So, About That Whole Brad Childress/Brett Favre Thing
by Christopher Gates on Dec 23, 2009 12:15 PM CST
in Vikings 2009 Season
82 comments
Well, when we last left Coronation Street. . .er, the Minnesota Vikings. . .the Beloved Purple were in the process of losing 26-7 to the Carolina Panthers on Sunday Night Football, Brad Childress was considering pulling Brett Favre out of the game when the Vikings had a 7-6 lead, Bryant McKinnie was getting benched for being unable to block Julius Peppers, and Steve Smith was pimp-slapping anything in a purple uniform that got in his general vicinity. Apparently, all of this is cause to panic in Minnesota, declare them to be one-and-done in the NFC playoffs, and make the Earth stop rotating on its axis the way it has since the beginning of time.
Clearly, the focus of the national media this week has been on the schism. . .thank you, Adam Schefter. . .between Favre and Childress. And while those media types are in the process of falling all over themselves in a race to be the first people to write the Minnesota Vikings off, my thoughts on the matter are a little bit different. Honestly, I can sum them up in four little words.
Who. . .the heck. . .cares?
See, what's great about this entire situation, in my opinion, is the fact that the entire world seems to be under the impression that this is the first time in the long, illustrious history of the National Football League that a quarterback and his head coach have had a disagreement over something. Am I the only one that thinks that such an assertion is just mind-numbingly stupid? For crying out loud, there are instances of players going off on coaches almost every week in the National Football League for some reason or another. The big difference is that, in many cases, most of those things aren't even brought up once the final whistle sounds and the teams head to the locker room.
But in the case of Brett Favre, Brad Childress, and the Minnesota Vikings, it's Wednesday afternoon, and we're still listening to questions and reading stories about this garbage. And it's not terribly surprising, to be honest. After all, there are a lot of people that have waited all season long for this to happen.
Anyone remember the pre-season hype surrounding the NFC North this year? About how Jay Cutler was set to be the second coming of Christ in Chicago? Or how the Green Bay Packers were the choice to represent the NFC in Super Bowl XLIV because they put together the OMG GREATEST PRE-SEASON EVER? How the Vikings were basically an afterthought because Favre was too old and couldn't get the job done any more?
Let's see. . .wrong. Wrong. And. . .wrong.
The extent to which this has been blown completely out of proportion by the media is nothing short of incredible. For crying out loud, this is an 11-3 football team, and apparently their head coach and their quarterback hate each other or something. I'm not sure if I even have the words for how ridiculous that sounds.
There's a reason the Minnesota Vikings are an 11-3 football team. There's a reason that they're still, despite two relatively ugly losses in their past three games, in the driver's seat and controlling their destiny for a first-round bye in the NFC playoffs. And that's because whatever it is that Favre and Childress have done through the first 14 games of the year. . .it's working. And, for the most part, it's been working pretty darn well. Teams don't get to 11-3 by accident. Fans of opposing teams may think that that's the case, but really. . .who cares what Packer fans or Bear fans or fans of any other team think of the Minnesota Vikings? Or what the national media thinks of the Minnesota Vikings? These are the same people that gave Minnesota zero chance to do anything in 2009, and the same people who will look for any excuse to write them off now.
It's two days before Christmas, and the Minnesota Vikings are 11-3. They've already locked up their second consecutive NFC North championship. They have a great chance to have a first-round bye in the NFC playoffs. And all anyone wants to talk about is some manufactured controversy between Brad Childress and Brett Favre. Good. Let them talk. I don't care. We've seen what this team is capable of, and they already have an invitation to the NFL's post-season party. And, as the Arizona Cardinals showed us last year, what you do leading up to the party isn't nearly as important as what you do after you get there.
I know I'm not terribly worried. I'll worry when there's reason to worry, and not one minute sooner.
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Agreed
I wouldn’t be surprised if it was all a huge joke perpetrated on the media to give the Vikes a smokescreen to hide behind while planning for the rest of the season…
I mean, seriously…a team loses a game that doesn’t really matter to a team that won’t even make the playoffs, and we already clinched the division. And people start freaking out.
Sigh...
Maybe people have overreacted.. But I have no faith in a coach that even THINKS about pulling a HOF QB having maybe the best season of his life.. For an 11-2 team! And for the fact that he’s thought of doing this multiple times…
It’s outrageous in my opinion. Not to mention he can’t make simple in-game adjustments. Perhaps run to the left a few times, send Kleinsasser double-team Peppers, etc, etc. He won’t let Favre call audibles when he knows the offense as well as he does. Simply does not adjust a gameplan to his players strengths.
Bottom line is that Chilly has a bigger ego than any coach in the NFL. He has butted heads with every veteran QB he’s had.
I hate to sound panicky considering we are an 11-3 team, but I feel like if we are going to go anywhere it will be despite the bald one. We have an amazing group of players and the most talent in the league. I hope it doesn’t go to waste.
by PurplePeopleEaters on Dec 23, 2009 12:28 PM CST reply actions
I'm not sure though
“But I have no faith in a coach that even THINKS about pulling a HOF QB having maybe the best season of his life.. For an 11-2 team! And for the fact that he’s thought of doing this multiple times…”
If you put it that way, I guess it sounds ridiculous that childress would pull him. But if Favre is audibling at bad times and not running offense how childress wants it run, then you have to rethink that a little. I’ve said this like 10 times on TDN lately: Favre is certainly allowed to audible throughout the game. But this is about very specific, situational audibles. No player should be in the position to call a deep pass on 3rd and 10 when the coach wants to run the clock. THAT is ridiculous, folks. Hall of Famer or not, he is a player, Childress is the coach.
Dan Wetzel at Yahoo! puts it best: “Favre’s intentions have always been easy to identify. He wants individual glory wrapped in team success. When it works, it really works. When it doesn’t, everything blows up.” Throwing a bomb to Berrian instead of running 35 seconds off the block against Green Bay was a perfect example of individual glory wrapped in team success. Brett first, then vikings.
I'm not seeing anything...
…that really supports your contention, to be honest. You can interpret anything a player does to be for “personal glory.” I’ve never really bought into the mindset that Favre’s a glory-hound anymore than any other player.
Wow
But I have no faith in a coach that even THINKS about pulling a HOF QB having maybe the best season of his life
You also have no faith in that same head coach that:
• Brought Favre here, pretty much single-handedly by reaching out to him when after he gave a resounding “NO” to him just a few weeks earlier.
• Drafted Peterson and Harvin, and somehow managed to weasel Allen out of K.C.
• Has consistently improved the record of the team.
• Has won 2 division titles back-to-back.
I guess I would suggest a cold beer, perhaps a massage, and just relax. The guy isn’t all that bad. Everybody has their flaws, but to declare no faith in a guy who has done a lot for this team seems a bit unreasonable.
Hmmmm
Isn’t that the job of Head of Player Personnel, and Head of Scouting, Spielman and Studwell. I think you are giving him a lot of credit that he isn’t deserving. Lets not forget about, the guy who is keeping the salary cap manipulated correctly so all of this can happen, Brzezinski. Or the guy who has put that team together Zigi Wilf!
by SupaFan on Dec 23, 2009 2:22 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Good lord!
Thanks for brining up Brzezinski. I can’t believe I’d forgotten his name. He’s made quite the transition from the cheapskate days of McCombs to the free-spending Wilfs.
I’ve been shouting Spielman and Studwell’s names from the rooftops to all the drones that keep trying to claim that Childress is the Alpha and Omega of the Vikings organization. Because apparently coaches don’t actually have to coach, they just write up contracts and scout college teams all day. Heck Chilly probably came to work in his carpenter pants with a pocket full of nails when they renovated Winter Park because it’s all Chilly all the time over there.
A good coach makes his team better, he doesn’t wait for a better team to make him look good.
Lets hold off on Spielman & Studwell
Uh…before you go giving Spielman & Studwell too much credit dont forget that they …
1. traded up to pick Tyrell Johnson when DeSean Jackson was sitting there
2. traded up to pick John David Booty in the same draft
3. picked Letroy “can I suit up this game please” Guion, Jaymar “practice squad” Johnson, & John Sullivan all in the same draft.
Sullivan may turn out OK but the rest are on the verge of getting cut or benched in the case of Tyrell with the cut coming probably a couple of years later. All I can say about Tyrell is that I will not put down any money that he gets a second contract from the Vikings at his current rate. I still have hope though.
They did trade for Allen in this draft so you can give them credit for that but the rest of the picks were not very good IMO.
Drafting Harvin & Loadholt was easy. Allen, Brinkley, & Sanford all appear to be really good late round picks. I think they are decent thus far with some potential but it was more a testament to the piss poor depth on our team that a 5th & 7th round pick can make the team.
You're right
Not every draft pick has been a grand slam home run so they should all be fired. And of course those that were home runs, well those were easy and don’t count. Got it.
Tell me, does anyone ever do anything well in your world?
A good coach makes his team better, he doesn’t wait for a better team to make him look good.
So let's see...
You’re calling out the front office for not drafting DeSean Jackson when they went out and signed Bernard Berrian to a big free agent contract, and you’re griping about the production of two fifth rounders and a sixth rounder? That’s your complaint? Really?
"We're used to Favre-a-palooza now. We're engulfed in Favre-a-palooza. It's not even Favre-a-palooza anymore. He's family now."
--Vikings TE Visanthe Shiancoe, on Brett Favre
by Ted Glover on Dec 24, 2009 9:38 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Right
Chilly has nothing to do with any of those things — whatsoever. Some of the people who are fans on this site are worse than some of the worst critics in the media.
Seriously..
His main job is coaching(which I think he’s terrible at), and he only has a 1/3 of the say in personnel decisions.
And Mark, you can look at ANY team in the NFL and I guarantee they have made bad draft choices. Hell, more players turn out to be busts than good players. The Vikings have not made a lot of bad choices with Spielman and Studwell around.
by PurplePeopleEaters on Dec 24, 2009 1:58 AM CST up reply actions
for gods sake
look at the bears drafts the last 6 years…… woof…..
I piss people off on a fairly regular basis. I cherish my right to speak my mind, whether I sound like an uneducated savage or not. I've never been accused of keeping what I think a secret, nor will I ever. Don't like it? I don't care.
by IABerserker1 on Dec 24, 2009 7:12 PM CST up reply actions
Prior to the season...
I said the addition of Brett Favre would get us to the play-offs, but leave us one and done when we got there. The Panthers game and QB/HC spat don’t prove or disprove what I said then, but it does make me uncomfortable.
The reasons for my pessimism were due to the end of season slumps that Brett Favre has (and I mean in terms of his QB rating, not the win/loss record of the team he was with. Teams can win despite having a bad QB as the Browns proved in a game this year that Derek Anderson was appalling in). I don’t know if that is happening this time (or at least I don’t think it is simply a matter of age), to me it seems that he is struggling outside in the cold. That might be the real reason for the late season wobbles he has had in which case securing the number 2 seed is vital. That won’t be easy if the cold is the issue with a game coming up in Chicago, and a Giants team that will probably need to win their game against us in the Metrodome to even have a play-off run.
My other concern is about the coaching staff – we never seem to make adjustments. We have a Plan A which relies on our roster executing basic plays continually, but if that gets stopped, we don’t have a Plan B. People point to the improving record, and compare it to Tice, but Childress has an owner that has backed him in spending money. With have improved our roster every year, but I don’t believe that we have the creative talent on our coaching staff that can take it to the next level.
Between those two points is why the argument makes me cautious – is Brett floundering (his QB rating for the past few games hasn’t been overwhelming), or are we going back to the flat play-calling that has troubled us for the past few years? The former would motivate Chilli’s decision to bench him, whilst the latter would explain why Favre was so reluctant to stop calling audibles.
As for the press conference, don’t believe a word necessarily. The worst thing you can get as a soccer coach in the EPL is a vote of confidence from the chairman – it usually means they’re in the process of finding your replacement. Sports team use press conferences to manage how a dispute is presented. If the club wanted the story gone, the best they could hope for is to claim the rift had healed and hope the media buys it. It might be gone. It might not. We won’t know until the season is done.
Something I will say here though is that even if we do flame out down the stretch, the acquisition of Favre is not without it’s positives. I believe his presence has done a great deal for our wideouts and tight-ends, and maybe even for Loadholt and Sullivan on the O-line. Even if he retires at the end of the year, we’ll be in a better position for having had him around in terms of what parts of our offence are capable of. I figured we’re drafting a QB in the first round or two this year regardless of what Favre decides to do
by ViolentSilence on Dec 24, 2009 11:40 AM CST up reply actions
Well said
Very good point about being better off with Favre here, even if we don’t win a SB and he retires. Rice and Harvin have both said they’ve learned a ton from him and it shows. If nothing else I’ve really enjoyed watching the way he plays when he’s on our side and not on the other.
A good coach makes his team better, he doesn’t wait for a better team to make him look good.
“My other concern is about the coaching staff – we never seem to make adjustments. We have a Plan A which relies on our roster executing basic plays continually, but if that gets stopped, we don’t have a Plan B. "
My thoughts exactly.
You make a lot of sense. Great post.
by PurplePeopleEaters on Dec 24, 2009 4:09 PM CST up reply actions
Regardless of winning the NFC North...
The team wants to peak late in the year. You mention the Arizona Cardinals last year; yeah, they were, what? 9-7? They got hot right at the end of the year and blasted their way into the Super Bowl. I’m afraid the Vikings peaked too early. Teams like the Chargers and Eagles are doing it right. They started slow and are on a roll now.
Obviously, you want to win every game, that’s a given, and a loss here or there isn’t anything, but the overall vibe I’ve gotten from the Vikings during their Sunday Night games is a big “Uh-oh.”
The Vikings have to win their last two to guarantee a first round bye; if they tie with the Eagles, the Eagles get the second seed. I hope they can do it, rest up, and come out ready for the first game, ‘cause right now I’m not hitting the panic button, but I’m a little nervous about how this team is going to finish out.
Visit:
http://www.vikingvigil.com
Skol Vikings!
Woot Woot!
cardinals got hot right at the end of last year? they lost 35-14 to the vikings in week 15 and 47-7 to the patriots in week 16 and lost 4 of their last 6 regular season games
Hm, good point.
Even so, they caught fire in the playoffs. Perhaps they are more of an anamoly than I first thought.
I still think the Vikings may have peaked a little too early. Just a little nervous is all.
Visit:
http://www.vikingvigil.com
Skol Vikings!
Woot Woot!
First of all lets all settle down a little
The thing that I have not heard any one say yet is that these are grown men of high caliber that are superior in ability to 99.x% of the population. Just the simple fact that they are able to play/coach in the NFL says allot about them, not to mention that they have some how managed to be at the top in performance of of all other NFL caliber people. This means that they are the best of the best, should we not expect them to continue to perform as if they are the best of the best. To me this does not mean being perfect but it means dealing with adversity in a superior manner so as to continue with their best of the best ways.
by just another viking on Dec 23, 2009 12:46 PM CST reply actions
Great
another schism gate
From the only TRUE North division
by thewild_viking_twins on Dec 23, 2009 1:17 PM CST reply actions
I am, indeed
and I can’t help but notice that hardly anybody here ever says anything substantial about football, or what goes on on the field.
Well there is only so much to say.
And it is a blog. You’ll find gems in the rough usually they aren’t hard to find, but a lot of people come here to discuss the Vikes and… to vent… or rejoice as the case may be.
Are you serious?
Check a game thread. Check all the analysis. What are you talking about?
Obviously, things are going to be discussed about what’s happening with the team off the field as well. It’s about the Minnesota Vikings organization, not just the 11 guys who happen to be on the field at one time, knowwhutImean Vern?
Visit:
http://www.vikingvigil.com
Skol Vikings!
Woot Woot!
Okay, let’s indulge.
The field in Charlotte was a piece of crap. They probably should have put longer cleats on Favre and Peterson to begin the game, but that increases the risk of injuries on the solid parts of the field. It’s harder to kick field goals on a field that is poorly maintained, but these shoddy sod tricks are what teams with a losing record have to try using. It’s harder to cut on your pass routes and get open when you haven’t memorized where the next wetland has been installed. If you think field goal kickers love crappy sod, think again. This was the first encounter with bad weather. A lot of car wrecks happen with the first snow. That does not mean we’ll all be dead by spring.
Substantially, McKinnie can’t block Julius Peppers and needs help. but the plan was likely to use the tight ends to open up the passing game, as indicated by the early passes to Kliensasser. Peterson is improving as a passing blocker, but that is not his strong suit. The best laid plans of mice and men often go to hell, but it sounds better in Gaelic.
At the end of the week, every Viking had played well enough this season to get and extra 21 grand for winning the division. The idea of peaking is often a concept for people who like cliches. Maybe Harvin’s migraines are peaking at the right time, rather that during the playoffs. It’s not like anyone is spouting explanation of why the Vikings would be in a steady decline. The only guy buying into the idea that the Vikings have peaked in the recent NFL Network discussion was Jason La Canfora, and that twit dislikes the Vikings, even if only because he picked the Pack to win the NFC North this year. There is nothing wearing out in Favre’s arm. The pick in the end was due to his arm being hit as he threw. Henderson being lost for the season is something that needs the team to adapt but injuries are inevitable in football. Brinkley was drafted for the very reason that Henderson was lost last year. He has the talent to stop the run, and Leslie Frazier is smart enough to cover up the rest with what was experienced in 2008. This is not Hee Haw. Hold the gloom and dispair.
On the road, it is advisable to score early and demoralize the crowd. That did not happen. Sure, letting the Panthers get a shot to vent their frustration at thier season was a bad idea. People are human and prone to error. Perfection is unobtainable, and thinking you’ve done it only makes you fret about losing some champaign that you’ve stashed away. Losing did not kill either the Vikings or Saints chances this week, not are they opening any champaign in Indy yet.
People who dislike the Vikings for personal reasons or who are struggling to save their dying sports rag write stories that are as accurate as the original ones about ballon boy, and for their own purposes, not to educate the masses.
If Chilly were really trying to get Favre fired up rather than take him out of the game, he wouldn’t announce that on TV, would he? Childress majored in psych in college. Only the local newspaper ninnies seem to be oblivious that there might be a method to Chilly’s madness, but they’re only mad because he doesn’t make their jobs as easy for them as well as Mike Tice did.
People have biorhythms. Things go up and down in cycles. It is not important to peak in December when you have already locked up your division. It is important to peak in January and February, when big cash prizes are passed out.
I like you, elgar
I see what you are saying about being the Vikings ‘decline.’ And I think you can apply your thoughts on ‘peaking’ to ‘declining’: It’s all phooey. The main thing everybody needs to know about ‘peaking’ is that anybody who is talking about it now is about a month early. As for declines…every week in the NFL we see teams play against trends, momentum, etc. The steelers are in just as good a spot as any other 7-7 team in the afc, regardless of how they got there.
So we don’t need to worry about peaking or declines. What we do need to worry about are some fundamental issues with the Vikings that could have been discussed three, five, or seven weeks ago. Our defense simply does not have the same attitude or discipline as it has in recent years. Gap discipline and containment has gone out the window. Tackling, don’t even get me started. If you had asked me in December 2008 who the best tackling team in the NFL was, I would have said Minnesota. A year later, with almost the same guys, we are basically among the worst in a league full of bad-tackling teams. Our nosy, over-pursuing ways start with Jared Allen, then goes in a line back to greenway, then tyrell johnson, then m williams. We might as well still have sharper back there missing tackles and jumping pump fakes. These are real concerns, and these are simple reasons why we could lose a playoff game pretty easily.
On offense, I think we just struggle to find a rhythm at times. I think in almost every game we have gone entire quarters where the offense struggles. But usually something comes together, and we have had entire quarters where we look unstoppable. I think the play calling could be to blame, and sometimes this year we have passed way too much.
And, of course, now some injuries have crept in. losing Winfield hurt a lot, but we did a good job of covering for him. Henderson cannot be replaced on this roster midseason.
One of my favorite sayings is Mason Williams’ “Talent is a cheap trick.”
In a team sport, all the players need to do their thing, even if no one in the stands notices or understands what that is.
A tokomak reactor won’t work without the wild energy of plasma, but it also won’t work unless the plasma is controlled so that it does not hit the wall. In football, you need a balance of playing with what Paul Brown called ‘reckless abandon’ and yet be fundamentally sound, covering your entire assignment with balance. (Nailing one opposing player while letting another steal your lunch won’t cut it.)
The parts of a team might go unnoticed, especially its strategy which is ofte nkept secret. You might be a human being somewhat unfortunately finding yourself perfectly suited to running a non-existent race called the three-quarter mile. You can never win the mile directly, because you have no kick at that distance, but you can win the mile indirectly by burning out the competition with your early pace, allowing your teammate, who sticks to his best pace by design, to finish well.
Similarly, in football, your defense can play at a certain pace for a certain length of time. If you exceed that length, you lose momentum, and bad things happen.
In the sixties, fuel injection was hot, but you needed a mechanic in your trunk to keep it in balance, and the trunk of a Corvette was not big enough to hold that guy inside it. Sometimes it would run great, then later, it would sputter. Now computers do that job of keeping things in balance. Once you have all the pieces of a solution and configure them properly, the thing runs like the wind.
Refine your technique. Refine your timing. Don’t let other people get in your head. Practice; practice; practice. Good things will happen.
Sean Payton wins because he has a plan for just about anything ahead of time and the talent in players to pull it off. Talent is a cheap trick. Sometimes, though, more goes wrong that we can fix in sixty minutes.
He who fights and runs away lives to fight another day. Keep the eyes on the prize.
cali viking
tukerbjt if ur not a vikings fan get the f off revenge is right favre will lead the vikes to the super bowl and win dont b a hater this team will over come and it starts with da bears favre and A.P will have huge games on monday then back to normal rolling up teams. peace
I want them to hate us
I want them to hate the Vikings. I want them to screech in pain as the Vikings hoist the Lombardi trophy.
That would be ideal
If the Vikings were to win the Super Bowl, I have no doubt that they’d be the least heralded, least covered champions in NFL history.
The Daily Norseman - The greatest Vikings' site on the Internet!
by Christopher Gates on Dec 23, 2009 1:49 PM CST up reply actions
Reality Shows and TMZ
The entire episode has been over-blown and over-hyped by the media. ESPN spends more time on the Adam Schefter stories, driven by a mindset more in tune with the latest celebrity gossip mill than pro football.
Disagreements between quarterbacks and coaches are as old as pro football itself; they just have not gotten the media hype that we have seen over the past decade. Did Mike Ditka and Jim McMahon ever disagree? How about Terry Bradshaw and Chuck Noll? Was Johnny Unitas ever reluctant to come out of a game in which he was not playing up to his normal performance levels?
This is nothing and will not have an impact on anything. After the Vikings kick the Bears into next season on Monday night, the talking heads at ESPN will be falling all over themselves to proclaim the Vikings Superbowl favorites.
Yes best to calm down (I did finally)
These guys will show us something on Monday….many reasons, but they have their own personal pride to play for….
I would rather be IN the Arena than watching from the stands...That is my life!
* Read Teddy Roosevelt's "Man in the Arena" if you need further explanation...
by vikingfanfrom afar on Dec 23, 2009 2:19 PM CST reply actions
Do not look at the man behind the curtain!
To say this is a non-story is non-sensical on several different levels.
It’s true that it could very well turn out to be nothing. A quick talk between players and coaches could resolve everything quickly. But Favre and Childress are both known to be pretty stubborn people, and if they don’t work through it and get the team on the same page, it MIGHT derail the season.
I’ll guarantee this isn’t the first coach quarterback spat. I’ll also guarantee many of those conflicts have hurt those teams. And it might even be argued some of those conflicts have helped teams to air out the dirty laundry and regroup. The 2006 Giants were considered a team in disarray with players speaking out against either the quarterback, the coach or both. Tiki Barber retired believing the team to be a lost cause and Michael Strahan planned to do the same. The rumors continued into 2007 and when the Vikings came in and handed Eli Manning his ass on November 25, the finger pointing started and a lot of people said Coughlin had lost the locker room and Manning should be shipped back to San Diego. Does everyone remember how that season ended? If not you can ask Randy Moss next time you see him.
That’s why this is an interesting story. Favre and Childress have become strong personalities in the league, we are a Super Bowl threat, and this could affect the playoffs in a lot of different ways. It’s a great motivational story about the Vikings over coming adversity if they win, or salacious grist for the rumor mill and sports talkers everywhere if they lose before then.
To say we shouldn’t be worried about it, or that it’s a non story is absurd. If we weren’t going to talk about stories that affect our team why would this website exist?
A good coach makes his team better, he doesn’t wait for a better team to make him look good.
Avoiding the Drama
I’m trying to keep a positive outlook on this Vikings season, which isn’t easy when I think of Julius Peppers getting a sack when the Panthers rushed three, or Matt Moore (??) picking the Minnesota secondary apart.
If Chilly has indeed been going nuts on the sideline every time Favre audibles to a pass all season, no one, myself included, was complaining about it when the Vikings were 10-1.
As for McKinnie’s putrid performance, I am hoping it is some short-term injury, health issue, or off-field problem that ia ailing him, and it will be fixed in time for the playoffs.
More generally, I’m not getting sucked in to the Chilly/Favre/Vikings-“collapse” drama until the playoffs start. As I recall, the 1998 Vikings went in to the playoffs with a full head of steam, and look how that turned out.
by Midnight Rambler on Dec 23, 2009 2:50 PM CST reply actions
+1960
On the Coronation street reference. sigh brings back fond memories of studying abroad in Manchester and watching it as a Cultural study.
I miss Manchester.
We are the vikings.......resistance is futile.
I guess...
… Corrie is not exactly common viewing in the States then?… Shocked me to see it mentioned, I thought I was safe from seeing it talked about here!!
(Nothing will put you off a show faster than your mum being a huge fan…)
by ViolentSilence on Dec 24, 2009 11:42 AM CST up reply actions
resolved
they both had there pres conf. today and said it was a dead issue and leave it at that but the media kept fishing trying to get more that’s why it’s a story he has talked to brett numerous times since the so-called incident and he said it happens all the time with all players they both played it off but even favre said this offense starts and ends with ap.so why can’t everyone else let it go
christmas for Packer fans?
I just want to say all of these threads are eye candy for us Packer fans!
WOOOO!!
Enjoy the interceptions!
Enjoy the Ban, troll.
How do our Viking asses smell? You must get quite familiar with them looking up at us in the division the past two years.
by Jepp The Viking on Dec 23, 2009 4:51 PM CST up reply actions
And might I add
That is quite a lovely picture of your wife for your icon.
by Jepp The Viking on Dec 23, 2009 4:53 PM CST up reply actions
lol, at least she's pretty?
I piss people off on a fairly regular basis. I cherish my right to speak my mind, whether I sound like an uneducated savage or not. I've never been accused of keeping what I think a secret, nor will I ever. Don't like it? I don't care.
by IABerserker1 on Dec 24, 2009 7:28 PM CST up reply actions
How many interceptions
Did Santa Favre give the Packers this year?
What’s that you say? None?
Oh. . .that’s probably why the Vikings pimp-slapped your “awesome” team twice in front of a nationwide TV audience.
Enjoy your last home game of the year this Sunday. Vikings fans know that we have one after the season finale.
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by Christopher Gates on Dec 23, 2009 5:10 PM CST up reply actions
cali viking
first hope u make the play offs then pray u dont play us a third time favre wont go easy on u this time that would suck getting ur asses handed to u 3 times with ur fantasy team qb
FAVRE, CHILLDRESS NOT THE CONCERN!
nice post gonzo, My two concerns are 1 can our offense match up with physical playoff caliber defense’s, 2 can our defense match up against balanced playoff caliber offense’s like, the EAGLES,CARDINALS,COWBOYS,SAINTS , GIANTS, I DO NOT FEEL ANY CONCERN ABOUT THE OTHER POSSIBLE NFC TEAM ,BECAUSE WE ALREADY WHIPPED THEIR TAILS TWICE .SO STUFF THAT IN YOUR STOCKING PACKER TROLL’S.
Hey guys…just came over from Dawgs By Nature to ask a favor…Can you PLEASE call ESPN and YahooSports and tell them that this whole Favre/Childress thing is really not that big of a deal?! Jesus, OVER and OVER and OVER…Childress wanted to take Favre out. Favre didn’t want to come out. They discuss. Favre didn’t come out. There. End of story.
Do they really think, regardless of whether they ‘like’ each other or not it’s really gonna make any goddamn difference come playoff time? (sigh).
Like they're going to listen to us
If the Vikings weren’t going to be on ESPN Monday night, I doubt this would be that much of an issue at all.
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by Christopher Gates on Dec 23, 2009 6:49 PM CST up reply actions
Annnnnd ESPN beats the dead horse
Trying to see if there is any ‘hidden meaning’ or ‘reading between the lines’ in what Childress or Favre said at their respective press conferences.
The only hidden metaphor was Werder standing out in the cold getting snowed on during his live remote. Which kind of sums it all up for me.
"We're used to Favre-a-palooza now. We're engulfed in Favre-a-palooza. It's not even Favre-a-palooza anymore. He's family now."
--Vikings TE Visanthe Shiancoe, on Brett Favre
Breaking Down the Game and Problems!
1. The field conditions are without an advantage to the other team. The Vikings, being a dome team lost a lot of their timing due to the field…and the conditions on the field. This advantage went to the home team.
2. The Vikings are already without Henderson on defense. Why they broke down as badly as they did needs to be addressed. They held well in the first half, but then did like they have done many games this season…rolled over in the second half. Unfortunately, the offense didn’t pick itup.
3. Peppers continuous assault on Favre was something that could have been controlled by getting the full-back on a permanent Julius Peppers mugging operation. The tackle wasn’t handling him, and wasn’t ever going to handle him on that field or maybe any field. There’s no way Brett could step up confidently in the pocket and play pick apart the defense knowing that Julius wasn’t being handled. You can’t fault Brett for any bad numbers…and they weren’t that bad.
4. The confidence of a quarterback is crucial to the success of the team. Even though Childress may have had good intentions and was trying to keep Brett safe, but see above for better solutions.
5. Also, with the running game completely stalled, the defense was just teeing off on the Minnesota line and Favre. That is something that needs to be addressed.
Now the good. The Vikings will be hosting their first and hopefully further playoff games. If they can stay in doors in Minneapolis, their chances go way up. The timing, the crowd, the footing all play in their favor.
If Percy can get healthy and get some practice in, Brett will be throwing him the ball. He is a big playmaker and needs to see the ball. Also, the Vikings did something right the other day that they need to repeat. They got the ball to Peterson in the flats with some running room. They need to use him and Taylor more in first and second down situations. Oh, my…am I talking West Coast offense here. I am.
Getting ahead early can be done by the run, but passing when they are expecting run is one of those things that can really help a team. And using the screen a little more often will definitely get Peterson more opportunities to touch the ball without 8 guys in his face and an offensive line that isn’t doing the job it was doing a few weeks ago.
Lastly, I totally agree with the article. So what. Winning teams rarely argue, but the minute a team loses or loses more than once, everyone starts second guess and making mountains of mole hills. Remember folks, there will only be one playoff team that ends the season with a win. Everyone else goes home losers. But, that doesn’t mean they didn’t have a successful season. I really like what the Vikings have done this season and no matter what happens, getting Favre in here was the best thing that could have ever happened to this team. Brilliant!
Childress is the Problem
We all remember what the Vikings offense was like, last season. This season, Brett Favre was added and the offense began to flourish as Brett got more and more freedom to audible and improvise. Now, suddenly, Childress wants to take back control of “his” offense. In other words, go back to how it was last season. Big mistake, and we can see the result. If the Vikings lose the first playoff game, again, it will be Childress’ fault.
Great post Gonzo
I’m not even a Vikings fan and I get sick at reading/hearing/watching stuff that the national media has been spewing.
This is a very good team who fell flat in 2 of their 14 games. Luckily for you, all will be righted with your upcoming date with Jay Cutler who is trying his best to make it to 30 interceptions this year….and I wish him well in his goal.
Johnnie Morton: The Man. The Myth. The Legend.
by craig in calgary on Dec 23, 2009 6:40 PM CST reply actions
i like the things you say....
they make me happy!
I piss people off on a fairly regular basis. I cherish my right to speak my mind, whether I sound like an uneducated savage or not. I've never been accused of keeping what I think a secret, nor will I ever. Don't like it? I don't care.
by IABerserker1 on Dec 24, 2009 7:30 PM CST up reply actions
EVERYBODY CALM DOWN
1. chilly need to be a real head coach.
2. You do not take a starting QB when we are leading. Not say he is the one of the best QB ever to play the game. “CHILLY YOU JUST DON’T DO THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
A QB need confidence we are lucky it is Favre. Any QB other than Brady, manning., would be shatter.
3. As a head coach you need to be flexible on play calling. You don’ t think dungy wish manning would not have made some of those audible. Heck i heard all the words come out of Manning mouth is all sht. Until just before the ball is snap. A QB will see difference when they are on the field.
So in the end a not e chilly " Favre is not the only person has a problem with audible. you can get away with that kind of sht with Donnovan, because Donnovan is not that good. You not going to get that with a really QB."
P.S. is sht a swear word. If it is i am sorry
I WAS THERE AND FROZE MY BUTT OFF
So here is the real story people
1. Our vikes are AN INDOOR TEAM – we don’t play well on grass and in the cold
2. The play calling was beyond stupid and predictable – first down Peterson up the middle for no gain – UP TILL THE 3 rd quarter (when Brett finally had enough)
3. Childress says he should of given Mckennie help (you should of had that game planned in all week – Arizona sure as heck had it in to stop Jarred – how stupid!
4. I have watched every game Brett has played in – have you ever seen a harness race – its a horse pulling a cart – Well sometimes the race is fixed and the jockey pulls the horse back and drags his feet so the horse wont win – That is what Chilly is doing to Brett!
IF BRETT WAS REALLY RUNNING THE SHOW he would usually operate with 4 wides and AP – Do you ever see teams (patriots) go to a three reciever bunch with the trailer getting a quick pass and run (ie wes walker) – Wouldn’t it be awesome to have AP in that formation and get him the ball in open space? Or how about letting Percy line up in back of Brett and send him to a flat for a pass covered by a LINEBACKER? With 4 wides you cant play the cover 2 with under coverage like Arizona and Carolina did – you have to man up at the line with one deep safety leaving only 6 in the box to guard against the run – the playcalling is way too bland
Defense needs to get its act together – it is no where near what it did last year – Carolina ran well – protected well and got the ball to the playmaker Smith – he made a fool of Winfield in the fourth quarter
Coaches need to wake the hell up and get with it before this Viking ship runs aground
The problem I see with the Vikings is that they really struggle moving the ball against balanced defenses, namely the ones that don’t have to blitz to pressure the QB.
I’ve said it all year that minnesota’s O-line is not all it is heralded to be. Petersen has way TOO MANY runs for no gain. I believe the coaching staff ssaw this early and chose to pass to set up the run – not unlike traditional WCO’s. It works great – especially agaist those defenses that must blitz to bring pressure – this is where Brett Favre makes his money. The problem is that against teams like Carolina, there are simply too many defenders available to cover the wide receivers. Furthermore, this is where the inconsistent run-blocking of the O-line rears its ugly head because these defenses can kinda “sit” on the runs and shut them down.
And, the bigger problem going forward is that once the playoffs roll around, the only defenses that’ll be left standing at that point which Minny can handle is Green Bay and New Orleans. I would assume at this point that Philly will win the west and the Giants will take the last wildcard. Anybody keen on playing Philly, Arizona or the Giants??? I’m not.
So, the only route the Super Bowl in my opinion is one that sees Minnesota securing home field advantage (could be tough considering the highly ranked passing defenses in Chicago (#7 and #10). Minny can handle Da Bears, but the Giants could prove to be tough.). Green Bay being the #5 seed and taking out Arizona, and hopefully New Orleans NOT losing to Philly or New York. I’d go as far as saying that I’d rather Minnesota play on the road in New Orleans rather than at home against Philly or New York.
Minnesota needs to throw the ball very well to open up the running game, which then leads to long, sustained drives that chew up the clock and keep its exploitable defense off the field. There is only so much Brett can do when he’s getting heavily pressured and receivers aren’t getting separation. I’m not sure what can be done when defenses play that way Carolina did last Sunday.
Excellent and insightful post
+11000001010101010
Well said, sir.
Error: Malformed binary. Your binary code is must be divisible by 8
damn you, Wytefang…
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Dec 23, 2009 9:41 PM CST up reply actions
Fair points, Gonzo
I know I definitely over-reacted but in fairness to myself, not without cause, necessarily. I think we’ve seen some sobering things in recent games that may point to some cracks in the ice. That being said, having had a few days to really cool down and think things over, there’s nothing we (as fans) can do about it anyway, so might as well just support them and hope for the best.
We’ll know a lot more about our mettle with our first playoff game.
For future seasons...
I hope we get even more talented WRs, some fresh strong blood for the O and D-lines, and some really good Safeties and CBs. It’s a lot to work on AND we still need to find our inevitable Favre replacement. But we’ve done some great things in the draft in the past so I’ll cross my fingers. But for now, time to focus on the present, such as it is.
people we need to listen to
oh ya that would exclude all media branches and experts. that leaves only pack and bear fans. remember, they couldn,t wait to destroy us twice this year. lovie has such a great record against farve and the vikes remember.lol chilly the madman is prepairing us to crush gb 3 times knowing we will only have 1 real game to get to the big dance. it was those experts that said t-jack would have to carry us the last 8 games. he’s been great.lol vikes go after free agents that do well against us. how about peppers?
Respect!
Brett Favre dissed his boss and then spoke about it after the Carolina game. Mr Wilf should talk to Favre and remind him that he is a player and not the head coach. We need a united team and not a divided team entering the playoffs. No player should be put above the rest of the team. Green Bay was smart to trade this prima donna!
Great 2009-10 season, then what?
Let me preface my post by stating I’m a Packer fan who lived and died with Brett for 16 yrs. In the end, I cried with pre-menopausal Brett as he left GB, only to find out the whole act was a contract negotiation ploy to get to the Vikings. Short detour through NYC, but he finally ended up where he wanted to be. So far it`s been a good marriage.
But what happens next year?
Win or lose the SB (and lets be honest, winning isn’t going to be easy), where do the Vikings stand for QB’s. Minny has mortgaged atleast $12M over 2010 and 2011 just pay Favre for this season. If Minny doesn’t sign Favre past 2010, they still owe him lots of $.
And who is going to take over after Favre? After all, he will be 41 yrs old next season. Minny will not get a high draft pick next year, and it is doubtful they have the money to sign another quality free agent QB in 2011 (if the Vikings are still in Minny). So what are the Vikings going to do? After this season, the opinion don’t look promising.
I hope all you Vikings fans enjoy this year and just pray your team wins the SB, because Zygi has motgaged the teams future on winning now. In my mind, this plan means that Zygi intends to sell the team in the near future and have someone else pay for a 42 yr old quarterback who might not even be playing.
Hmmm
What happens next year if the Vikings win the SB? Honestly, I don’t care. They can go 0-16. Hell, they can go 0-16 for the next two years, because every time a crappy Vikes game comes on, I’ll just fire up the Super Bowl win, or one of the other playoff games. You think I’m kidding. You have no idea what a game changer a SB win would be for this franchise, at least for most fans.
It was iffy on whether or not Jackson was the answer. If he is, he’s delayed one more year, possibly two. If not, there was going to be a transition anyways, because some key players like Hutch, Antoine Winfield, Pat Williams, and Ben Leber are getting old.
So better to load up and make one, maybe two realistic runs at it, and maybe we’ll get some gems in the draft (which have been stellar under the Chilly reign) and the transition won’t be as painful, and it won’t start early.
"We're used to Favre-a-palooza now. We're engulfed in Favre-a-palooza. It's not even Favre-a-palooza anymore. He's family now."
--Vikings TE Visanthe Shiancoe, on Brett Favre
Hmmm, eh
I hear yea. In fact I still have the VHS tape of SB XXXI, unfortunately I can’t re-live the past glory because I don’t own a VCR anymore.
Seems you know what you’re going to do for the next few years “…if the Vikings win the SB..” this year, but what if the Viking don’t win the SB this year. Considering Favre is 0-7 in a cold road games since 2002, and the Cards still have an outside chance at a 2nd seed; I suggest that an SB appearance, let alone a victory will not be a cakewalk. EJ’s injury hurts and teams are will sure to be keying on JA, so don’t count your chicken quite yet.
by canucknflfan on Dec 24, 2009 3:39 PM CST up reply actions
T-Jack
will be signed to an extension and ready to go! We won the division w/ him and Gus Frerotte last year and will again w/ him and Sage. There ya go!
T-Jack and Sage?
Aren’t they the guys who were promised a competition for starting QB, only to be thrown aside when Brett arrived in the white SUV?
T-Jack is a restricted FA at the end of this year, and Sage’s contract is up after 2010. I wouldn’t hold my breath that eaither of them are going to be showing any loyalty to the Vikings unless there is BIG money involved. And money is something the Vikings do not have alot of to throw around.
by canucknflfan on Dec 24, 2009 3:49 PM CST up reply actions
the suv was black
OJ’s bronco was white…… Oh OJ…..
I piss people off on a fairly regular basis. I cherish my right to speak my mind, whether I sound like an uneducated savage or not. I've never been accused of keeping what I think a secret, nor will I ever. Don't like it? I don't care.
by IABerserker1 on Dec 24, 2009 7:35 PM CST up reply actions
Zygi's got the money
and Brzezinski knows how to spend it!
10-1 vs. 1-2
Sure the Favre-Chilly combination has gone 11-3, and that’s pretty dang good. To me, the bigger question is: Is the Favre-Chilly combination that went 10-1 the same as the Favre-Chilly combination that subsequently went 1-2?
I’m definitely no Chilly fan, but perhaps he’s seen Brett doing things different the past 3 games than he did the first 11? It’s only valid to say “hey, they’re 11-3, what’s the problem?” as long as nothing has changed. The Vikings of the past 3 games have looked vastly different that the Vikes of the first 11 games. While that’s no cause for mass hysteria, I think it’s a little naive to say “eh, no problem, they’re 11-3. Everything is fine.”
Yes, I'm posting about the same topic
…so for those of you who it annoys, please ignore this. For your benefit though, I am not “spamming” by re-posting, rather writing and posting new links.
I agree with you HHoP; their has been a trend over the last several games (say going back to the Seattle or Chicago games, and certainly the Arizona and Carolina games), that the Vikings are becoming more of a pass-first team, instead of a run-first team. And, the subtle message of the Chilly / Favre feud is that Favre is the one trying to hog the offense and make it pass-centric. And this won’t lead the Vikings to the promised land.
I was harping on this a while back, but now everyone is admitting it:
http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/80092817.html?page=2&c=y
“To run the ball three times in the second half, it was a 7-6 game [after three quarters], that was a poor job on my part,” Bevell said. “You have to be patient. There may be times you’re getting one, two, three yards, and you have to continue to stay with it.”
(My Note: Good to hear Bevell is admitting it, but, as we all know Bevell is Favre’s buddy, and probably is being influenced by #4 to move the game plan towards the pass)
“At the root of the issue is that at times Favre has checked out of run plays in order to pass.”
And here is former Packers’ QB Harry Sydney who played with Favre early in his career:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/24/harry-sydneys-interest-take-on-favre/
“Brett wasn’t always like this,” Sydney said. "I think what happened to Brett was once, unfortunately, his father died, [Brett] lost that guy that could tell him, ’Man, what the hell are you doing? What are you doing? Think about the big picture…
If you want to go to Minnesota, great. Of course, there’s loyalty with me being an old Packer, but if you want to do that, fine, but don’t hurt the team. And I think he’s hurting the team."
Sydney specifically thinks Favre is hurting his team by forcing the focus of the offense to change from a strong running game to a pass-heavy attack, and by taking his recent dispute with coach Brad Childress public."
Favre, Chilly, and Bevell are saying the right things (“We need to get back to the running game” ; “This offense begins and ends with Adrian Peterson”). My hear hopes they can refocus and put the good of the team above all their egos. But my mind worries that Favre won’t.
The coaching staff is still, mainly, responsible for...
…the Vikings downfall. I was really alarmed since that game in Arizona. Note how I said “the game” and not " the loss". An NFL team may lose a game on Any Given Sunday. I got to watch the game that Sunday night and, what troubled me most was the players attitude on the field. There was no intensity or lack of it and I blame the coaching staff for poor preparation leading into that game.
The good thing was we bounced back the following week against the Bengals. Again, going into Carolina’s game, we had every motivation to beat the Panthers, after New Orleans had just lost to the Cowboys, to stay in contention for the top spot. We faltered.
So now we’ve got a chance to redeem ourselves and win in Chicago, God forbids, or we’re all in big troubles.
But what about in the playoffs???……we goofed up again and we gotta wait until next season for any chance of redemption.
This is THE BEST VIKINGS TEAM, talent wise, put together to come short of anything but a SUPER BOWL. So please Chilly…don’t screw it up.
Tiki Barber's take
If you want to hear a brilliant objective take on this whole Childress/Favre thing, don’t miss the comments of Tiki Barber on Yahoo Sports. Very succinct and quite interesting.
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