Tarvaris v. Brett, the #'s don't lie
by sdot on May 5, 2009 7:18 PM CDT
32 comments
Favre:
| Last 4 Games | 4 | 53.3 | 75 | 132 | 56.8 | 764 | 191.0 | 5.8 | 2 | 8 |
Jackson:
| Last 4 Games | 4 | 115.4 | 57 | 89 | 64.0 | 740 | 185.0 | 8.3 | 8 | 1 |
I'll casually break that down into something readable:
QB Rating: 115.4 to 53.3
Completion %: 56.8 to 64.0
TD to INT Ratio: 1/4 to 8/1
All in favor of a young Tarvaris Jackson...say "I"?
Quarterbacks, especially very young and very old, are usually judged going into the next season on the way they handle themselves at the end of the previous regular season.
Those last 4 games of the regular season, Tarvaris was nearly flawless in his execution. Everyone has been calling the TJACK "experiment" a failure, solely because he was eaten alive by a ravenous eagles defense that did worse to Tony Romo the week before. Not neglecting the fact that he was overmatched, our coaches hung Tarvaris out to dry in the second half of that eagles game with no huddle fly routes that had him looking like a high schooler, creating this wonderful amnesia affect that has some "Vikings" fans clamoring for a quarterback that will retire (at some point) WITH THE PACKERS. I should be able to argue this on ethics alone!!!
The idea that it would be wonderful to beat the Packers with their own guy is ludacris. Yea, that's fine when its Ryan Longwell, but Favre is the face of that franchise, and is selfish enough to want to play for a rival to the franchise he plans to retire with. That fact doesn't even begin to address how selfish the guy is. But I guess a pair of Wranglers means he's just a regular guy who likes to toss the ball around with the guys.
My head is clouded with fury, so i'll stop. Just refer to the beginning. Thanks. Good/sad day to all of us.
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The one flaw in your numbers are that Favre was playing hurt his last 4 games.
Before the injury, he has having a pretty amazing season. I don’t think he had lower than a 65% completion except for against Oakland. And he had led the Jets to an 8-3 record. If he could do for us what he started off with for the Jets, it wouldn’t matter if he got hurt. We could just stick in Jackson or Rosenfels in relief, and I’m sure they’d be fine.
by Frost on May 5, 2009 7:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh that’s a brilliant argument. He was hurt for those five games and never had recommended surgery…let’s just give him the reigns to our offense.
Case of the beet bandit. Missing beets from all over the farm, no footprints. Inside job. Mose in socks. Boom. Case closed. -Dwight Schrute
by mjschaefer on May 6, 2009 8:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uhhh, that sounds like a pretty damn good idea to me. He’s had this type of injury before, and it healed on its own. He’s probably hoping it’ll do the same. I don’t know if it will or not, I’m not a doctor, but I’ll trust Favre’s judgement with his own body.
by Frost on May 6, 2009 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And I don’t. He’s not as young as he used to be, and if he’s had the same injury before, it’s definitely going to take longer to heal, and when it does, it won’t be as good as it used to be.
In AP I trust
Brett Favre should go die somwhere
by FarvaForTheVikings on May 6, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ANd he’ll still be a better QB than what we currently have, even if his arm won’t be as good as it was.
by Frost on May 6, 2009 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to mention...
It’s not like the Vikings are just going to take Favre’s word on his arm. I’m sure the only way they will sign him is if he gets looked at by their trainers and passes a physical
by PurplePeopleEaters09 on May 6, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The physical would be required by the NFL.
Be nice. Flag comments that you think are offensive. Use the "reply" button. Drink plenty of water. Compliment others. Rec comments and posts you like. Don't call people names. If you don't like someone's comment, attack the comment and not the commentor. Learn the difference in your/you're, then/than, to/too. Exercise. Relax. Stretch often. Find good in the world.
by Dane Noble on May 6, 2009 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Favre would love to hear he needs surgery
That would give him an excuse to sit out OTAs
by PurplePeopleEaters09 on May 6, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Any idea how long it takes to recover from that sort of surgery? Could belong enough to keep him out of the season, and I suspect, if he stays out for a season, he really will be done.
by DCPurple on May 7, 2009 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
4-6 weeks
Same type of surgery that Elway went through. Elway won the superbowl the next season. hmmm… Hahaha
by PurplePeopleEaters09 on May 7, 2009 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a canard, because
you can pick out any sample size to suit your needs to prove your hypothesis.
I could probably pick out 4 games to compare Gus Frerotte and Fran Tarkenton and say Gus was/is better, but that doesn’t necessarily make it so.
Thoughts on the Vikings, Buckeyes, and Cardinals
www.purplebuckeye.blogspot.com
by MilCardFan on May 5, 2009 8:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
+1
right, and they weren’t playing for the same team, they weren’t playing the same defenses, and on and on and on……
by newmexvike on May 5, 2009 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
????
How many playoff games has Favre won? More than zero that’s right, he’s better than Jackson.
by solafide on May 5, 2009 9:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And how many?
Has Favre lost? Try 10 on for size. Like MilCardFan said, stats can be used to prove anything you want.
Jackson is 0-1 in playoff games, Favre is 12-10. And I bet that Favre didn’t lose all of those to the eventual NFC Champion either (well, except for the ones he lost IN the NFC Championship by throwing interceptions).
by Cobra312004 on May 6, 2009 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
also
i think brett did bad those last games just so he could be released
new york viking
by new york viking on May 5, 2009 10:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Lol
I completely agree. Didnt the Packers get a conditional pick from the Jets, depending on how Favre did in the season/took them to the playoffs? I think so. Packers got a 3rd rounder instead of a 2nd rounder (1st for SB win), it was Favre’s plan all along. Way to stick it to the Fudge Packers Bret!
Im am all for bringing in Bret to the Vikes. Strip JD Booty of the #4, give it to Favre and stick Booty in the closet.
Favre didnt have the AD with the Jets, No defensive help (most games were shoot outs), and he didnt have the deep threat like Harvin/Berrian. He will also be playing indoors (perfect for an aging body), knows the system/coaches, and he hates the Packers, a perfect Viking in my book.
Would it be too much to get a 2 year commitment from Favre? Probably.
by LAviking on May 6, 2009 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two years? God no. I can’t even take the thought of one year with him.
In AP I trust
Brett Favre should go die somwhere
by FarvaForTheVikings on May 6, 2009 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
More on Brett
Just a little something to think about. Brett Favre has a problem in the last 5 games of the year. If you add up his stats for the last 5 games of the last 5 years this is what you come up with.
866 attempts/495 completions for 57.1% 6.3 yards per attempt. 21 Td’s and 40 Int’s for a passer rating of 64.9
Still want him at the end of the year?
BTW, out of those 25 games the Packers went 13-12.
by raptorman on May 5, 2009 10:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
So he cokes at the end of the season...
Jackson and Favre share something in common
by solafide on May 5, 2009 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tjack did get us to the playoffs. Favre had a horrible, multi-game collapse. Tjack had one bad game. Point is, neither is very dependable. But Tjack knows his place.
In AP I trust
Brett Favre should go die somwhere
by FarvaForTheVikings on May 5, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here is my humble 2 cents
T-Jack showed some improvement at the end of the year, but he suffers from a certain problem. I dunno if there are any PSU fans on here, ubt much like Anthony Morelli, the kid shows great talent, then the next play I wonder how he ever got this far. If he can just learn to be more consistent, he will be fine. If we would have had a solid starter for the past 2-3 years for him to sit behind, I think we could hand the reigns off with minimal worry. He had to play right away and had to develop on-field. There are about 3-4 QBs who started off right away as a rookie and won(Ryan an Flacco are exceptions not the rule), even Manning went 3-13 his first year. So I think we are approaching the end of his development phase, he has a total of what? around 20 career starts, basically a full rookie season. I think if we have Favre for 1 year, just one, it can bridge that gap to Tavaris, I honestly think that TJ shows enough that he can be a starter, but the kid was a 2nd rd pick from a 1-aa school, he shouldn’t have been expected to go right away. I’m for bringing Favre in, not as an immediate fix for a title, but for the sake of T-Jack.
Favre will have far less to do with his development than the coaches, but there are far worse stop-gap measures to get this kid ready mentally. T-Jack should never have been expected to preform right away, shit even wonderboys V Young and M Leinart haven’t gotten it yet.
Black Shoes.
Basic Blues.
No Name.
All Game.
by Roland86 on May 6, 2009 1:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Damn I'm tired of this already!
They both SUCK in my humble opinion. Bring on Sage Rosenfels & let the defense be the Dogs of War!! We win on defense, AP, our O-line…..and SAGE keeping his cool & not making big mistakes (like these two other clowns are so prone to do).
by Viking64 on May 6, 2009 7:30 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You must have missed Sage’s great game against Indy. He sure looked like he could manage a lead there.
Case of the beet bandit. Missing beets from all over the farm, no footprints. Inside job. Mose in socks. Boom. Case closed. -Dwight Schrute
by mjschaefer on May 6, 2009 8:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
One game =/= a trend
In AP I trust
Brett Favre should go die somwhere
by FarvaForTheVikings on May 6, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Old Bull vs Young Bull
Jackson warmed pine most of the year and went into his “last four” of the season, completely fresh. On the other hand, Favre played all year long and was hurt in the end, as well as fatigued.
I’m looking forward to seeing what Jackson, AND Rosenfels, can do on the field… but don’t kid yourself; neither of them is in Favre’s league if all circumstances are equal. A handful of stats doesn’t tell the whole story, if it did then you could win big in Vegas by betting the line every time.
…
The Old Bull and the Young Bull were standing on a hilltop, looking down at a herd of cows.
The Young Bull gets excited, starts stamping his feet and pawing the earth, steam rising from his body, and says, “Let’s run down there and do a cow!”
The Old Bull glances at him and snorts, saying, “No. Let’s walk down there and do them all.”
by DCPurple on May 6, 2009 7:50 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ethical argument is what i'm really interested in...
I just thought the statistical reference was amusing, and a bit telling of the man’s age.
enjoy.
take, that
by sdot on May 6, 2009 9:02 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Horsepucky
All this whining about Favre being a “diva” and creating all this “drama” is really clever media misdirection. It’s the media that turns it into a circus, and then they complain about the circus. It’s the media that blows it all up into a huge drama-fest, then complains about the drama. And people just buy into it without thinking critically. There’s more hysteria on the DN over this than Favre himself has EVER displayed. Does all this pander to the man’s ego? I have a feeling that if he’s half as smart as he’s supposed to be, it doesn’t. More likely it makes him laugh his arse off and say, “here they go again!”.
Ethics? What ethics are you talking about? The ethics of loyalty of a player to a team? The ethics of loyalty of a fan to a team? The ethics of the NFL? All overblown, and in the case of the NFL, it’s teams, and players, it exists to the letter of a contract and nothing more. To the NFL, players are commodities, and it doesn’t care which team wins the Super Bowl, as long as they have record attendance and sales and maximum media coverage to sucker in more sponsor advertising spots sold for record millions of dollars per minute. It’s called business. It’s only we, the fans, that honestly put more ethical consideration of loyalty into our support of a given team, while the NFL laughs all the way to the bank, and a bunch of guys who haven’t achieved anything more impressive in their entire lives other than play an athletic game with excellence, pocket millions of dollars.
Ethics? Are you serious? What ethics do you expect out of Favre? That he be loyal to an organization that he was at odds with? Welcome to Real-Ekonomik 101, and the simple that that when an old race horse that’s retired out to pasture hears in the distance the clangor and crashing of the starting gate, he jumps forward, eyes startled and wide as he looks around to notice he’s all alone in a peaceful meadow.
by DCPurple on May 6, 2009 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Playoffs? Are you serious? Playoffs? You want to talk about playoffs?
lol sorry, couldn’t resist after reading the ethic questions.
Anyways, onto business. +1
by Frost on May 6, 2009 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So the media never underreports anything?
Like the fact the Favre hasn’t shown up to offseason camps and workouts in over a decade? Or how he called out a receiver to stop holding out and get to camp when he’s been skipping those same camps for years? So when Favre is interested in getting in shape then that means everyone else should be interested in what Brett Favre’s interested in?
That’s all diva-like behavior, and it went underreported for a decade because saying anything bad about Brett Favre is blaspheming against god.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on May 6, 2009 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not a Minnesota fan...
but I do like to watch good players ala AP. I have been on this blog before and wrote….actually blasted the vikings for being a team to win now except for the qb play. I blasted management for not making more of an effort on getting some of the qbs out there such as cassell or cutler. I made the coment that what chi gave up would not have hurt the vikings AS much as it will chi. I also blasted childress for his conservative playcalling and his loyalty to TJ. But that is all in the past….
Now comes Favre. I know we have been through this last year, and last year i thought that would have been a great move for the vikings. But this year…. I am on the fence.
He clearly isnt the player he once was. I do think that the reason of his fall off last year was due to his injury. Plus the talent on minn is much better than the jets. Basically, if Favre came back you wouldnt really be asking him to win your games, just manage the offense and dont lose games. I think he could definately do that better than TJ and sage.
However, after seeing him last year….IF he came back to Minn…I would just get a feeling this isnt right. Nothing against Minn… but because of the way things went down last year, I really thought that was the type of season a retiring qb should go out on. Getting hurt and watching your team go from 8-3 to missing the playoffs is heartbreaking. I could see how it would take your last gasp of “love of the game.” I think he should stay retired. BUT should he return, I think the vikings is about the ONLY situation that is right for him.
by gl12ox05 on May 6, 2009 1:14 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Numbers don't lie...
Folks like to use “the numbers don’t lie” line alot.
Actually, quite often they do. Numbers are always twisted to mean whatever the publisher of the numbers wants them to show.
Polls, for example, target specific audiences to get them to show numbers that make good news, which is why the main News stations are able to persuade us into changing our minds on issues, candidates, etc. They can make anyone public enemy #1, or make them the greatest thing since sliced bread…yum.
As for Favre….I have given up trying to figure out whether I like or dislike the idea of him coming to us. Since my opinion counts not towards Chilly and Wilfer’s decision, I will sit back and watch the fireworks with an occassional fun comment here and there.
by Lofoten on May 6, 2009 5:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
give ma jackson
Favre had 22 interceptions last year. Twenty two. Absolutely whole heartedly with every once of my soul I resound “I would rather have Tavaris than Brett Favre.” Sorry Brett you are a washed up, injured interception drama queen. I can get past my hatred for you as a G.B. icon if you actually helped our team, but you don’t. Tavaris has improved, after his first year he was yanked because we needed a game manager – enter Brad Johnson. After the first two games last year he was yanked with Chillie saying he was too conservative – enter Gus. When he came back at the end of the season he showed the poise of having learned both lessons and did great. It is called development and Tavaris has improved since being drafted. Favre will only hurt this team. Twenty two interceptions last year…TWENTY TWO. Thanks but no thanks Mr. Favre.
http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff222/LeoGetz25_2007/Peterson28-1.png
by aceinthecorner on May 6, 2009 6:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
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