own team.
The first two things he did as GM were to draft Rodgers and strip the team of a lot of it’s veterans, especially on the O-line, which led to Brett’s one and only losing season in Thompson’s first year. Favre’s 29 INT season that year wasn’t the impetus for them deciding he was done, it was the direct result of them already having decided that.
Brett thought he had some good years left; Thompson didn’t think so. Maybe that could be judged as reasonable on TT’s part, but it turns out that he was wrong. Brett lobbied Thompson to get some veterans in an effort to win now. Thompson would nod in agreement, and then do nothing about it. Thompson was evidently incapable of any kind of discussion that involved confrontation and so would just say the right thing and never communicate openly. There are some excellent articles by a guy who worked in the Packers front office at the time that lay that out quite clearly. I don’t know about you, but working for someone like that would absolutely drive me crazy.
Favre thought he could still play; Favre thought they could win now. Thompson disagreed. You tell me who was right. You brought up Randy Moss, which was clearly the last straw in the Thompson/Favre relationship. They could have had him easily and relatively cheaply and Favre openly lobbied for it. You tell me what the results of the 2007 season are if they have Moss and the Patriots do not, and then tell me when you think the next Packers Super Bowl opportunity is going to happen. I’ve been around long enough to know that those chances are fleeting.
Favre wanted to play; he just didn’t want to play for Thompson and Thompson clearly didn’t want him. The ‘annual retirement drama’ revolves around that and nothing else and the former front office guy’s articles make it clear that the Pack management absolutely did not want Favre back for 2008, that Favre knew that, and that both of them also knew that Brett was not going to stay retired. But of course they couldn’t actually talk to each other about it because TT doesn’t do that.
So I didn’t abandon my fanship for GB because ‘my favorite player left.’ I abandoned it because one of the biggest pieces of Packers history was driven out of town by a new GM who decided he was more important than that legacy, and who decided to trash that particular piece of history in the process. As far as I’m concerned, number 4 is the last remaining piece of what I rooted for for over 45 years, and he also happens to be the guy I like to watch play more than any other player I’ve ever seen.
So, at the moment, his team is my team and they have my full allegiance.
by Migrant lurker on Nov 25, 2009 8:11 AM CST up reply actions
Were you a Jets fan last year?
Will you be a Vikes fan after Favre?
Yes, I was a Jets fan last year,
and I kind of continue to root for them. I became fully involved with the team – they are an odd case, as there is a deep undercurrent of existential despair involved in being a Jets fan. It is almost too fascinating to let go of. This year, of course, is turning into a bizarre disaster for them.
I’m not sure what I’ll do after Favre retires. I live far away from GB now (Georgia), and have for many years. As I noted above, I grew up in upper Michigan and my packer fandom was largely an accident of available TV stations (and Lombardi), though I would guess the majority of people in my hometown are still Pack fans. I went to college in Appleton, which is 30 miles from GB, and so my familiarity with the area is pretty thorough, though close to ancient history at this point.
Originally, my stance was that I would be a Packer fan after TT was gone; that may still be the case, but I was thoroughly disgusted at the reaction of the fans at the game at Lambeau (I honestly expected at least a polite ovation when he took the field), and so I am no longer so sure.
I like this team a lot; I like Jared Allen and the Williams, I like Harvin and Rice and Shiancoe and Berrian and of course I like AD a lot. I even like Chilly, as he is far and away the most literate coach in the NFL and I love his subtle humor. I have done a lot of thinking lately about what it must mean to be long time fans of a team that has never, ever won an NFL championship, and so I think it will be hard for me to stop rooting for the Vikings to finally achieve that.
I’ve been gone from that area for nearly 40 years and so the hometown hold doesn’t mean that much to me any more. I don’t know what I’ll do. I have some thoughts, but I really don’t know.
by Migrant lurker on Nov 25, 2009 8:02 PM CST up reply actions
Fandom
Intriguing. Not dissing on you for following Favre, he’s a compelling figure, but it’s an interesting phenomena to me. I hadn’t thought too seriously about that sort of fandom, but welcome to the Vikes end of the bench for as long as you like.
A minor correction; the Minnesota Vikings won the NFL Championship in 1969, and NFC Championships in ‘73, ’74, and ’76. We’ve had a bit of a drought since then, admittedly. And of course, we’ve never won a Super Bowl…. Yet. :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Sorry,
I tend to say ‘NFL’ championships to include the years before there was a super-bowl, because it irritates me when people only count Super Bowls. The four (four?) years of the AFL/NFL championship before the merger makes that slightly confusing, but it’s kind of long winded to say ‘an NFL championship except for the years before the merger in which the super bowl champion is considered the champion.’
Or something.
by Migrant lurker on Nov 26, 2009 3:14 AM CST up reply actions
A man who has perspective I will never shove off! Hell I'll hold you on!
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
You don't even have the basic facts correct
The retirement talked well before 3 seasons.
Finding psychological fulfillment from never rooting for any team but the ones you adopted as a child is bad enough, but admiring someone for the same choice speaks to your mentality rather than theirs.
People can root for whoever they want. I just don’t choose to jump ship when things go bad, but with Ted T. & Favre saga it may have been worse than bad. It doesn’t matter how I started liking the Vikings I just explained it because I am close to Deroit and root for 3/4 of their major sport teams here. I don’t root for the Vikes b/c I liked them as a child. It was once I got older and understood the game better. I liked watching Cris Carter, Robert Smith, Moss and to a lesser extent Wade Wilson. The Vikes never won the big one but they were never bad for long and kept me intersted.
I don’t admire somone because they have the same opinion or “choice”, I just like rivalries and sticking to one team adds to that. It’s just my opinion and it does not have to be yours. There is no reason to challenge my mentality.
I guess I cannot imagine the dissappiontment the Green Bay fans feel towards this whole situation and in this case their is no way to 100% know what went on their. Ted T. did unload a lot of veterens when he came in but he had a plan of building for the future. Why didn’t he think having a veteran QB to steady the ship would be a good idea? I guess thats why many Green Bay fans or exfans hate him.
I have questions to Viking fans:
Doesn’t it erk you just slightly that no matter what happend in G.B. these guys are cheering for the Vikes? Isn’t our turn to enjoy Favre after they got 16 seasons out of him? Do I just need to the end of the season to adapt to the idea? Its just weird. I guess so is Favre playing for the Vikes…
Migrant lurker I appreciate your imput as you do seem to have more info on the Ted T. side of things than I have heard. Your intellect allows me to believe those facts could be true. I guess its just draining to hear a guy control the meadia year after year with the will I won’t I retirment talk. Do you really think it was a bad idea to draft Rodgers so that he could learn and come in as Favre was approaching his late 30s? Did Ted try and put doubt into Favre’s mind about his abilities.
Salty – If the retirment talk began well before his last 3 seasons in G.B. that would only lead to believe that Favre had been waivering longer. Is that your way of saying when Ted Thompson came in the retirment talk began?
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
GB
GB could have and should have kept Favre. If they had used the Rodgers draft pick on a running back or receiver, GB would have won another Super Bowl and we would have a completely different circumstances today. GB screwed up by not keeping Favre.
by medicineball on Nov 24, 2009 8:59 AM CST up reply actions
Rodgers wasn’t necessarily going to FA. The question was whether to draft him in the first place. The back and forth for 3 seasons was brought about as much by the organization. It may very well have been almost entirely the org’s doing. If you have some secret, inside information, let it loose.
Using the word patience buys into the story line that is sold by the haters and the PR machine that they’ve honed and developed.
Peyton has three MVPs as well...
and is in the running this year along with Golden Brett. I will say I like our (and by our, of course I mean the Vikes) odd of taking it all the way this year though.
He is absolutely in an ideal situation for him. I will definitely appreciate what we signed on for when the Fabulous Four came to MN. :D
Props to Chester Taylor
Always under-appreciated, but his running game adds a new dimension to our offense, when AD steps out for a few plays…
CT Rocks!
I’d hate to lose him next year, I hope we find a way to keep him and that he wants to stay.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I don't see why we couldn't?
I believe the NFL is having a no-salary cap year next year. I’m not exactly sure what that means, but I think it means that team owners can spend as much money as they want.
It will come down to what other teams offer, and how money hungry Taylor is. If he’s like most people, he’ll be following the guaranteed money.
I think Taylor is in his 6th or 7th season in his career, so he’ll be looking for his $Payday$ after this season. Lets hope Taylor and the Vikes can work something out for both parties.
As crazy as this sounds
I am not sure that the market will be very good for him as far as being a full-time starter is concerned. In his 7 or so seasons, he’s only been named starter once (2006 for us), and never played a full 16 game season as a starter (he was injured in week 14 or so back in 06).
Point is, I don’t think he’ll find a better situation than what he has here. Maybe I’m just being biased, but mostly hopeful that he wont leave.
I know that he’d be an upgrade in Cleveland, Detroit, and probably Oakland right now, but those teams will likely address it in the draft. And does he seem like the type that would take the money and run to those teams?
"We Szekelys have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-Bram Stoker
Quality of Team
I would think that has to play a part in the decision-making process too. Right now the Vikings are something of a marquee team to play on. Harvin could have ended up with a lot of other teams in the NFL but he wanted to play for the Vikings. We had a slew of great RB prospects who came on-board because they wanted to play with AP. Now we have Favre too, and Rice, and the secondary is starting to spark. The Vikings are a great team that’s on the upswing, and they have good character. It’s a winning environment, and people want to be part of something like that, to have that in their lives and to go to work with.
Also, being the RB behind AP is nothing to sneer at, it prolongs the career of both RBs. As long as he’s paid decent money, I think he’d be a fool to leave and go somewhere else where, even it’s a good team, they’re going to squeeze him for everything he’s worth. He’d probably only have a couple good years left in him if he leaves.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Three things stood out, besides Favre
1. Pass protection. It’s ridiculous how much time Favre has to throw the ball. The two sacks he took were missed blocks by McKinnie and Loadholt (I think it was Loadholt). And those missed blocks have been few and far between this season. When defenses blitz to create pressure, Favre kills them.
2. Depth. This is one of the most talented and deep teams I can remember. Asher Allen has been respectable while Winfield has been out, and Tarvaris Jackson looks like 10 games under Brett Favre’s tutelage has done wonders. He looked calm in the pocket, and didn’t get rattled when pressured. Chester Taylor could start on a lot of teams, and the defensive line doesn’t drop off when they rotate folks in and out.
3. Coaching. Yes, coaching. I hated Childress’ version of Tresselball from 2006 until about game three of this season. He has been able to adapt and take advantage of what the defense is doing, and the Vikings are starting to dominate teams.
This is a legitimate Super Bowl team, and I believe they match up well against any team they will face in the post-season, especially once Antoine Winfield returns. They can adjust offensively to whatever defenses throw at them, are better talent-wise at just about every position when compared to the competition, regardless of the opponent.
And we got Favre.
"We're used to Favre-a-palooza now. We're engulfed in Favre-a-palooza. It's not even Favre-a-palooza anymore. He's family now."
--Vikings TE Visanthe Shiancoe, on Brett Favre
...And we got Favre...
Who admitted today, in his post-game interview, that his confidence has been building each game.
Brett Favre… Confidence issues? Yes… one of the reasons he didn’t feel he could play this year was his lack of confidence in himself…
He went on to say that this year his Minnesota teammates have elevated his play – where his receivers have made catches on less than perfect passes, where he’s been able to ‘just hand it off’ to his backfield and keep the game moving forward…
Brett has said ‘this is the best team I’ve played on’… and is quick to compare them to the ‘96 team, but also adds ’they have a long way yet to go’…
This team is talented, has depth, and a will to win… but they need to stay focused and play this year out – One Game At a Time.
We’re 9-1, in control, and ready for the Bears.
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 22, 2009 7:10 PM CST up reply actions
Any QB no matter the level of experience will have those lack of confidence days. Just up to the individual. One could have a Leaf like meltdown and amount to something lower then worm crap or be a QB who watches one of his WR’s get a fractured face, has self doubts, but recovers and guides his team to the Super Bowl. If Favre was having those thoughts, just a normal part of life. Glad he was one of those that recovered and quite well it looks like.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 22, 2009 7:26 PM CST up reply actions
Cutler?
“Any QB no matter the level of experience will have those lack of confidence days. Just up to the individual. One could have a Leaf like meltdown and amount to something lower then worm crap”
"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
Yeah, Cutler and so far he is inching his way towards that Leaf like meltdown, more mentally then physically. Leaf had the physical skills, but a mental case in the extreme. So far, with his blow-up in Denver, and some of the hissy fits in Chicago, one of which he just got fined for, I am wondering if he will go that route as well. Stay tuned folks!
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 22, 2009 10:05 PM CST up reply actions
he sucked again tonite... AT HOME!
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 22, 2009 10:49 PM CST up reply actions
He did escape with only 1 INT, tho one that killed the game. But While not sucking, he was timid and didn’t throw a couple of passes he could have that might have helped them win. I think he is not wanting to risk anything INT wise so you’re going to see him playing skiddish.
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"That is the craziest sonofabitch I ever saw, how many more like him do you think are up there?"
"We have clearance Clearance. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
by VikesFaninNM on Nov 24, 2009 2:15 AM CST up reply actions
Marshall and Royal. Cutler doesn't have them anymore and not Hester, Knox or any of the Bears WRs are as good as the two Broncos.
Cutler also had a better o-line last years and had the least sacks given up by any QB in the league. Even with all that he still threw 18INTs. So with anything less he is due for 20plus picks and with all the Bears gave up to get him they have taken a step back.
Maybe he is still improving, young and adjusting to the new offence. The Bears better hope so.
Bernard, Percy and AP oh my!
Stoked
At one point in the game today, it actually hit me how crazy good our talent on offense is. We talk about it, we say we’re stacked, but holy crap: AD, Sydney, Percy, Chester, Shank, BB…. holy crap! We really have become a ‘pick-your-poison’ offense.
And our D is good enough to keep us in games. I sort of hope we go to NO, just so we can crush them 31-14. They’re offense is incredible, but I honestly think we can beat any team, anywhere.
One Sunday at a time, gang.
GO VIKES!!!!!
Saints are better, so far
The Saints have scored 63 more points than the Vikings.
The Vikings offense has been good, but has not played at the level they are capable of playing. The offense this year is laden with talent, and is capable of playing better. It’s going to take better offense, defense, and special teams to go from second-best in the NFC to the best team in football.
by medicineball on Nov 23, 2009 9:14 AM CST up reply actions
I agree that the Vikings offense can still play better, but I feel that we simply can’t match the Saints offensive scoring because of our emphasis on running the ball. Running the ball and time of possession are still staples in our offensive scheme and perhaps matter less to the Saints (instead, just outscore you).
A thought.
You are correct that the Vikings have not played a full sixty minutes yet, I don’t know about the Saints. I have not had the opportunity to watch enough of them, perhaps they are playing over their heads, perhaps not. I do not know.
Better offense doesn’t necessarily translate directly into point scored. Both teams play different schedules against opponents with different strengths and weaknesses. Different teams have different injuries and match up issues. Not just with the offenses, but with the defenses as well.
I’m just going to wait it out and hope the Vikings prevail in the end.
"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
Not to just argue but;
The Vikings have actually managed to make the best running back in the Universe almost a non-factor. We don’t NEED to run the ball, we choose to force balance down Defense’s throats. We could air it out 50 times a game and, assuming Brett’s arm doesn’t fall off, I’ll take our chances in a shootout with ANY team in the NFL this year. Or the ’07 Pats. Or the ’98 Vikes, for that matter.
This team is sickeningly blessed with Offensive talent.
Not too mention a Defense that could win games on it’s own merit. I am positively giddy this year.
You’re right. I’ve been shocked at times how ineffective we have been at running the ball compared to the past few years. Thankfully, we have Favre to air it out and he has done spectacular.
However, by still running the ball I feel we are keeping defenses honest (to a degree) and consuming the clock. Even if a run goes for little or no gain it still takes time off the clock; I think Childress values time of possession in that way.
Bears lose.
2nd week in a row the game ends with a Cutler pass being intercepted. It’s just a bit sad now, not as much enjoyment from it. :\
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
i disagree
I am still really enjoying watching the disintegration of Cutler. I like his pouting face, it makes me happy.
yes... much to enjoy there!
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 22, 2009 10:50 PM CST up reply actions
Don't get me wrong...I like seeing him lose.
But…ouch! Two game ending interceptions? Painful, painful stuff.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
did ayone see
Devin Hester’s uncensored behind on his last catch of the game? When a replay was shown, the defender had a hold of his pants and unintentionally pulled them down, far. Kind of funny. Then Cutler got caught with his pants down on the next play. ; )
Minnesota Vikings Examiner
visit: http://www.examiner.com/x-1723-Minnesota-Vikings-Examiner
Go Vikes!
The decision seems easy
This game just displays that teams need to pick their poison when facing the Vikings: Concentrate resources on stopping Adrian, and they risk Brett having a big day through the air.
If I were an opposing defensive coordinator, I think the decision is a fairly easy one. If you stack the box to prevent Adrian, Favre will beat you. If you drop back, Adrian only might beat you. I’d rather take the chance on AP than have Favre build an entire MVP run off all the open looks you’re giving him.
Some other good things
The challenge flag.
The Vikings were up 28-3 and had the ball. Jackson had just entered the game. On third down, he scrambled out of the pocket to evade pressure. On the run he flipped a pass to Rice. It was low, but Sidney made an excellent shoe-top catch. The officials ruled it incomplete. Childress threw his challenge flag, and got it overturned.
That was very good because it kept the Vikings’ foot on the Seahawks’ throat, and it kept the drive alive for Jackson and the Vikings to make another drive. Tarvaris Jackson completed the drive with a touchdown pass.
Another nice thing was the play of the defense when the backups started coming in. Abdullah made a great play on a sack of Seneca Wallace. Asher Allen made an interception. The defensive line play of Guion was solid. Jasper Brinkley looked good at linebacker. I think Sanford made a play as a DB. That is the kind of game experience that can help our young backup players develop. While Jimmy Kennedy is still a backup, he is getting a lot of snaps and is playing solid defense.
Good Point
I also noticed how well the backup defense played. I was glad to see Brett rest and Travaris do well but watching a dominate defense get stronger by playing the backups was even more reassuring.
by lifelongvike on Nov 23, 2009 9:47 AM CST up reply actions
NOT their best game...by Far-vre
Was this their best game? HEAvens no! Seattle was TERrible. I have seen college teams that are better then them! Heck..my grandmother in a wheelchair with a colonoscopy bag..would have looked pretty good. Why..they looked like a bunch of beachbums running around..trying to avoid the droppings from a flock of Seahawks..lol. NOW..would I have been disappointed if Favre HADN"T had that kind of day? Heavens YES! Seattle was TERrible!
So yes, Jackson looked ok…on his short tenure. But..again, even I could have had fun out there yesterday..lol.
Now..granted…for a fast approaching AARP candidate..Farve is doing pretty good…has beaten a couple of ok to descent teams…and has pretty much been able to avoid getting clocked on a regular basis. HOWever…are the Vikequeens and Favre all that…and a bag of chips? Wellllll…perhaps a stale bag. We shall see. They need to play the likes of NO and Indy, NE and perhaps Cinci….to really find out.
Yawn
Yeah, no big deal, nothing special. “Stale.” AARP. Avoided being bad. Beat a pro team that isn’t even good enough to be Div IA. Got it.
Sorry, just too tired to rise up to stoke your troll-dom I guess. Especially when it is so transparent.
Aww
puddnhead, I can’t believe you said that, that’s just TERible! :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
and it is a COLOSTOMY bag, toolshed.
thanks for stopping by. now leave.
I piss people off on a fairly regular basis. I cherish my right to speak my mind, whether I sound like an uneducated savage or not. I've never been accused of keeping what I think a secret, nor will I ever. Don't like it? I don't care.
by IABerserker1 on Nov 23, 2009 11:03 PM CST up reply actions
Mr. Tarkenton,
Glad to meet you.
"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
Reunite Tebow with Harvin!
Anyone else feeling that urge? If not, how much would Michael Vick and Adrian Peterson in the same backfield scare people? Look at what Young and Johnson are doing in Ten and extrapolate that… ;)
we already have a fullback
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Nov 24, 2009 8:01 AM CST up reply actions
Always nice to hear:
From TwinCities.com
- This season, the injury-ravaged Seahawks have faced the still-undefeated Colts, the defending NFC champion Arizona Cardinals and Dallas Cowboys (7-3), among other teams.
“This is the most complete team we have faced,” Mora said. “By far.”
Kinda makes me feel all warm and fuzzy. Watch out N’awlins! Who Dat? No really, who dat… it’s hard to see you through the Berserker bearskins. Skol!
Being a realist....
I am a die-hard Vikings fan. But I am also a realist when it comes to thinking how the games we have played and also the games we are about to play. I have a bunch of things that I would like to say, but I don’t want this to be a super-long post.
So I am going to try to limit this as much as possible.
I have read every article I can possible during the week & weekends about the Vikings. Whether it be, ESPN, Yahoo, Star Tribune, or even here. I try to read all the comments as well.
With that being said.. Everyone is “assuming” that the NFC Championship will come down between the Saints & the Vikings.. That may not be true.. As much as most of us would believe to hope it to be true, it may not happen.
I think both teams have their own flaws.. And from what I have watched, I have seen the Vikings improve really well.
But the realist part of me kicks in and reminds me of certain things.
We slightly slaughtered a team with numeorus inuries that was already with a 3-6 record. I was impressed with the 4 yards total rushing. I was impressed w/ their 1-10 3rd down conversion %, I was impressed how even T. Jack showed up in the 4th quarter and got a 144 qb rating going 6 for 8 w/ 1 TD pass for like some 22 yards.
Most games, I haven’t always been so impressed. (I.E., winning a game, because the opposing team misses a field goal) Sometimes our defenses decides to collapse, and that’s not good. I’ve seen much improvement, but they are against teams with losing records. I predict we’ll have an extremely successful season. Possibly 15-1.
Only two teams really scare me.. Bengals (who can have their own bad games, but hey! at least its a home game…) and the Cardinals.. Who are great at winning on the road, but have had some bad games at home.
Nice thing overall playing these two teams, we’ll have had all season to prepare for games like this. They will be a true test. Bengals beat out the Steelers twice (away/home)
NO Saints. They were 8-8 as of last year, and going undefeated as of now. Great & huge improvement. Will they go undeated? Doubtful.. I think they’re first loss lands on Monday night versus the Patriots. Both have high-scoring offenses, but I believe that the defense will prevail for the Patriots. The Saints have had to have come-backs from teams that are not the best. They most definately remind me of the 1998 Vikings. Light up the scoreboard with points, but also allow the opposing offense to keep within reach.
When we compare the two teams.. I think that the offense is possibly a tad bit better at putting points in the board. But than again, consider this… The Vikings, when they have a huge lead like that, do not need to continue putting up points on the board. I mean, come on.. If Favre wanted a 40 point game vs. the Seahawks, he could of continued to play & maybe make it a 50 pt. game. But the Saints seem to have to keep putting points on the board to stay ahead and keep a comfortable lead.
Their defense is weaker than ours. Problems that scare me are that they are a high-passing team. they rely on the pass.. We’ll have to put a lot of pressure on them and hope for sacks, forced fumbles, and for Brees to make quick decisions (causing throw-away passes & possible interceptions) I think the Vikings will do a great time at clock management by doing short passes and runs and slowly crawling across the field.
This may be the Saints lowest scoring game (if it happens) Why? The Vikings will be great offensively just as much as the Saints, but the Vikings will hold onto the ball offensively more often. This will give the Saints less frequent offensive possessions.
I am not to aware of the defensive line by the Saints, so I do not know how well AP will go up against them. But we have an explosive offense that can hardly be prepared for. If needed, we can put up 40 points a game, but the question in the end will be, can our defense stop the offense of NO Saints?
Pats & Colts seemed really close in relation of their ball game & season. Pats nearly took out the Colts, but gambled, and lost on their gamble. Going on 4th? No trust in that defense… This is definately the sort of scary move I hope we don’t see ourselve put into… I trust our defense, so I hope our coaching staff does as well.. if need be, punt the damn ball. :)
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