Week 7: What We Learned
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 25, 2010 6:14 PM CDT
in Minnesota Vikings 2010 Season
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Another week, another game we probably should have won. I don’t know about you guys, but I’m really getting sick of this woulda/coulda/shoulda crap. Let’s get right to what we learned this week before I just start copying and pasting f-bombs for 30 paragraphs.
The referees didn’t do us any favors.
I’m being as politically correct as possible here. What I really want to say is that those a——s really f—ed us over. Well I guess I just did, but that’s exactly what happened. To be clear, I’m not complaining about either of Harvin’s overturned touchdowns. He was obviously out of bounds on both of them. However, I still have absolutely no idea how the hell Visanthe Shiancoe’s touchdown reception was ruled as such on the field and then overturned. He had 100% possession through the entire catch–no matter how you interpret the rules, that was a touchdown. Scott Green and his crew screwed the pooch, plain and simple. In case you needed more convincing, the NFL admitted the referees were wrong today. Yeah, it doesn’t make me feel any better either.
But wait, there’s more! Not only did the refs cost us four points on our end, they handed the Packers at least four points on Andrew Quarless’ second quarter "touchdown" catch on third down. His feet weren’t in, his ass landed partially out of bounds, and he bobbled the ball after all he landed. The referees decided to ignore all of that and award a touchdown anyway. There’s eight points incorrectly awarded by the referees in a four point game. I won’t blame the refs for the loss, but they sure as hell didn’t help our cause. Of course, Brad Childress could have challenged that Quarless score, which brings me to the next thing we learned.
Brad Childress still sucks as a head coach.
Remember the last game of the 2004 season when Randy Moss left the field and headed to the locker room before the game against the Redskins was over? Well if Randy Moss is throwing his hands up wondering why you're heading to the locker room early, then you probably aren't making the right decision. The Vikings were on a 10-point run, still had two timeouts remaining, and were armed with the best deep threat in the NFL and a quarterback with a cannon for an arm. So what did timid little Brad do right after Favre and Moss had just hooked up for a long completion (called back for offensive pass interference)? He took a freaking knee! You don't beat a division rival on the road in prime time by just sitting on a three point lead. You try and go for their throat when you have momentum! Only Brad Childress could make me furious about a halftime lead.
After being spineless on the field, Childress finally stepped up and showed some fortitude after the game. Of course, it came in the form of publicly calling out Favre and shifting all the blame to him. Oh wait, that was spineless too. "Playing within the confines of our system", eh Brad? Does "the system" include putting your tail between your legs before the half? Call me crazy, but I don't think Mr. Childress is commanding a lot of respect from his locker room these days. But to be fair, it wasn't all bad for Childress and his staff.
While the game management sucked, the play calling was much better.
It was great to see some new plays and formations unleashed last night. Harvin's rushing touchdown that actually did count was a beautifully designed play. The Shiancoe TD (that wasn't) was sweet. It was encouraging to see our offense to put together a couple of their best drives of the season. However, the execution wasn't always up to par--isn't that right Brett? Time for the next thing we learned...
Brett Favre did more damage than the referees and Childress combined.
Childress was right about one thing--you can't give the other team seven points going the other way. Favre has been playing professional football for the past twenty years. He knows better than to make those throws that led to 14 game-deciding Packer points. I'm fairly certain that Favre knows that getting sacked doesn't automatically end the game, so why was he playing like it? I know that I've been preaching all along that we can't expect 2009 Favre this year, but this is getting ridiculous. I know you have to take the good with the bad when it comes to Favre. I'm just waiting for the good to show up for more than one or two plays a game. The most maddening thing about Favre's play is that he's still throwing a gorgeous long ball but he's missing lots of easy throws. One of his three interceptions was from taking a shot down the field--I'm A-OK with the risk involved there. But hitting A.J. Hawk and Desmond Bishop in the numbers from five yards away is simply unacceptable.
We've also just learned that we might not have to worry about Favre making bad decisions next week against New England thanks to fractures in his ankle. Which of course would mean...say it with me in your best Pauly D voice...T-JAX TIIIIIIIIIIME! I've never been a big supporter of Tarvaris Jackson, but if he could just stay out of his own way and use the array of weapons on the Minnesota offense, we might actually be better off with him.
I think we need to start blaming Jared Allen's wife.
OK not really, but how else can you explain the curious disappearance of Allen this year? Last year he racked up 7.5 sacks against the Packers alone. Then he gets married, cuts his hair, and now he's getting absolutely owned one-on-one by Chad Clifton. I realize Clifton didn't play in either game last season, but did you see the reel of Clifton shutting Allen down that NBC showed last night? Allen tried the exact same move on every single play! A quick half-hearted shimmy followed by a speed rush around the outside. I thought NBC was stuck on a loop at first. Allen did get an interception in the first half, but that was more of a gift from Rodgers while Jared's pass rush was being shut down yet again.
Since Allen keeps trying in vain to speed rush around the edge on nearly every play, teams have started exploiting it with the run game. Brandon Jackson, a mediocre running back at best, had a bunch of big runs right through the void in the line left by Allen. Jared needs to switch it up, because what he's doing now isn't working. Speaking of disappointing defenders...
Chris Cook is either still hurt or just bad.
Rodgers picked on Cook early and often until he was mercifully replaced by Frank Walker. Cook was getting burned more often than my attempts at cooking for my wife. I really hope he isn't 100% yet; if he is, I think we wasted our first draft pick this year. It's obvious that we still miss Cedric Griffin, but I think the rest of the secondary acquitted itself fairly well considering there was rarely any pressure on the quarterback.
Adrian Peterson is an absolute tank!
I wanted to end on a positive note. You'd think I would be used to it by now, but HOLY EFFING CRAP ADRIAN PETERSON IS AWESOME. It was incredible to see AP bulldoze his way to 172 total yards and a score. Let's hope that we quit wasting these Herculean efforts and turn this season around before it's too late.
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Chris Cook...
looked great in pre-season, and against Calvin Johnson in his only regular season game.
He had a tall order in covering Greg Jennings this game too, so he definitely had his work cut out for him.
But I’d like to think it’s just him not being 100% after injuring BOTH his knees in the course of like a month or so. I think when he’s back to 100%, and gets a bit of nfl experience under his belt, we’ll have a really good DB on our hands.
That's what I'm thinking too.
The man just had 2 knee surgeries in the last month.
To go from 2 knee surgeries to playing Rookie CB in the NFL is extraordinary for anyone….even if they were just minor surgeries.
Give Cook a couple healthy weeks, and we’ll see improvement in his game.
Good post
The only thing I’d really disagree with is the play calling sucked. It got much better as the game went on, but the 1st quarter was horrible. The play calling has been part of our slow starts and it has been making us play from behind all year.
Yeah we still started slow
But at least we started to move the ball in the first half this time around.
Proud contributor to Daily Norseman and SB Nation Minnesota
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 25, 2010 6:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I’m ready to pull the plug on Favre. Fact is, he’s been the worst QB in the league this year, and given his injuries, age, and possible distractions, it’s difficult to imagine him turning it around significantly.
But the trouble is if/when Chilly gets more of a yes-man back under center, we’ll go back to the KAO days, which isn’t much easier on the eyes than this year’s version of Favre has been.
THINGS WE LEARNED
I agree with you
But you forgot to call out KEVIN WILLIAMS AND RAY EDWARDS on their lack of a pass rush!
And what about the players that keep taking stupid penalties at crucial times during drives!
If we don’t get pressure on TOM BRADY he will throw at least 4-6 touch downs against our weak secondary.
by Bako- on Oct 25, 2010 6:43 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
the lack of a pass rush
…appeared to be by design.
The DL seemed to be pulling up early a lot with the intention of limiting underneath crossing routes and batting down passes. It was the scheme, not the players. No earthly clue why y’all would do that instead of going after the QB, but it’s probably due to the issues in the secondary and the fact that Rodgers hasn’t exactly been firing on all cylinders yet – might have paid off had it not been for the hole that your QB Creepy McTexter dug for y’all.
Still, tough game, and one y’all could have had, mebbe even should have. Don’t read too much into it – beyond the point that Chilly sucks, of course. ;-)
either that, or theyre just old, fat, and/or lazy
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
THe "Diamond" set
Liked: The diamond set, 4 WR’s set left in a bunch. I had only ever seen New England use that formation, usually with success with Danny Woodhead this year. Watch for it next week, it looks pretty tough to defend.
Disliked: Letting the clock run down at the half. Isn’t Denny in the UFL now? Bad acid flashback.
Liked: Adrian Peterson running mean. I mean, meaner than usual. Beastmode.
Disliked: Shanksters TD being reversed. Garbage overturn for the home crowd. Refs wanted to hear cheers and imagine it was for them.
Liked: Percy’s playmaking. The kid is really starting to become our home run hitter. Every time he touches the ball I think he has a shot to take it to the house.
Disliked: No replays on the Packer non-TD while I sat and screamed that he dropped it. TV crew went right to commercial with no commercial, kick was up as soon as they got back. The Vikings got no such luxuries.
Liked: Anthony Herreras play. He opened holes, held his blocks, and was nasty for most of the game.
Disliked: The disappearance of our hyped D-Line. If we can’t get pressure with the 4 man rush, our secondary gets exposed over and over. Add to the fact that we don’t make adjustments, and teams march up and down between the twenties.
Liked: The RB’s picking up the blitzes. Some very good blocks by all the back, including Tahi and Gerhart. Adrian made some good reads as well. Definite improvement there.
Disliked: Chris Cook getting burned. I hope he’s still hurt, because I have high expectations for this kid.
Liked: the sweet pick-n-roll by Percy to open up Moss in the endzone. That was a kickass play.
We aren’t out of this yet. The Packers and Bears are NOT good teams and neither are going to string wins together to put it out of reach. We’ve got one or two weeks left before we take ourselves out of contention. Stay Strong, Purple Fans.
Skol.
by JMigz on Oct 25, 2010 7:37 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Liked the Diamond set as well.
Didn’t know what that formation was called before but I’m glad it was added to the playbook. Our offensive play-calling was much improved last night and showed some creativity and variety. Yes, I know we probably had a run, run, pass series or two but overall we ran more formations and motioned Harvin around well.
by CanadianViking on Oct 25, 2010 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Wow
I came over to check in on the chatter for the Pats next game and I only see a few guys manning up for their team blowing it. Your coach is frickin idiot too. The rest of you are crying like babies and making excuses. My Pats are going to demolish you guys!
Haha
Don’t make us laugh with such jibberish! There is absolutely NO way that you will crush us. We may not be at our best, but I truly believe that even not at our best we can play with and beat the Pats. Brady is good, but Moss is going to be so motivated for this game that he’s going to have a sick day. Just watch…Moss in the end zone in purple is going to look fantastic. Cheers!
Moss can't throw it to himself.
As much as I’d love for NE to lose…they are a vastly superior team :/
Wow we’re gonna get this thing started off on the right foot, aren’t we.
Yep, it’s the Patsies. The only competitoin they have in the “class” dept in the NFL is Cowboys, Eagles, and Jets. Birds of a feather there. Nothing against the players. I’m talking about the FANS.
Boston, NY, Philly, and Texas
I’ve been to all four locales and I can vouch (as I’m sure so can others) that nearly everyone there are just plain rude. There’s something about those places that brings out the worst in people.
Manning Up
The only person who needs to man up is Roger Goodell. His little vendetta against Pat and Kevin Williams for making him look like an ass in the whole Starcaps issue is childish at best. The best front 4 in football have something like 6 sacks in 6 games between the 4 of them, and we haven’t been the beneficiaries of many holding calls either. Something is wrong in NFL officiating land, and I would bet money that the head honchos in the NFL are laughing their collective arses off over this.
The Minnesota Vikings - Undefeated in the Playoffs at Lambeau Field!
This is a tough call...
I am so strongly opposed to the sports conspiracy just because it would really ruin sports for me, knowing that would crush me, but the vikings really have been screwed over. Plus looking at baseball you know that it does happen…look at the black sox…i know its a stretch, but it still would be pretty crushing!
We need to throw on 1st down a little more.
Especially in the 1st half…… Not just when were down in points.
Why is everyone so mad about kneeling it to end the first half
Favre and his “cannon” didn’t do to well against the jets at the end of the game, and that wasn’t the product of a good defense, it was brett overthrowing a wide open percy then throwing an ugly pick 6. I would think everybody would understand that after the long ball we threw and got that questionable call on randy its obvious, good try but lets head into the tunnel up by 3, we weren’t in there territory and our success was using the run game to open up a few pass plays then go back to the run, we were around our own 30-35 and they had 2 time outs left just a risky move i don’t trust favre with this year.
Ummm … did yo forget Favre had just thrown a perfect bomb the snap before (only Randy screwed it up with a needless pushoff tat led to a penalty)?
lol, wonder how the fact that IT JUST HAPPENED fits into your theory that IT COULDN’T HAPPEN.
"Perfectly thrown?" Try UNDER thrown
Why do you think Randy decided to push off? He had to come BACK to the ball because it was underthrown. Randy probably didn’t need to push off because he’s so long he could have just jumped BACK to get it, but it was underthrown.
I really think Favre getting hurt could be the ONLY thing that could possibly save this season. I don’t think it will (the hole we’re in is too deep and we have major issues at OL, DE, and CB) but TJack might be exactly the shot in the arm this team needs.
Desperation football here we come.
Not saying anything would have happened
But it’s the old saying: you miss 100% of the shots you don’t take. Plus it’s a giant vote of no confidence in your team. Sure, Favre could have screwed it up—he’s pretty good at that. But we saw the possibility of a big play right before taking a knee—it just doesn’t make any sense.
Proud contributor to Daily Norseman and SB Nation Minnesota
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 25, 2010 9:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Just curious...
Where did you stand on going for it on 4th and 2 against Miami?
I was disappointed at the end of the half as well, but in retrospect it was the right call. Childress has a philosophy and he stuck to it. He wanted to take one shot and he did. We got called for PI so he ordered Favre to take a knee. There was no need to force anything, especially on the road, in prime time and with a lead. It’s a high-risk, high-reward situation; and considering that the ball hasn’t bounced our way that much this season, it was the right call.
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
Agreed
I recall Denny Green taking a knee in a game with much more on the line. I rarely see other teams do that and as Viking fans, we know how effective a Hail Mary pass can be at times. It isn’t over yet but the margin for future errors is very small. If Favre can’t go, let’s hope Jackson has been taking note of how to play quarterback the past season and a half. I also recall Green telling a young Daunte Culpepper to “just drive the car”. With Peterson, Moss and Harvin, he should be able to do that.
10-6 to finish
Shiancoe was being a little overly optimistic in saying they could still go 12-4, but I honestly see 10-6 more likely and that would likely still be winning the division
by Madden Allstar on Oct 25, 2010 10:03 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Ironically, that is exactly what I forsaw back in April, and the scenario I laid out then for what we win and lose could still end up to be spot on:
I think we should be open to the idea of possibly ending up 10-6, right now. That is a tough schedule, and I think we should start accepting that ASAP, so folks don’t get all bent out of shape later.
One scenario for six losses?
1. Split GB
2 Split Bears (lose at Soldier)
3. Split Saints and Jets (both road games — a split would be pretty good actually)
4. Split Eagles and Patriots (both road games — a split would be pretty good actually)
5. Split Cowboys and Giants
6. Just one of those "WTF" games (there is usually one every year — one we should have won).
Or instead of #2 or #6, we lose three of the four games in #3 or #4 — again, all four of those are road games against playoff teams, going .500 would be an accomplishment.
I’m not saying we go 10-6. I’m just saying we should not be so close-minded that we get too bent up if it actually does happen.
Notice I did not even bring up the Cardinals
by puddnhead on Apr 21, 2010 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I met a fairy today that granted me one wish. "I want to live forever," I said. "Sorry" said the fairy, "I'm not allowed to grant wishes like that!"
"Fine" I said, "I want to die after the Browns win the Super Bowl !"
"You crafty bastard," said the fairy.
by The Licensed Pessimist on Oct 25, 2010 10:09 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
When an Browns fan is allowed to talk shit on our blog
It is time I hang them up. Goodbye DN.
by Jepp The Viking on Oct 25, 2010 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
that's no ordinary horn on that helmet !!!
in the future there will be no war...there will only be rollerball.
Ha, I didn't notice the different "horn" earlier.
That’s a pretty funny shirt even if it’s “poking” fun at our team : )
by CanadianViking on Oct 25, 2010 11:34 PM CDT up reply actions
OK that was funny.
Proud contributor to Daily Norseman and SB Nation Minnesota
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 26, 2010 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
BF until broken
BF will play until he cannot walk or move his shoulder because we have no backup QB. What we have is a failed QB project and a yet to start QB project. When Chilli was asked why he traded away the only Backup we had his response was he was the only one we got an offer for. Hey Brad, if no one wants to make a deal for your TJ that should tell you something. The Jets learned from BF. They went and got a real coach (though a rude one) and a real QB. The next 2 games are crucial. 2 more losses and mutiny on the ship could be possible. Two wins and there is a shot if BF or WEB can do OK and Rice and be ready. TJ oh yeh if he plays he will not last past 2 games. Not only is he not good the guy can’t stay healthy. Hope I am wrong and we go all the way. If we do hats off to Chill. If we do not make the play-offs it is time for him & Bevell to go. (and I bet no one would pick them up.)
Jared Allan
Jared Allan the talker that he is needs to be called out. How many times have teams (not just GB) have 3rd and throw down and we get no sack, no pressure. The man has been figured and and is weak, and undersized. He needs to give 1/2 his salary back to the VIKES or to charity.
I'd be happy with a regrown mullet.
by Jepp The Viking on Oct 25, 2010 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Media's noticing
Allen’s weight loss too. I agree, he’s thinner and weaker. That’s not going to be fixed in the season, either.
by Shawn Gillogly on Oct 26, 2010 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Time to Go with Jackson
I think we are all blinded by Brett Favre being “BRETT FAVRE!” and because of the great year he had last year. The fact is, Favre has been horrible overall this year.
Comp/Att Yards TD INT FumbLost Rating
Saints : 15/27 171 1 1 0 71.7
Dolphins : 22/36 225 0 3 1 44.3
Lions : 23/34 201 1 2 0 68.4
Jets : 14/34 264 3 1 2 85.9
Cowboys: 14/19 118 1 0 1 106.9
Packers: 16/29 212 1 3 0 50.4
Look at those numbers. Those are not average numbers. Those are not mediocre numbers. Those are TERRIBLE numbers. Those are basically “worst QB in the League numbers.” Notice this fact:
In every single game this year, Favre has as many or more turnovers as TDs.
Look at those numbers again and remember the games. I think most of you (except the desperate Favre homers) would agree that:
(a) Favre basically single-handedly lost the Dolphins game (4 turnovers! 1 a TD for them, 2 picks on the goal line, no faith at all in passing game in 4th quarter so Adrian had to do everything) AND the Packers game (well along with the refs).
(b) Tarvaris could have played his usual game (e.g. 1 TD, 1 INT, some 1st downs on runs, etc.) and we WIN those games for sure.
© Favre did NOTHING special to help us win the Lions or Cowboys games. He was still pretty poor even playing pure “game manager” and letting AD and the defense win it. Tarvaris easily does that also and we win.
So almost indisputably we are 4-2 with Tarvaris at QB. This week (and maybe this season) should be an EASY choice at QB.
“We are going to rally around Kurt Warner Tarvaris Jackson.”
Stuff it ace your a joke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by cali viking on Oct 26, 2010 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Favre isn't worst in the league.
He’s above Matt Moore, Jimmy Clausen, and Derek Anderson!
A little history lesson for you Eric J Thompson!!!!!!!
“We’ve also just learned that we might not have to worry about Favre making bad decisions next week against New England thanks to fractures in his ankle.”
Bad Decisions???????
Favre get hit in the ankle causing an INT???
Desmond Bishop blantantly holding Randy Moss?
Eric, read the following accomplishments and then pray to the almighty GOD that he doesn’t strike you down where you lie for your sacrilegious comments!!!!!!!
Come on man, you’re smarter then that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BRETT FAVRE CAREER STATISTICS
Record Most Consecutive Starts: 291
(315 including postseason)
Record Most Consecutive MVP Awards:
Favre [1991-Present]: 3 [1995-97]
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 2 consecutive
(4 total: 2003, 2004, 2008, 2009)
Pro Bowl Selections:
Favre [1991-Present]: 11
Unitas [1956-73]: 10
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 10
Moon [1984-2000]: 9
Marino [1983-99]: 9
Elway [1983-98]: 9
Tarkenton [1961-78]: 9
Montana [1979-94]: 8
Record Wins:
Favre [1991-Present]: 183
Elway [1983-98]: 148
Marino [1983-99]: 147
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 135
Tarkenton [1961-78]: 124
Unitas [1956-73]: 118
Montana [1979-94]: 117
Record TD Passes:
Favre [1991-Present]: 504
Marino [1983-99]: 420
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 379
Tarkenton [1961-78]: 342
Elway [1983-98]: 300
Record Passing Yards:
Favre [1991-Present]: 70,520
Marino [1983-99]: 61,361
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 52,044
Elway [1983-98]: 51,475
Moon [1984-2000]: 49,325
Tarkenton [1961-78]: 47,003
Record Completions:
Favre [1991-Present]: 6,187
Marino [1983-99]: 4,967
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 4,403
Elway [1983-98]: 4,123
Moon [1984-2000]: 3,988
Most Consecutive Games with TD Pass:
Unitas [Streak 1956-60]: 47
Favre [Streak 2002-04]: 36
Marino [Streak 1985-87]: 30
Krieg [Streak 1983-85]: 28
Most 3,000+ Yard Seasons:
Favre [1991-Present]: 18
Marino [1983-99]: 13
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 12
Elway [1983-98]: 12
Moon [1984-2000]: 9
Montana [1979-94]: 8
Consecutive Seasons with 20 TD Passes:
Favre [1991-2005]: 12
P. Manning [1998-Present]: 12
Marino [1983-99]: 10
Record Career Postseason TD Passes:
Montana [1979-94]: 45
Favre [1991-Present]: 44
Marino [1983-99]: 32
Bradshaw [1970-83]: 30
Elway [1983-98]: 27
Consecutive Postseason Games with TD Pass:
Favre [1995-2009]: 20
Marino [1983-95]: 13
Stabler [1973-77]: 10
Montana [1988-93]: 10
Elway [1984-89]: 9
Most Career Postseason Passing Yards:
Favre [1991-Present]: 5,855
Montana [1979-94]: 5,772
Elway [1983-98]: 4,964
Marino [1983-99]: 4,510
Brett Favre is the Greatest QB in NFL History, Bar None!
Brett Favre will be back in 2010, Guaranteed!
Brett Favre will lead the Vikings to a Victory in Super Bowl XLV, Guaranteed!
Brett Favre in 2011 is inevitable!
by REVENGE4FAVRE on Oct 25, 2010 11:57 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
you forgot.....Most Career Interceptions: Favre: 327 and counting
in the future there will be no war...there will only be rollerball.
Most INTs is a deceptive stat.
He also has more pass attempts than most other QBs.
His INT:TD ratio is lower than such QBs like Manning, Brady, Young, Montana, Marino.
His overall int percentage to passes is somewhere around 3% or so, which is right around where the rest of his peers have been at.
TD to INT Ratio
Brett Favre = 504:327 = 1.54:1
Manning = 379:183 = 2.07:1
Brady = 236:103 = 2.29:1
Marino = 420:252 = 1.67:1
Montana = 273:139 = 1.96:1
His ratio is worse than all four of the guys that you mentioned. Aside from Marino, considerably worse.
by TrevorR on Oct 26, 2010 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't have a lot of confidence in Tarvaris Jackson, but...
Listing Favre’s stats from all the way back to games played when George H. W. Bush was POTUS and the NFL had twenty-eight teams leaves un-answered a more important question:
What has Favre done for us lately?
Fran Tarkenton had some pretty good career stats, too, if not in the same league as Favre’s, but citing them does not prove Tarkenton could help the Vikings salvage this season.
by Midnight Rambler on Oct 26, 2010 6:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm trying to straddle the middle ground here
Favre has done someething for us lately. More than something … a LOT. Just last year.
On the other hand, he’s hurt, and he’s more immobile than ever. That ain’t gonna get the job done behind the “four blocks or granite” that are our O line ( /sarcasm).
Here is the middle ground: Favre might or might not need to sit becasue of poor play, he probably needs to sit to heal. Either way tht ads up to sit. Then either TJack gets it done, and we’re good, or TJack doesn’t get it done, and then at least 1) we know that once and for all, before we have to give him an extension, 2) favre has a chance to heal and be ready for the stretch. As I’ve been posting here for six months, the way the schedule works, we were always gonna start off into a strong headwind, but should finish stronger. Then the road to the superbowl was gonna be a long one, so we need to be on top of our game if we’re gonna get into the playoffs. The best way to make sure we enter the playoffs strong (if we get there) is to have Favre heal now, instead of gimping his way through the regular season only to be worthless in playoffs..
Sorry Brett, for the good of the team — for your own good — it’s probably time to sit down.
by puddnhead on Oct 26, 2010 7:21 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
+10
That’s about how I figured it.
As much as we need Favre’s experience at the helm, right now all he’s going to do is get worse and worse as the year continues and he does more damage to himself by trying to play when he damn well knows he needs to heal up.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Well not that it was your point...
… but in his day, Fran Tarkenton had the best stats of any QB until that time.
The rules and game have changed a lot since Tarkenton played, which can explain why so many guys are breaking Tarkenton’s records.
But in his era, he was the best QB stat-wise. Period.
Not really fair to compare Tarkenton to Favre, or to the other guys on the list Trevor posted, without considering they are from different eras.
I know that wasn’t your point, but damnit, I will defend Fran Tarkenton on a Vikings site any day!
by HammeroftheGods on Oct 26, 2010 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions
True.....
in his time, a milestone game for a QB was when they reached 200 yds. passing in a game. Like you said, fewer restrictions were in place to protect QBs and WRs. Games were played outdoors predominantly, except for the Astrodome. Artifiical turf was also scarce, if non-existent.
Don Coryell, with Dan Fouts at QB, had a big part in changing the game. Seems like yesterday sometimes.
Yeah!
Don’t you know? Can’t you see THE TRUTH!?
BRETT FAVRE decides the outcome of each game before he plays it! Then he makes a sandwich and looks thoughtful!
When BRETT FAVRE throws an INT, he’s telling us to straighten up and fly right! BRETT FAVRE speaks to us with his throws! Sometimes in life you have to take a cha…INTERCEPTION! We all just matured a little!
If we lose a game, it is because HE wills it to be! (WE DESERVE IT)
He makes every single pair of Wrangler jeans himself! WITH HIS ****! He’s like a kid out there! That might have been an inadvertant child-labor joke!
BRETT FAVRE CAREER STATISTICS CONTINUED
Record Most Goddamn Aweome:
Brett Favre: So goddamn awesome
P. Manning: pfft.
Record Longest Sustained Fart (that didn’t smell too bad):
Brett Favre: 38Mins (Three-Alarm Chili and Onion Milk-2008)
Ray Lewis : 18Mins (Baby Geese and EZCheez-2004)
Pat Williams: 13Mins (No living witnesses)
Bishop blatantly holding Moss! You’ve gotta be fu*cking kidding me lol! More like Moss running a half assed route, and Favre throwing the ball directly to Bishop.
by packallday555 on Oct 26, 2010 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions
I figured this was coming.
I’m sorry R4F, you’re one of my favorites here, but two of those three interceptions were simply inexcusable. He should have just taken a sack or thrown the ball away. I won’t try to convince you further since it’s obviously an exercise in futility, but he just isn’t playing well right now. I’m sure his physical and mental health have a lot to do with it, which is too bad for the Favre diehards like yourself.
Proud contributor to Daily Norseman and SB Nation Minnesota
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 26, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
I Guarantee you eat Crow........................................
Too Bad, So Sad!
Brett Favre is the Greatest QB in NFL History, Bar None!
Brett Favre will be back in 2010, Guaranteed!
Brett Favre will lead the Vikings to a Victory in Super Bowl XLV, Guaranteed!
Brett Favre in 2011 is inevitable!
by REVENGE4FAVRE on Oct 26, 2010 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions
It is possible!!
Look at it this way…
Could it be that our 2010 season is in reverse of the 2009 season.
We can consider that the GB Packers game was like our NO Saints game..
Bad calls cost us the game, which we found out afterward that the calls were incorrect.
If we can finish strong like we started in 09 (in terms of wins) a lot of potential can happen.
Look on the up-side… The offense is starting to GEL and we have yet to get Rice back, could he contribute? Possibly.. In fact, he could be a solid producer..
Hell, you when even Bernard is making catches…. Its hard to say that the offense isn’t improving… Just seems like our defense is taking a few steps back now.. We need to get them back to form on how they were starting out.
what about the players that made improvement
Theres Mount Mac on left has done a whole lot better this year I mean we keep looking for negatives in playing,yea this is not how I wanted us to start.But every game we have been in it till the Stenger gal sang,every game has been hold your breath we might win this.Thats some good football there folks no it aint last years team,that team spoiled us making us demand that we blow out teams 35 to nothing every game.But we was in it every team that has played us had to wait to that last second ticked before celebrating.We have for the most part played some good ball,AP hasnt fumbled,Berrian has caught a pass or 2,Def gotta give some good props there.Harvin on K.O. returns is lightening in a bottle,Cammy has sure hands on P.R. and when thrown to has been a boon.We got Moss back,hopefully soon get Rice back we got ourselves a good team on paper unfortunatly game is played on turf.
Brett lol,what to say here,guy is 41 years old was down in florida empty hotel room,started tapping the room bar and Stenger came to mind.Now I am close to 10 years older then Favre and though she has a hot bod that face leaves much to be desired.But and its a little But cause I been with same Woman close 25 yrs but if I thought I could tap that a little mmm,And get away with it maybe we need a poll see how many of us would stray.Chances are I wouldnt but it would BE a hell of internal battle lol.
Now Brett made that mistake we all do blood rushed downward and thought process got discombobulated sent a few texts that he wanted to go over her playboy issue happens to all of us.He thought it was in the past and got brought up and now gotta pay the band.Do I think he texted ya,do I think he sent pics no he stupid but not that stupid.He has been hitting on Gals as long as his start record so he knows how not to harass.
Favre has to face something far worse then any Def he has ever faced,worse then any pass rush and sack can inflict,he has to face more then dollars lost.
He has to face his Wife which those of us that are married know what he is up againts,and to tell the truth he prolly begged friends left on Def of G.B. hurt me please.I can understand why his game is off,I think he strayed a tad but theres more to this story and we will know more if Stenger talks.If she does then theres a whole lot left unsaid if she doesnt it was a power play to the bank account.
Put your self in Bretts shoes I have, and know I couldnt do my job if I thought I would lose my wife and my name everything I worked for.
Now I am all for T.J. starting just cause I want see how he handles the team,hell at 2-4 what we got to lose not a damn thing.
What I learned...
Is that the Vikings front 4 on defense is not getting it done.
The defense seem unable to get off the field in every 3rd and short (4 or less yards) situation.
No matter how many weapons you have on offense, if the QB turns the ball over consistently you will lose more games than you win. Don’t believe me? Drew Brees threw 4 INTs, 2 pick 6s and the Saints lost a home game to the BROWNS!
Favre has his best season of his career statistically last year. This year he is having his worst. I don’t care how many yards AP gets, how good Harvin is, how good Moss is, how good Rice might be late in the season. If the QB is not accurate with the football, makes wrong decisions in every quarter of every game, throws INTs, takes drop back sacks instead of throwing it away (especially in field goal range). The Vikes will not be going anywhere near the play offs.
Next up New England. There simply must be some adjustments made on the pass rush because if there is no pressure on Brady then the Vikes should not even bother turning up. He’ll tear the secondary a new ass and put up 40+ points. The Pats will play to stuff the run. Their pass rush is none existent though. It won’t be a game where we can rely on AP. The QB whether it be Favre or T-Jack will HAVE to get it done.
My prediction is the Vikes will be 2-5 next week. The good thing is Green Bay also lose so we’ll still be in contention.
Another thing I just learned...
Favre QB rating. 68.0. Ranked 30th in the NFL. Detroit’s back up is doing a better job and so are a number of rookies. Oh dear.
then here's another thing for you to learn
his QB rating for tte season may be 68, but his rating for the last three games (yess even including the ugly game at lambeau) is 85.
Stats jockeys sometimes miss the nose on their face. The general trend is that he started really slow, but except for the blip in the last 20 minutes Sunday, he has actually been getting better. A stats jocky might forget that if any of a number of things had happened differently (Harvin being 6 inches less deep in end zone, us using cahllenges at right time, refrerees knowing the rule for possession, etc etc), Favre might be the hero right now instead of the goat.
I think the man needs to sit. But I think other people are tkaing things too far.
Taking things too far?
Really? Then what do you expect after 3 INTs and a pick 6? "Never mind Brett, we’ll get ‘em next time"?
IF this, IF that, IF, IF, IF… Here’s the stat that you might respect. 2-4. All of the loses have been close games of which Favre has had turnovers that led to points for the other team. A lot of QBs have been booed, benched and run out of town for less than that.
by UK Viking fan on Oct 26, 2010 8:03 AM CDT up reply actions
There are also 2 sentences after the ‘2-4’ in my previous post. Care to debate those? Do you think the Vikes will continue to lose close games if Favre continues to play like he has done? I do. There will always be near misses and some calls might not go your way. But the turnovers from QB have got to stop. Do you think they will?
Jeezuz man I’ve already posted like 10 times in the last 12 hours (including twice in four posts on this thread) that I also think this is a bad enough situation that he should sit for two weeks minimum. What the #e!! more do you want?
He's new :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Yep, I’m new and as I am 6 hours ahead of most of you guys (I live in London hence the name). I get a ton of posts to read all at once rather than being involved in a live conversation.
by UK Viking fan on Oct 26, 2010 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Cheers and welcome...
… nice to have a European Vikings fan here.
by HammeroftheGods on Oct 26, 2010 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree that Childress is one of the worst HCs in the league, though Chan Gailey and Mike Singletary are giving him a run for that honor. He seems to be the worst at game planning, utilizing talent, and in-game adjustments. I think the main job of a HC is to motivate his team, and Childress isn’t doing that at all. I can’t imagine his team has much more faith in his—ahem—talents than I do either.
Starting Jackson over Favre is probably at least a net gain, in that Jackson won’t be throwing it as much as Favre does. He might even make less of the awful, game-turning interceptions off boneheaded throws too. Last year’s Favre was on the money and his mistakes minimal. But the interception to end the NFC championship seemed to be the start of some putrid streak that he can’t seem to break. Does he think getting sacked is worse than throwing a pick 6? Does he think the ball will explode if he is sacked so he HAS to get rid of it? I’m dumbfounded by his decisions.
He is obviously a HOFer, better than Jackson, had his best season last year to almost get us to the SB and all that. But he’s been far more damaging than helpful this season. I don’t think Jackson could be any worse (I know I’ll regret that one:).
I'm not a Chilldress fan but...
… I firmly believe that he will be a great GM for a different organisation. Whilst I don’t like his effect on game day operations (and always found his benching of T-Jack a few years ago for “playing not to lose” hypocritical given his own play-calling) I think he does have a good eye for evaluating talent. I have a feeling that T-Jack would be a better QB if he had someone working with him in a smarter way in his earlier years, and that when he is gone and someone inherits Webb, Webb’s development will be helped by this.
I’m with the people who want to start T-Jack – not because I see him as a definite improvement (OK, he is on mobility, but not so much on arm-strength or decision making as far as we know), but because I want to know where we stand with regards to a back-up QB. I have a feeling that we might need to replace both Jackson and Favre next season (re-sign Perriloux to the practice squad after the UFL season?…)
PS – UK Viking Fan, where are you from mate? I’m in South London
by ViolentSilence on Oct 27, 2010 5:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Not even to mention
Did anyone else notice how many times Jared Allen was HELD?! There were at least two great stops he could have made (that I recall off the top of my head) and he couldn’t get off his guy cuz he was being held! Bullcrap, I say.
Nash don't lie
-Credit given to RMason, stolen by..er..permission given to GiantBehemoth
In fairness to Allen
Clifton has ALWAYS owned him and always 1 on 1. Even back to when he was on the Chiefs.
Fran Tarkenton
Tark played in a different era. His touchdowns exceeded thoughs of his peers almost yearly, and he had no Hall a Fame receivers.
As far as the draft goes: You didn’t see Buffalo drafting RBs high when they had OJ. But they did draft some Offensive lineman to block for him.
Unless T. Jackson is prepared to scramble I would rather see the third stringer in there. He already has more touch with the football than T. Jackson will ever have. I don’t see T. Jackson scrambling because he has been injury prone and he knows who ever comes in off the bench usually puts up better numbers.
alan bailey
Packers Fan
I’m avoiding studying for a test, so I read all these comments.
The UK fan seems to have the most level head and I think it’s cause he isn’t involved with everything that is football in America. I’m not saying he’s not very passionate, cause I’m sure he is. But you get so wrapped up in it when it’s all people talk about here that it’s hard to not lose perspective on the team.
I don’t think you can win anything other than a division title with TJack, if you want a title, it’s going to have to be with Favre. With that said, as a Packers fan, I didn’t want TJack to come in the second half on Sunday. There’s nothing for Jackson to lose, he’ll be great for a couple games if you start him and he’ll continue to be great until he faces a good team and people have high expectations of him… in which case he’ll fall flat on his face. I know for a fact Childress doesn’t have the stones to flat out bench Favre if he still has the consecutive games streak going (I probably wouldn’t either to be honest), but I think it’d be good to do it for 2 games. The problem is, if TJack does fall flat on his face, you’re out of the playoffs and Favre has no reason to come back for the rest of the season. Even if you put him in the second half of the next game… you know damn well he hates Childress so much that he probably wouldn’t listen to him and start doing his own thing
I think you’re right about T-Jack of a few years ago when he didn’t know how to recognise coverages and blitzes. Where he is now, we have no idea.
Something that occured to me in another thread – How did you feel as a Packers fan as you ran out of challanges? I remember the questionable spot that wasn’t challenged by the Packers staff and felt we had caught a break there. It seemed like the challenges were used to correct some pretty basic bad calls so how is that fair on a team if they run out red flags before the refs actually start doing their job properly? Really starting to think that the challenge system would be better off replaced by pure booth review for the whole game…
by ViolentSilence on Oct 27, 2010 5:56 AM CDT up reply actions
the challenges
worried me. I mean if Percy doesn’t land out of bounds in the endzone under 2 minutes and you don’t have a challenge… that’d have killed me. I agree with his not challenging it. However, I was yelling at the TV for him to take the FG cause that’d have made it 7pts and allowed the D a little breathing room. I think it was like a 53? yarder and if Crosby can keep it straight, he’s got the leg easily for it
A message from your wife....
I may be a few days behind…but I read your article…and the whole thing! I’m slowly gaining appreciation for the game. (Which of course will never even slightly compare to your enthusiasm).
I just hope that once in our lifetime together that your team will be good enough to make it to the Super Bowl. I know that I am getting ahead of myself. But, here’s to hoping.
I like you a WHOLE lot better when purple wins.
Aww :)
Proud contributor to Daily Norseman and SB Nation Minnesota
by Eric J. Thompson on Oct 27, 2010 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions
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