Open Thread: Free Agency; Trades
by jianfu on Mar 3, 2010 8:17 PM CST
Email
Print
I thought it'd be cool to have a catch-all thread for some moves around the league. Obviously bigger and/or Vikings-centric events could have an independent thread, but otherwise it'd be nice to have one central place as opposed to following several threads (or maybe that's just me).
And to start things off, both the Bears and Lions have been linked to Julius Peppers early on (perhaps, in the case of the Bears, a little too linked). Here's hoping he stays out of the division, as I'd prefer to avoid this twice a year:
Ole!
This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a community, that view is no less important.
194 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Tenders
Per ESPN, Minnesota has placed the first round tender on DE Ray Edwards and a 2nd on DT Fred Evans. Nothing on TJack as of yet.
Other RFA tenders:
Ronnie Brown, 1st
Jason Campbell, 1st
Kyle Orton, 1st
Brandon Marshall, 1st
Braylon Edwars, 1st and 3rd
Leon Washington, 2nd
Matt Moore, 1st and 3rd
Richard Marshall, 2nd
Jeff King, 2nd
Thomas Davis, 1st and 3rd
Antoine Bethea, 1st
Jared Gaither, 1st
Leron McClain, 1st
Bo Scaife, 1st
Kirk Morrison, LB, Raiders, 3rd (I’m not saying it’s a good idea to get him, but it’s possible. He can play WLB better than MLB. Thanks, Rube Chat.)
I agree, although Sergio Kindle would be a terrific OLB and available without trading up. Kindle couldn’t play MLB like Weatherspoon, and he doesn’t have the same leadership intangibles. But Kindle is a special player in our own right, and could do a great job as Ben Leber’s heir apparent.
But he mainly rushed
the passer and would have to convert. Maybe he could do it and I do agree he would be an excellent blitzer. But you should stick with your guns and your first instinct. Spoon is the real deal and he has plenty of experience dropping into coverage.
If we could make that trade with Tennessee I would do it. If we could get Spoon at 16 and a CB or Dan Williams if he falls to 30 that would be excellent.
I am hoping we can sign Lito Sheppard since he was released (or will be). That would lower the CB need on the draft list. We could get the guy you and I like, Walter Thurmond around round 5 which is where we should also have a comp pick for Birk.
Then I would definitely move up for Spoon. They may be able to get Pouncey or Griffin at the end of round as well.
All very interesting. Thurmond was very good against the run while a cornerback at Oregon, by the way.
I just don’t like the idea of trading up in this draft. Our goal should be to increase our net number of picks, as this is a deep draft, especially in rounds 1-4.
If Spoon doesn’t drop, Kindle, Taylor Mays, Jermaine Gresham, Brian Price, or Dan Williams will be there. Somebody good will be there at #30.
If we lose Edwards, we probably need to draft a 6’5 or taller left defensive end. Brian Robison is only 6’3 and will get handled by the long-armed right tackles. That means defensive ends like Corey Wootten, Austen Lane, Carlos Dunlap, or JPP.
This offseason, with all its uncertainty, must be hell on the players, especially the restricted free agents. For us fans it’s fun, but as a Vikings’ fan I honestly wish we could just bring back the whole team and have another run at it. Keep the team together. I love our team and don’t want it messed with too much. I hope our Vikings just realize they are our guys no matter what, and that we fans can’t wait to see them in action in purple again.
Chilly won't draft Weatherspoon
Weatherspoon has some character issues. Not a good locker room guy. He’s great just ask him. Tends to run his mouth alot. I’m not knocking his talent, the guy can play. I just don’t think he would pass on the Chillymeter. Then again Chilly might have a talk with him like he did with Percy. That has turned out to be a plus so far.
?
Character issues? He runs his mouth? I haven’t heard of this. He does have a loquacious personality, but that is part of his leadership intangibles that I like.
I have read
Weatherspoon can’t play well on turf.
That means, 8+ games a year he would not play at a full potential.
That would be a deal breaker if true. Do you have a link to that info? Thanks.
by medicineball on Mar 4, 2010 11:23 AM CST up reply actions
Ya - I mentioned this on another 1..
I got a name mixed up…
I guess I’m blind!
Just a 3rd round
for Morrison.. That is a STEAL. If I was on a team, I’d be all over that right now. The guy is one of the better defenders in the league, and since he’s been drafted he’s missed something like one or two games. As opposed to EJ Henderson who’s missed something like 12 these last couple seasons…
Seriously, I would cry tears of joy if the Vikings grabbed ahold of this guy. I know LB isn’t exactly a position of need for us, but he’s still young and he’s an impact guy. I’d be more comfortable with him than Henderson, who I’m starting to fear injury for every game he plays.
If he could make Frost cry tears of joy, then he must be good.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 10:58 PM CST up reply actions
I'd say he is
definitely worth the pick it’d cost to nab him from the Raiders.
Tarvaris Jackson
PFT says he will get the third round tender. Hopefully this is not accurate. He’ll probably be gone if it’s only a third. Bad decision.
Or
Perhaps the Vikings have come to a different thought process or plan incase Favre does retire..
"If you're gonna shoot, shoot, don't talk."
"You men are only risking your lives, while I am risking an almost-certain Academy Award nomination for Best Supporting Actor!"
"We have clearance Clarence. Roger Rodger, what's our vector Victor?"
Yes. Apparently, if Favre retires, we plan to go with Rosenfels at starter next year. Or trade for McNabb.
Or use the 3rd round pick
to draft a QB. Whether in the third round itself, or trading up higher in the first or second.
details
Apparently Jackson was tendered at the “original round” level. He was drafted in the 2nd. But because Evans was tendered at the 2nd round level, Jackson would bring only a 3rd round pick if he was signed away. The Vikings could have tendered Jackson at a higher level, but chose not to.
Well I guess that answers all of our questions about what the Vikes think about TJ
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
unlikely but possible scenario
Scenario: No other team bites on Jackson. The Vikings draft a second-tier quarterback in the draft. They all go into training camp, and the drafted guy looks Brian Brohm-like. Jackson makes the 53-man roster. The drafted guy maybe gets signed to the practice squad. I pump my fists in the air, and most Vikings fans are mad. While it would make most of my fellow fans angry, it might be the best for the team. Admittedly, that is not going to happen. A lot of teams would be glad to get Jackson for a third rounder. It’s sad.
He will be a decent back up QB
I’m not sure about him going out and being a starter though.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Vikings list
Tarvaris Jackson – 3rd round (we must like the 3rd round of the draft very well)
Fred Evans – 2nd round (hey we have depth at defensive tackle, but we still need to sign Jimmy Kennedy)
Ray Edwards – 1st round
Naufahu Tahi – right of first refusal
Karl Paymah – no tender made. He leaves the Vikings becomes an unrestricted free agent.
Ryan Cook and Eric Frampton: unknown
Ryan Cook update
Ryan Cook receives an original round tender which is great because he is an important depth player for the offensive line.
Still no word on Frampton.
Eric Frampton update
Apparently, Eric Frampton was tendered at the original round level. He was drafted in the 5th round by the Lions and would cost a 5th round pick if he is signed away.
by the way
That would cost a team a 3rd round pick if they signed him away because the 2nd round tender was put on Fred Evans and Cook was drafted in the 2nd.
Eric Frampton was originally drafted by the Raiders, then was with the Lions, and now the Vikings. He is a special teams contributor. On the defensive depth chart, he is the 3rd strong safety. Wikipedia says he is known for playing with a motor that never stops.
by medicineball on Mar 5, 2010 10:13 AM CST up reply actions
Who the heck writes that Wikipedia stuff anyway!?!
Clearly they have a Viking fan working on the Mighty Purple columns :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I like the tenders on the Vikings players
Jackson was tendered at the original-round level, and he was a second-round draft pick. But because the Vikings used a second-round tender on Fred Evans, they cannot receive second-round compensation for Jackson. If another team signs Jackson to an offer sheet and the Vikings don’t match the offer, the Vikings will get that team’s third-round pick.
Maybe they did it because they would not get a sniff if it was a second round tender. TJack is not a good fit for the Vikings anymore especially after what he has been through with Frerotte and Favre coming in to take his job IMO.
I like the move because maybe some team takes a chance on him and we get an extra third round pick that we can use on one of these young QBs maybe (LeFevour, Pike, Tebow, Snead, Skelton). It protects the Vikings return on investment in TJack so that they could at least get a draft pick for him. Next year if there is a new CBA he will be a UFA and can go wherever he wants. I doubt he would want to stay here.
Th Evans tender is curious but he almost made that money last year and they would have had to pay him damn near as much so they may have well put the tender on him just in case some team loses their mind and signs him. Not gonna happen though. Last year they gave him a qualifying offer and a team could have signed him and only given up a 7th round draft pick and nobody sniffed. That is how bad he is and how much other teams think of him. But the Vikings need a backup because the Williamses could be suspended the first four games and they have not resigned Kennedy yet. If I was Evans I would sign that tender immediately before they take it back.
Edwards is interesting and makes sense as far as giving him a moderate raise. They still could work out a trade for him with another team but this drives up the price a bit. For example, suppose we really want to draft Iupati or Dan Williams or Sean Weatherspoon no matter what. We could offer Edwards and our second round pick to Tennesee for their first which is #16. Tennessee does not have a second round pick and they need a DE. This also puts him in the AFC where we would not have to face him but once every few years. And we would still have our first round pick.
If no one tries to sign him and we do not trade him I expect to hear something along the lines of how he is unhappy with his contract situation.
One thing is for sure
They do not mind Jackson walking away. A third rounder is not how any team values its QBOTF. The Vikings are going in a different direction. The Panthers made a 1st and 3rd tender to Matt Moore. I can see a team easily paying a 3rd for Jackson.
Why go into a swan song? At this point, Tarvaris Jackson is all but assured to play for another team next year. While I am shocked and saddened, I wish Jackson well. T-Jack is a class act. I hope he goes to another team and tears up the NFL over there. I guess I have to put my faith in the brain trust at Winter Park, but to me right now this feels like Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon all over again—the Vikings are making a mistake.
Trading Edwards? Say it ain't so
If Edwards leaves for another team, the Vikings get that team’s first round pick. There is no reason for the Vikings to throw their own 2nd round pick in as well. I’d rather have him go to the Saints (nauseating as that thought is—I hate the Saints) than lose a 2nd round pick if we don’t have to.
For what it’s worth, Ray Edwards is a great player and I hope he stays with the Vikings. I love how he plays football.
Well maybe not a second but
Tennessee is not going to give up the #16 pick for Ray Edwards. Maybe someone towards the bottom of the first round will. I think the tender was just so they can give him a raise if they do not move him.
I want to be clear and state that I like him and I think he is good. I do have some reservations about his consistency but as many have said, maybe he is turning the corner or the lights are coming on. I just think that they do not want to pay him top dollar and he wants top dollar IMO.
So placing a first on him will drive up the price. Maybe they can get by with just giving Ray for #16 but I doubt it. I based that trade off of Ray being worth the value of our pick or slightly higher.
Either way if I could get Weatherspoon at 16 and a Dan Williams or Lamaar Houston at 30, I would call that a pretty damn good start to the draft. Then if they took John Jerry or Kyle Calloway in round 3 and Spievey in round 4. That is looking pretty good.
Spoon is worth the second round pick by himself.
Honestly
if somebody grabs Edwards for a first rounder, I will be happy. Well… a mix of emotions, I suppose. At one end, I will be happy because Edwards has been pretty up and down. On the other, I’ll be somewhat nervous because, assuming we use some pick in the draft on a DE, we’ll have a rookie who may not be as good as Edwards, ala Erasmus James.
Yeah that's my big worry as well
I think Edwards was a 4th round pick? He’s playing very will for that round. Although he is not the most consistant pass rusher he is a good run stuffer. Also, he is getting good progressions on his sacks. I don’t see any reason to toss him unless he just goes ape crap for the money.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
I see what you're saying now
Ray Edwards just turned 25 on January 1st. He is just now entering his prime. This past year he went from good to spectacular. He showed he was a clutch performer by having his biggest game in the playoffs. He is not another Jared Allen, but he is a proven performer worth at least a first round pick outright, and probably worth more. He will make the Pro Bowl some point soon.
If we lose Edwards, we still need a left defensive end. We can go back and forth on Robison, but I don’t think he can be effective as a starter in a 4-3 defense at left defensive end. He is just not tall enough and his arms aren’t long enough. Then we need to get a left defensive end, and we can’t draft Weatherspoon, we need to draft Edwards’ replacement.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 10:26 PM CST up reply actions
and hope he's as good as Edwards turned out to be after several years of playing
Drafting to fill a hole is always a scary proposition.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
I'm actually very happy they have Ray at a first
If someone does make a play we’re pretty well set up with it, but I think this is a statement telling Ray that he has a place in Minnesota for a while.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
He is being underpaid this year with a first round tender
and that will not sit well with him IMHO. The odds of him signing a long term deal next year are probably lower now. The chances of us putting the franchise or transition tag on him next year are slim and none. Too much money would be tied up in the defensive line.
I think the points you guys are making are good and I now think that he would be worth the #16 pick to Tennessee or #19 pick to Atlanta or #24 pick to Philadelphia or the #31 pick to Indy or the #32 pick to New Orleans. The point that Frost made is a good one and these teams may feel that Carlos Dunlap or Everson Griffin or Derrick Morgan may be busts when Edwards is a sure thing.
I really believe it just comes down to money and the Vikings do not want to tie up too much money on the defensive line. So they get a pick for him and bring in someone cheaper and HOPE he plays well along with Robison. All teams have to do it at some point and now it is our turn to lose a pretty good player.
The smart thing to do is to get a pick for him before you lose him rather than latting him walk away for nothing. But finding the right time to do that is the trick.
It should work out
If someone wants him enough, they can either sign him now, or offer the Vikings a trade.
If they don’t, he stays a Viking and the Vikings can re-sign him.
Either way, the Vikings have done a good service to Ray Edwards. They drafted him in the first round and now, right as he is just about to hit his prime, he is considered worthy of a first round pick. If Edwards leave, this Vikings fan would be sad, but at least we would get a 1st round pick. And if he stays, great.
by medicineball on Mar 5, 2010 12:09 PM CST up reply actions
correction: They drafted Edwards in the 4th round. I probably should take the rest of the day off. Have a good one, everybody.
by medicineball on Mar 5, 2010 12:10 PM CST up reply actions
yeah he's actually a steal from the fourth
got to like the later rounds when they pay off.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
I actually tend to agree with you Mark
I don’t see us signing him to a big contract next year that is for sure. If he continues to excel he will want big money and I dont’ think we can afford that. Although next year if Pat leaves it would open up room for Ray to stick around.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Evans
Are you sure he’s bad? I know the Vikings need defensive tackle depth, but I think he made the 45-man active roster for almost every game last year. With our defensive rotation system, he played some. He had only nine tackles, though.
He did not make the roster every game
http://www.kffl.com/player/19435/nfl/news
It shows here he was inactive for 2 games and I know he was inactive for week 1. That is 3 games right there.
He is a backup. I base my comment on the fact that not one team would sign him to a contract last year and give up a 7th round pick for him. What does that say?
Both
That’s why the Lions and Bears (and probably the Packers) will all want him. They have to outbid Dan Snyder, though, and at least he will drive up the price.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 10:12 PM CST up reply actions
Bears met with him but Packers aren't even considering it
he’s a great player but he would never come to GB because he had disputes with our d-line coach back when they were both in Carolina, leading him to get canned from being DC there. I honestly could never see TT spending that much on one player anyways.
by Donald Driver on Mar 3, 2010 11:28 PM CST up reply actions
plus or minus
I don’t know if that’s a plus for the Vikings, or a minus, but it’s kind of relieving to find out. Thanks.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 11:33 PM CST up reply actions
Peppers is RE
so he just destroyed McKinnie, who was benched at some point in that game… according to him he hurt his foot.
In defense of McKinnie
McKinnie hurt his foot in the Arizona Cardinals game. He manned up and only missed one play in that game. Recently, he was diagnosed with plantar fasciitis in both feet. That is a painful condition. Fortunately, he was prescribed only rest and orthotics. His prognosis is good, and he should be healed up and ready to go by training camp, OTAs, or whatever.
After the Cardinals’ game, some Cardinals said that McKinnie had a tell as to whether it was a pass or run. It made the news. He apparently took this personally and tried to get in a stance differently for the Carolina game. It turned out that aggravated his foot condition. The aggravation to the injury was bad enough to where it affected his play. After the Panthers game, Big Mac announced he was going back to his old stance. The Vikings offense did better after that. McKinnie manned up big time after he got hurt. We all saw that Artis Hicks was not very effective backing up McKinnie in the Panthers game. If McKinnie hadn’t been taking the bigtime painkillers he was on at the end of the offseason, there wouldn’t have been a run to the NFC championship game. After that game, he elected to go off the painkillers (which have side effects). At that point, the Miami situation and the Pro Bowl occurred. He is not blameless in that, but he was truly in too much pain to play.
The Vikings had approximately three offensive tackles on the practice squad this year. I really hope one of them is good enough to become the backup left tackle on the 53-man roster. It sounds like Artis Hicks will have an opportunity to start on another team, and the Vikings will lose him. If nobody from the practice squad can step up, we will have to draft an offensive tackle or look to free agency for the key position of backup left tackle.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 10:38 PM CST up reply actions
I didn't know that
but this isn’t close to the first time he’s had attitude issues, so have some crazy draft speculation: Vikings send McKinnie and swap first-rounders with Washington???
by Donald Driver on Mar 3, 2010 11:32 PM CST up reply actions
Goodness gracious
I hope not. We lose one Pro Bowl player and they get two potential Pro Bowl players. I would recommend passing on that.
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 11:34 PM CST up reply actions
Even if Sam Bradford is on the board?
Also Eric Berry in purple? I say good for both sides, but better for Washington
by Donald Driver on Mar 4, 2010 12:11 AM CST up reply actions
Good reply
I don’t know about Hicks, I mean did any of the other teams watch him play this year?
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
This is from vikingupdate.com
It is an answer from Brian Robison from his chat that he does with fans on a regular basis …
[Comment From Steven Steven : ]
Lets say Ray Edwards doesn’t play next season for the Vikings, can you step in an be a starting DE for the team?
Tuesday March 2, 2010 7:40 Steven
7:50
Brian Robison:
There has been a lot of talk that I may be too small to play LDE and that there is some question about my run stopping ability. Let me try to clear this up.
Up top I may not look 260+ lbs, but I make up for it because I have big legs. I played all last season between 262-265. That makes me bigger or the same as all our DE’s except Jayme Mitchell.
I do not brag about my abilities or say things for attention, I let my play do the talking. I also feel that I have been given the tag that I can’t play the run, unfairly. I started four games as a Rookie and stood up against the run just fine with the exception of some plays in the Denver game, that I can admit to. I also made plays in the Run game this year with limited playing time.
I don’t make excuses, I admit when I screw up and I give it my all every play. I apologize for this being long winded, but I feel like it as something that needed to be said. As far as my pass rush I think my tape speaks for itself.
Robison is itching to start and deserves a shot. I would be very comfortable with him playing at LDE with Micthell and a rookie to back him up.
In the end, I think that the Vikings and Ray Edwards must be far apart in negotiations.
Good analysis.
I do not question Robison’s heart. I love how he plays football. It does appear that Ray Edwards will be one of the most attractive RFAs in the NFL and will probably be gone as a number of other teams really want a defensive end. I don’t think we have to chip in a 2nd rounder to convince a Tennessee or New York Giants or Falcons to take him. They will just sign Edwards and then the Vikings will have to seriously think about whether to match.
My preference is to keep Ray Edwards and Brian Robison for the entire season and the ongoing future. They are both great. It would be a shame to lose either one.
Realistically, though, based on the 1st round tender of Edwards, Robison should be expecting to have an opportunity to start at LDE next year, because Edwards will be a hot commodity on the free agent market. It could easily happen. I just hope he’s good enough against those long-armed tackles he would face.
We also have Jayme Mitchell, and he should take on that same “opportunity to win the job as a starter” mentality. He was inactive for most of the games last season, but that was last year.
I hope Edwards comes back. Based on the tender, though, there will probably be a wide-open competition in training camp for the starting job at LDE.
Wouldn’t it be interesting if the Bucs signed Edwards? Their owner is said to be having financial problems. It’s not going to happen, but who would you take at #3 overall?
by medicineball on Mar 3, 2010 10:52 PM CST up reply actions
Bucs not going to happen at #3
I dont see that happening. What I see happening is that the Vikings will trade him for a 2nd round pick & 5th round pick. I think there are teams interested but that do not want to give up their first. I could see the Bucs giving up their second and sixth. I really believe the Vikings made this tender offer to drive up his price. I could only see a few teams giving up their first and that would be Philly at 24, Indy at 31, and the Saints at 32.
I have not heard anything to be honest
I just get the feeling from reading the tea leaves if you will.
My questions to all of the Edwards supporters is …
Why haven’t the Vikings given him a new contract yet if he is so valuable and an up and coming defensive end?
When have they ever done that with one of their own players that they wanted to keep?
I know they are in their rights with the CBA situation but why make a player unhappy when you want to keep him, supposedly?
Why did they only place the first round tender on him instead of the first and third if they really wanted to keep him?
There is about a $600,000 difference between the two offers which would take up most of the taxes on the higher offer.
IMHO I think they want someone else to take him either giving up their first round pick or trying to work out a trade that includes a second round pick and something else. This has to be insulting to Ray considering it is not even the highest tender offer they could give him (i.e., the most money they could give him while retaining his rights). I would not be too happy if I was Ray and I damn sure would not sign another deal with the Vikings.
I also believe that they feel like they have to see what Robison can do before he becomes a UFA next year. Because he will want to go and get the chance to play every down. So they could lose him too after next year.
Well I hate to say it but Ray is not Jared Allen
So I don’t see how he can be getting all crazy upset. It would be like TJ getting upset for being a third. (Oh wait I bet he’s piping mad now)
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Nice points. The other, less likely scenario, is that they trade Robison and keep Edwards.
Most likely, some team will sign Ray Edwards and the Vikings will get that team’s 1st round pick.
by medicineball on Mar 4, 2010 11:40 AM CST up reply actions
There are a few decent DE prospects
Expected to go Round 1 I think…..
Point by point:
Why haven’t the Vikings given him a new contract yet if he is so valuable and an up and coming defensive end?
The Vikings haven’t given him a new contract because his contract is yet to expire. The process will determine the market. Don’t fault the Vikings for being prudent.
When have they ever done that with one of their own players that they wanted to keep?
When have they ever been in this situation before? The situation with the CBA has been a long time coming, and teams have been formulating a strategy for working in the new atmosphere.
I know they are in their rights with the CBA situation but why make a player unhappy when you want to keep him, supposedly?
Again, you need to point to facts. How angry is Edwards (criticism of Goodell withstanding).
Why did they only place the first round tender on him instead of the first and third if they really wanted to keep him?
If Edwards is in such great demand, do you think the inclusion of a an additional third round pick is going to discourage teams from siging him?
The fact the Vikings are trying to maximize their leverage in terms of Edwards shouldn’t offend him in the slightest. The only beef Ray has is that he is forced to be an UFA due to the CBA expiring.
you mean RFA.
Personally, I hope we keep him and I hope the rumors of CT leaving are just that.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
His contract has expired
He signed a four year deal when he was drafted. So the contract expires at the start of the new year. The Vikings still have his rights though with the current status of the CBA. So I have to beg to differ with you on that one.
Also the additional third round pick is EXACTLY what stops teams from trying to sign him. Not many players get signed away from their teams when the highest tender is put on them. I think we did it with Hutchinson but that was a franchise tender. No one is giving up a first & third for Ray IMHO.
Let me ask this …
Are the Vikings going to do this with Sidney Rice next year? If there is no new CBA, Rice will have to wait another year because he would need 6 years to reach free agency. So, if that is the case, will the Vikings “maximize their leverage” by not giving him a contract and placing the highest tender on him of a first and third?
I hope not. And this is my point. If you really like the player then get him signed.
It is either they do not really want to keep him or he is asking too much. Do I know this for a fact? No. But logic dictates one of these two possibilites to me.
I do not see the Vikings as the kind of organization to low ball a player just because they can. Regardless of what any fan like myself says here or on any board, the players in the locker room know what time it is and it does not go over well.
The franchise tag for a DE this year is above 9 mil right?
Ray Edwards is at least an above average DE IMO.
So by that logic he at least deserves 4.5 to 5 mil for the 2010 season.
And he is going to get 2.5 or something from the Vikings.
I dont care what anyone else says, he will be underpaid at that amount and I expect him to be not too happy about it. He can get injured on any play and his career could be over.
I don’t like it and I would rather get something for him now than underpay the man.
Be fair.
fair points
All fair points.
Another factor in play is that a first round draft pick this year looks relatively good compared to other years. Even in late part of the draft, you can pick up a really good linebacker, running back, or other player. Maybe they love Edwards, but think they could draft a player in the first round who would actually be better.
or they want two first round draft picks so they can go after one of the starting QB's out there.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
I agree with you 100% I'm not sure what they are trying to do
It’s actually wierd I almost suspect some kind of owner get together to flush players out and then underpay them or something. Make this suffer this year so they want to sign something sooner rather than later. I really dont’ understand them getting rid of Ray unless it’s a cap worry in the future, and even then Pat will probably be gone before we run into a cap issue. The other idea is tha tRobinson is better than we know and they want to play him. But this is a SB ready team here why break what’s working.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Correct me if I am wrong, but the football year ends tonight at 11:01 CST. That would mean he is under contract until then. Of course he wants to get paid. The 2.51 million dollar offer doesn’t close the book on a longer term contract. In fact, it is the beginning of the process. It says is that the Vikings are willing to allow Edwards to get the best deal possible, be it here or elsewhere…and he can’t be mad at that!
Right. For example, the Steelers put a franchise tag on Casey Hampton a few weeks ago. Hampton had earlier said that the never wanted a franchise tag and would be mad if he ever got tagged. After the tagging, though, he said he was OK with it as long as it led to a longer term deal. It did. They signed a long-term deal after that.
Doing it this way allows Edwards to test the market and determine what price he would fetch on the open market. The Vikings can match any offer if they want. The RFA tender offer is probably a floor. Most likely he will end up being paid more than that in 2010, and will have a contract extension in hand somewhere.
I can hope
It would be irritating to have the Vikes starting to low bal their players.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Many questions, few answers
Why haven’t the Vikings given him a new contract yet if he is so valuable and an up and coming defensive end?
Every team would like to negotiate new contracts but players are restricted from day one. I would think they all want to test the market?
But there is no easy answer to that one because there could be a lot of reasons most of which are not known to us. But I will say this. You can ask that same question of each time and their star player RFAs. It simply is a different kind of labor year.
Why did they only place the first round tender on him instead of the first and third if they really wanted to keep him?
I looked at each and every team. Each one had a different strategy for dealing with RFAs. San Diego just gave just about everybody a 1st and 3rd designation and decided hey, its not our doing. Don’t blame us.
The Vikes seem to low ball everyone and say Hey, go test the market. We can decide later whether to match. I believe they want to clean this up after free agency ends.
This will be a hard year for all the players and the coaches and front offices. I am thinking that the Vikes don’t mean anything personal to Ray. He did get the highest of anyone.
My last point is the draft position we have. If we get a draft pick it is a higher pick than we have now. That makes the pick more valuable than a pick given by the Vikings to Denver. I think that plays into it.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
Sorry that should read
You can ask that same question of eachTEAM and their star player RFAs. It simply is a different kind of labor year.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
hard year
It’s a hard year on the whole country. In the NFL front office, they laid off a few hundred employees. If some football player doesn’t get paid all the millions of dollars he wants for one year, that isn’t ideal for him but in this economy getting paid a million dollars to do anything sounds pretty dang good.
yes it is difficult for all.
But its not the economy for the NFL its greed. Owners want more of what they gave the players. Players don’t want to give anything back.
It will be a hard year on the football FAN.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
Quarterback 2011
One more thing. With Jackson tendered only at the 3rd round level (dumb), and Favre likely to be retired after the 2010 season, that leaves only Sage Rosenfels at quarterback. Maybe I have read the signs wrong, but Rosenfels seems to have the lock on the highly underrated job of NFL backup quarterback. I don’t think he will be expected to start in 2011 unless circumstances make it so.
That means the Vikings are going to make a big move at quarterback, and probably this year. That means we will see the Vikings draft a quarterback early this year. Tebow, Colt McCoy, Dan LeFevour, Tony Pike, or Daryll Clark. We are apparently betting the farm on one of these scrubs. I hope this goes well.
The other possibilities are less likely, such as a trade.
Jason Campbell
Jason Campbell is available for a first. That may not be bad but the Vikings may be able to do the same thing as I expect will happen with Edwards and that is give up a 2nd and a 5th for him. Or they could trade Campbell for Edwards straight up.
I doubt any move on Campbell happens though.
I don't think Campbell
is worth a first or a second even. I’d rather we just kept TJ as their games are somewhat similar, but Jackson has the advantage of being familiar with our offense/receivers etc…
Why not Campbell?
He has put up better numbers than tjack with half the talent on offense. He is completing over 60% of his passes and has never thrown more picks than td’s in a season.
He is 6’5" tall and has better rushing stats than Tjack.
A late first round pick for Campbell is not too much, as we can get 6-7 good years out of him. Let him sit behind Favre for a year, learn a few things.
I haven’t watched him play much, but his numbers are MUCH better.
by Bjorno on Mar 4, 2010 4:47 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Oh, and he is either more durable, or he knows how to slide because he has played 52 out of 55 games since he became the starter.
by Bjorno on Mar 4, 2010 4:59 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
I like Campbell. He’s had to play in three different offensive systems with limited talent around him, yet he’s still been pretty solid. I think he could be a good Qb under the right circumstances.
by packallday555 on Mar 4, 2010 9:46 PM CST up reply actions
Jason Campbell
I like him too… I think that in the right circumstance, he could really blossom into a great QB.
But the key phrase is, ‘right circumstances’, which includes the question, how long will it take? And what will it take to settle him out from the damage that the Redskins ineptitude inflicted on him?
Essentially he works out to be another Tarvaris Jackson; a project and a gamble. And in his case, a very expensive gamble. Much better to wait til next year and see what things look like for that young man.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Mark isn't our 1st (#30) kinda like a 2nd?
In draft actuality we would be giving like a high 2nd for Campbell?
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
Our first is almost equal to a high second
but not quite according to the old trade chart. Pick 30 is 620 points and pick 33 is 580 points. Pick 132 in the 5th round is 40 points. Their may be a difference.
I like Campbell a lot and I could wait one more year for him when he will be a UFA next year no matter what.
But there are risks there too. If the Vikings really like him and think he can take over for Favre then I would go for it.
But I would offer Washington next year’s first and TJack.
yeah there's a deal Washington is salivating for.
Although next years draft might be weak with alot of underclassmen coming out into this one, and the unknown of the CBA.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Why would you pay more than they are asking?
If we can get a QBOF for a #30 pick why would you pay more than that. There is at least a 29/32 shot that next years draft choice for the Vikings will be higher than #30 and I don’t have to give up a player. RFAs are usually reasonably priced by draft picks. Brandon Marshall for a #1 is a good deal if you like BM. Shean Merriman for a 1st and 3rd is a good deal if you like Merriman. A #30 pick for a QBOF is the best bargain I ever heard of. This same trade for Detroit would cost them the #2 overall pick in the draft. so why wouldn’t you just pull the trigger and get a guy in here.
Now if our coaches don’t like Campbell I totally understand.
In fact all of the bottom teams in the draft should be looking hard at the RFAs. When will we ever have the opportunity to spend each of our bottom round choices for young, reliable, experienced players at the positions we need.
I would be willing to use as many as we need.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
by lifelongvike on Mar 6, 2010 12:32 PM CST up reply actions
I don’t believe in the points system for trading draft picks. I think a lot of NFL GMs don’t, either.
by medicineball on Mar 6, 2010 12:34 PM CST up reply actions
Yep, that's my read on the tea leaves too :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Yeah I was thinking that too MB.
Although with Chilly’s love for everything phillidelphia we could be seeing a strong shot at McNabb.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Daryll Clark
Apparently Daryll Clark, Penn State quarterback, a guy who is on the Vikings’ radar for the draft this year, is a “long-time” Vikings fan. He suffered through the ’98 championship game just like us. He also had a comment on Favre back in August 2009:
“Yeah, Favre,” Clark said. You could tell frustration was ready to foam from his mouth.
“He’s really made this football thing into a soap opera, and I really don’t like that. I really don’t think that was cool.
“Obviously, he’s a veteran, and he’s a really good player. He don’t show up to camp. They gave him a nice piece of change, though. I hope he does well. But it’s like, what does your wife have to say about this, man?”
http://www.collegian.psu.edu/blogs/footblog/2009/08/vikes_signal_caller_has_gone_t.aspx
I give him a pass. I don’t think this means anything bad. He was 21 years old or something. Every Vikings fan on the planet was going through some crazy, tumultuous emotions in August 2009, I originally hoped Favre would not come to Minnesota, but when the plane landed I changed my mind. All that is in the past now. If Clark came to the Vikings, and Favre returns, I bet they would have a good laugh over this if it came up at all.
Moreover, the media has given a slanted view of Favre, and when the truth is learned, it is all understandable. Brett Favre only announced his retirement in Green Bay because he was forced into it by Ted Thompson. After his year with the Jets, he announced his retirement because he initially didn’t want to have surgery on his arm and take painkillers. After giving it serious thought, he chose to have the surgery. He came out of retirement in 2009 almost immediately after he healed up from the surgery. While for fans, it seemed like a soap opera, I think Favre was always being honest. He does change his mind, but that is part of his personality and his somewhat unpredictable nature helps him as a quarterback.
On Daryll Clark being a Vikings fan, I think it helps his draft stock. He would be a guy who would have an extra source of motivation as a Viking.
The media has a tendency to leave things out and/or exaggerate stuff
Cheers, Complaints, homerism and bashing of mediocre pop musicians in 140 Characters
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding
by Kevin Sellathamby on Mar 4, 2010 1:49 PM CST up reply actions
what do you think?
Rams safety Oshiomogho Atogwe gets right of first refusal tender, im not really sure what that is, and is able to hear offers from whomever he wants. I dont know much about him but his stats are more appealing that what the Vikings have now. Also Jamal Williams was cut by the chargers, he is 33 and coming off of an injury but at the right price would he be worth throwing in the mix to make it a Williams trio? That could also postpone the possibility of taking a DT in the draft a few years.
questions
I’m not familiar with Atogwe. What about him puts him above Madieu Williams or Tyrell Johnson? Does Atogwe play SS or FS? Was he on IR last year? What is his injury history?
Jamal Williams. He would be a two-gap defensive tackle, I think. Thus, he could backup Pat Williams this year, get a bunch of playing time, and be the starter next year. At 33, soon to be 34, how much does Jamal Williams have left? What is the deal with the DUI charge that was dropped last year? He is listed at 348 lbs. Pat Williams is listed at 314. Is that OK?
Thanks.
Atogwe is a great player, one of my favorite safeties in the game.
Oshiomogho was selected by the St. Louis Rams in the third round (66th overall) in the 2005 NFL Draft. On July 28, 2005 Atogwe to a three-year $1.6 million contract with the Rams.4
In his rookie year he played in 12 games, finishing the year with 11 tackles, one sacks, an interception, and a fumble recovery. The following season, he finished the campaign with 72 tackles and three interceptions and forced five fumbles. In the 2007 season, Atogwe had a team and NFC-high 8 interceptions along with 75 tackles and one touchdown and forced two fumbles. On April 22, 2008, the Rams tendered Atogwe a one-year deal for $2.017 million which he signed to remain with the club. 5 Atogwe is one of the rising players in the NFL at the free safety position and in the 2008 season he recorded 5 interceptions to lead the Rams once again. He also recorded 83 tackles and forced six fumbles.
On February 19, 2009, the Rams used their franchise tag on Atogwe. The tag is the non-exclusive franchise which allows other teams to negotiate with Atogwe but if any signed him that team has to give the Rams two first-round picks as compensation and as part of the designation Atogwe will receive a one-year tender of $6.342 million 6
On July 15, 2009 the Rams signed Atogwe to a one-year, $6.342 million contract.7
On December 9, Atogwe was placed on Injured Reserve due to a dislocated right shoulder.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
Atogwe is a four-year player who started every game at free safety and led the Rams in interceptions last year with five. He has steadily developed into a dependable and productive starter along the backend of the Rams’ defense. He has adequate size and speed with good instincts for the position. He gains depth quickly in his backpedal, showing quick feet and good balance. He does a good job of reading routes quickly and anticipating throws by the quarterback to get a good jump on the ball from the deep middle. He has adequate burst in transition with good closing quickness on receivers running out of their breaks. He can flip and accelerate with efficient angles to the ball and he has a good feel for playing the ball in the air. Atogwe is better on the move using his instincts and reactions to drift and take away angles. He is developing better confidence reading route combinations, but still needs to maintain discipline to prevent the big plays from opening up in the passing game. He’s not afraid to take chances, which can be detrimental at times against speed receivers. In run support, he is developing into a good tackler with a knack for jarring the ball loose on arrival.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
As for Jamal Williams
I can’t say much, but at least it would make the Williams Wall alive for a few more years.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
+1
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Mar 4, 2010 7:23 PM CST up reply actions
+1
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Mar 4, 2010 7:23 PM CST up reply actions
Williams is an experienced NT who possesses very good size and strength for the position. He is a physical run defender who is tough to move off the ball and does an excellent job of occupying blocks up front. He can stack and shed single blocks easily and often commands double teams to keep LBs free to run to the ball. At 33, his age is a concern, but he has rare size and strength and he plays with good hand use to make plays in a small area. As a pass rusher he lacks overall speed and quickness. He relies mostly on power moves to create a strong push up the middle but has a hard time clearing contact quickly to generate sack production.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
I was just thinking
Something really unlikely to happen, but I wonder how it would work out.
Get Pat and Jamal to play DT and move Kevin to LDE.
With the two ridiculously big Williams filling up the middle, it would be IMPOSSIBLE to run against, and Kevin’s great feel for how to restrict running lanes and penetrate gaps, together with his natural strength and quickness, and his variety of pass-rush moves he could be awesome playing DE.
The Great Williams Wall of Minnesota + Jared Allen = Total Domination.
What you think ?
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
three-technique
We need one nose tackle and one three-technique defensive tackle in our scheme. The latter is a penetrator guy. In our defense, that role is played by Kevin Williams. We would have to alter the scheme to use two nose tackles. I doubt that would work as well, but it would be appealing in some ways. Throw in Terrence Cody for three big guys in the middle.
Moving Kevin Williams to LDE could work because Kevin Williams is so good. Maybe we pick up Brian Price or Dan Williams in the draft, or sign Tommie Harris if he is let go. Then that guy plays the three-technique.
But if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
Kevin does something very important in the pass defense
he collapses the pocket. A QB knows his tackles are going to ride the DE’s to his outside and hopefully behind him, but he’s ok with this as long as the guards and centers can hold their men close to the line of scrimmage. Basically it allows the QB to step forward into the pocket to get away from the pressure coming from the sides. Stepping forward is great because it goes with the throwing motion and you don’t lose vision of the field. Now if KW is pushing his guard around like a shopping cart that open space is no longer there. Now the QB has to roll out to a side, which makes his throwing motion a bitmore sketchy and removes parts of the field from his vision.
All in all just becasue a DT doesn’t make sacks doesn’t mean what he’s doing (if he’s doing it) isn’t very important.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Hope for Jackson to return
A Yahoo blogger/reporter suggests that no team will sign Jackson to an offer sheet.
If that is true, he is coming back into training camp! This is good. He’s an able backup and has a lot of potential. The smart thing to do is just stay with him and see what happens. In the worst case scenario, we have a good backup quarterback, and in the best case scenario, we have a great quarterback.
Even if Jackson is signed by another team to an offer sheet, the Vikings will have a right to match. I hope that is the case. Man, I really do.
We should also bring in a quarterback like Sheehan, Daryll Clark, or somebody. They can be on the practice squad this year.
Ok I'm going to have to have an intervention here.
If no one signs him it’s not becuase he’s good. People don’t bypass good QB’s who have a 3rd round tender on them.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Maybe I am overvaluing Jackson. I just think a team like the Raiders, Browns, Bills, or Seahawks would be smart to make that move. As long as Jackson gets into training camp and has a legitimate shot to make the team, then I am happy. I just think he’s got a big future, and it should be with the Vikings.
It's a...
Brad Johnson/Rich Gannon vs. Wade Wilson/Steve Bono/Brent Pease/Gino Torretta/Chad May argument.
Does TJack fall into the former or the latter?
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Mar 4, 2010 7:22 PM CST up reply actions
Former.
T-Jack can be a great quarterback in this league. I think people forget that last year was only his 4th year.
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Mar 4, 2010 7:25 PM CST up reply actions
You may be too young to remember Wade… I think TJack = Wade
He’s peaked. Time to cut him loose.
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Mar 4, 2010 7:50 PM CST up reply actions
Wade Wilson
He was great for one year, and ended up with a Super Bowl ring or two as a backup for the Cowboys.
Even if you are a hard-core Tarvaris skeptic, don’t you see him as a good backup?
Honestly?
Not really, he’s not consistant enough for me as a coach. What I need in a back up is a guy who won’t lose games. He’s there to throw safe accurate passes and can be counted on when the starter goes down. After four years I don’t think TJ is a safe QB, your not reallly sure which one is coming out on Sunday, it could be the rabbit who runs everywhere and throws it in the ground. Or it could be that he has great day.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
He has 21 career TD, and 18 career INT plus the one INT in the playoff game. He is battle-tested, including in the playoffs. I don’t Rosenfels has been in the playoffs.
Tarvaris Jackson isn’t at Wade Wilson’s level yet, but he is getting there.
I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree
again. I don’t think TJ was a solid reason his team went to the play offs that year especially as he was removed from starting for Gus. I think AD was the reason we went.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Its time to move on MB. The coaching staff has spoken. Hes unfixable.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
by lifelongvike on Mar 5, 2010 12:21 PM CST up reply actions
Wade Wilson was nothing to brag about...
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
The Browns didn’t tender Brodney Pool. He’s a 26-year-old safety and he’s pretty good. And since he’s a non-tendered RFA, my understanding is the Vikes could pursue him if they wanted, right?
According to some espn.com scouters:
He has very good size for the position and is fluid in all his movements, but his production does not meet his potential at this point. He has soft hands for the interception and covers plenty of ground, but rarely does he come up with the big play. His overall physicality for the safety position is just average at best.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
More on Pool
Brodney Pool’s fifth season with the Cleveland Browns was ended prematurely by a concussion. It doesn’t appear he’ll get a sixth one.
The safety, whose NFL career has been threatened by a series of head injuries, was not given a second-round tender by the club on Thursday, making him an unrestricted free agent.
Pool, a second-round pick in 2005, missed Cleveland’s final five games in 2009 after sustaining at least his fourth known concussion. The easygoing 25-year-old made 10 starts before getting hurt.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
Phillip Buchanon
Phillip Buchanon the nine-year pro, was released by the Lions, making him fair game for the Vikings.
He was the one who caught AD from behind last year and popped the ball out. While he is not great, and getting cut by the Lions is a warning sign, maybe he is a guy who can provide depth at cornerback this year.
I hope the Packers will consider talking to him. He had a bit of a down year this year but Detroit did have one of the worst pass rushes in the league this year.
by packallday555 on Mar 4, 2010 10:40 PM CST up reply actions
Hey
The mock draft we’re doing on DN still needs a Packers rep. Would you like to draft for the Packers?
by medicineball on Mar 4, 2010 11:22 PM CST up reply actions
Crazy! He and Revis could be an absolute nightmare.
by packallday555 on Mar 4, 2010 10:40 PM CST up reply actions
Jets' 2011 3rd round pick
It could become a 2nd round pick if the Jets and Cromartie do well.
That might be a tougher defense next year.
by medicineball on Mar 4, 2010 11:20 PM CST up reply actions
Wow.
From a Vikes’ standpoint, CB was a potential draft target for the Jets (picking right before Minny). So maybe this is a benefit.
You are correct. It will make another CB available sooner to us if we go that route.
In fact now they will take a player that we had targeted. Might force us to take a great CB.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
by lifelongvike on Mar 5, 2010 12:28 PM CST up reply actions
He's probably going to start the year on PUP
I’m be shocked if anyone (including Indy) offers him much more than the vet minimum.
Luck is probability taken personally, clutch is probability attributed to individuals.
by shake n bake on Mar 5, 2010 11:31 AM CST up reply actions
Reality check
Very interesting ideas floating around as to all the tendered RFAs we can go after.
A couple of thoughts.
T-Jack was tendered for a 3rd. He might come back but the Vikings have decided he is not valued as their future. Period. We have been told. We must move on to a different QBOF.
Atogwe was franchised last year. That means that even at the lowest tender the Rams have to pay him 110% of his 6 Million salary (guaranteed). A shoulder injury probably won’t be career ending but do we want to invest high dollar of 6 million per year into the safety position? The fact that we didn’t go after Cromartie tells me the Vikes are OK with their backfield. They will build through the draft. I will say that Atogwe does appear to be a very good player.
Would it really be a good idea to switch the positions of the best defensive line in football?
Since the Vikings have the players to win now I don’t foresee them adding Older players to the roster. They need to win now and build depth for the future. Most teams are using this non-capped season to rid themselves of problem contracts and older players they could not afford to cut before. Do we really want their garbage?
I am always suspect of taking players from losing franchises ( Rams,Lions,Oakland) because of the losing mentality they bring to the locker room. Players that excell on bad teams don’t always do as well when confronted with better competition in their own organization.
Just some thoughts.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
Delhome was cut!
We should totally go after him then we wouldn’t need Favre! Ok kidding aside I hope he’s not in purple next year.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
He hasn’t been the same since Tommy John surgery.
by medicineball on Mar 5, 2010 12:45 PM CST up reply actions
Ryan Sims
Ryan Sims guard, Seahawks, was tendered at the 4th round level. The Seahawks had a bad offensive line last year, in which he started 14 games. He is familiar with zone-blocking. He might add depth, but he would have to be an upgrade over Herrera, and I don’t see that.
Hard to find any player tendered below 1st round that is an upgrade for the Vikes.
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
by lifelongvike on Mar 5, 2010 12:26 PM CST up reply actions
Why isn't anyone thinking Bethea, Safety for Indy, with a first?
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
We’ve only got one first round pick. With this draft, we could get a great starter for that first round pick. Isn’t Bethea pretty good, though?
by medicineball on Mar 5, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
Ryan Clark
well if it's over 12 mil for four years he's out of reach
This sucks, watching teams suck up big players while we just watch…
Brandon Marshal might be heading to the seahawks…
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
It'll be OK grime...
The Bears needed to find LOTS of help… The Vikings are not in the same position.
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Mar 5, 2010 1:54 PM CST up reply actions
yeah still doesn't mean I don't like it
Like watching a poor kid get a present. Doesn’t mean he doesn’t deserve need it but I want one too. And not some lame booby prize either.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
boobies...
Cutler’s got ’em!
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on Mar 5, 2010 11:36 PM CST up reply actions
That was just... icky
I didn’t need that image in my head, or my coffee spat out all over the keyboard. Have a little consideration for your fellow DN’ers, man!
:)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I’ve seen some people posting about trading picks for RFAs.
How about we trade our first for Jared Gaither, a 23 years old starting LT for the Ravens ? He has tremendous size, particularly with his extreme height (6’9, 340) and overall length, to man the blind side.
We could even trade McKinnie for a second and we would not only get rid of a PR nightmare player but also not lose ANY quality in the O-Line, get a younger player and have no more problems with Big Mac.
We could also trade our first for Evan Mathis, a 28 years old Bengals G.
Mathis is a run blocking beast that also didn’t give up a single sack last season.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
Gaither is a good LT
However he runs a power blocking system not a zone and I’m not sure if he’s fast enough or smart enough (got kicked out of college for cheating) to run our system well. They were looking at him over on the chedder heads site and I have to think if they are leary of taking him (and their tackles look like swiss cheese) then we should be doubly worried especially since the one we have now is a pro bowler.
Nah use the first pick for something we need like an OG, CB, or MLB.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
If we have to face Peppers and Vandebosh twice a year won't be needing a pro bowl tackle?
Winning is not everything but it sure feels like it sometimes
In my point of view, McKinnie did not deserve to be a pro bowl tackle last year.
So yeah, we do need a pro bowl tackle to face Peppers and Van Den Bosch, but I don’t see McKinnie as that player.
I think we all remember what happened to McKinnie when he faced Peppers last season…
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
Exactly
At least with McKinnie we have somebody who can block anybody. He has successfully blocked Peppers before. in the Carolina game, he was not healthy and was preoccupied by the “stance giving away the play” thing.
Probably the #1 thing we can do this year to help our offense is to keep Bryant McKinnie healthy. Tied or close to that would be to keep Steve Hutchinson healthy.
We need to add depth to the offensive line. If we could draft Charles Brown or Roger Saffold, maybe in the first round, he could spell McKinnie during part of the season so that he was healthy for the big games.
Good point.
As usual, I had forgotten to consider the blocking system he plays.
But, as usual, I don’t see that as a redlight.
I may be over optimistic, but I don’t see a need at MLB.
I truly believe EJ will be back for OTA’s and Brinkley has lots of potential and is yet improving.
SKÖL VIKINGS!
SHOW YOUR HORNS!
Ugh.
Dont bring him here, we dont need this
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Mar 5, 2010 10:11 PM CST up reply actions
Offensive tackles
If Artis Hicks leaves, we might look to a veteran as a backup offensive tackle.
Two veterans are well-known, and available: Orlando Pace and Tra Thomas. They might be OK as backups.
Lando looked SO
Bad with the Bears last year. False start after false start. One that ended up costing them the game against the Falcons or 49ers I think. Now Thomas would be nice
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Mar 5, 2010 10:12 PM CST up reply actions
Pace looked B-A-D
I understand he would be a back up and hopefully not play, but I would be hoping a LOT that he would never play. As well I don’t think I would be happy spelling McKinney with him. I think whoever our QB is will get smashed with him on his blind side.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Rhys Lloyd
Former Golden Gopher kicker Rhys Lloyd will meet with the Vikings . Chip Scoggins says he could be signed as a kickoff specialist.
Lloyd
Lloyd believes that the Panthers don’t want him anymore
Could be for our gain.
by medicineball on Mar 6, 2010 11:57 AM CST up reply actions
That would be nice ... If he's really better
Player -——- KO / AVG / TB / RET / AVG
Longwell -— 98 / 63.7 / 5 / 91 / 22.6
Lloyd -———72 / 66.7 / 21 / 51 / 24.8
While he has 4 times as many touch-backs, how much of that is attributable to the Panther’s playing lower quality teams than the Vikings last year? I have to ask that because Lloyd also had about 25% fewer kick offs than the Vikings since they didn’t score as well, and Lloyd’s average boot is only 3 yards longer than Longwell’s. Meanwhile, Lloyd’s average returned boot is 2 yards longer than Longwell, suggesting again that the Panthers, as a team, was less able than the Vikings special teams.
I agree that the Vikings are in need of a kick-off specialist, but I’m skeptical that Lloyd is the answer.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Lloyd signs
This is good. Hopefully he can make the team and do a good job.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/08/vikings-sign-rhys-lloyd/
So far everything in the offseason is going exactly as I was hoping for it. We got our kickoff specialist and now we maybe sign another free agent or two or something. Then we draft some good prospects.
Background piece on Lloyd. He’s an interesting guy, and I’m rooting for him.
http://www.alumni.umn.edu/Football_Preview__Gopher_Gambol.html
Puzzling
I don’t understand how Lloyd can be an impactual KO upgrade over Longwell when his average KO distance is only 2-3 yards further than Longwell.
I do trust that the Vikings know what they’re doing, but I just don’t get it.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
statistics
I don’t think the average kickoff number includes the number of touchbacks.
The Vikings are set with Ryan Longwell as their placekicker. Longwell converted 26 of 28 field goal attempts this past season, but had just five touchbacks on 98 kickoffs. [Rhys] Lloyd, meanwhile, hammered 21 of 72 kickoffs for touchbacks last season. He had 30 touchbacks on 88 kickoffs in 2008.
http://min.scout.com/2/952371.html
In addition, if Lloyd can kick it higher than Longwell, that is better for kickoffs, even if it goes the same distance.
Hang time
In addition, if Lloyd can kick it higher than Longwell, that is better for kickoffs, even if it goes the same distance.
Ahh, that could be the difference-factor, it would make sense.
The other thing I really like about Lloyd is his age; 27 years old. Give him 2 or 3 years working with Longwell and he may end up being Longwell’s replacement when the old man decides to hang up his cleats.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
As far as I’m concerned, Longwell should remain our placekicker until he reaches age 65.
by medicineball on Mar 10, 2010 10:23 AM CST up reply actions
lol him and Favre ride off to the sunset then?
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Charles Gordon
Over at Rube Chat, somebody brought up Charles Gordon. He claims Gordon was cut because his leg had not fully healed.
Well, Gordon is a free agent, and his leg should be healed now or by summer. He was decent as a cornerback.
It would be awesome if he could return and do well for the Vikings. That guy played hard.
Hicks has a right to go to another team. He gave the Vikings some good years as a key backup. With the Redskins, he will probably start.
Losing Hicks is a sad milestone. The Vikings’ last connection to Randy Moss is now off the team. Moss was traded for a 1st round draft pick and players. The players are now off the team. The first round draft pick was Troy Williamson, who was later traded to the Jaguars for a draft pick. The Vikings’ traded that draft pick to the Eagles for Artis Hicks. With Hicks going to another team, the last connection to Randy Moss is gone.
Hey buck up
Maybe we’ll get Moss back and call the point moot.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
The offense lineman needs improvement
For the love of God sign Jahri Evans free agent from the saints. Maybe the best running back in Football AP will not be stuffed at the line next year and your quaterback will not be hit every play
No more spamming
Seriously man, it’ll get you banned. Stop.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Chester Pitts
Chester Pitts is an unrestricted free agent. He plays guard and tackle. He has experience in the zone-blocking scheme from playing with the Texans. I don’t know if he’s good. He’s a veteran.
I don't know with a name like that you have to think he stinks.. :D
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Super Bowl ad
Pitts starred in a Super Bowl ad .
by medicineball on Mar 10, 2010 10:25 AM CST up reply actions
So did the Budweiser Frogs....
I don’t see you advocating we get them to replace the O-line….
:)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I’m not advocating Chester Pitts as the next Viking, but I’m just putting his name out there. The Super Bowl ad is just something everyone will remember so we can kind of know who we are talking about.
by medicineball on Mar 11, 2010 9:29 AM CST up reply actions
I was just teasing, MB
Couldn’t resist the opening, lol.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Nice. I only saw the smiley after I hit post. Too quick on the draw.
by medicineball on Mar 11, 2010 11:31 AM CST up reply actions
Justin Smiley, guard
The Dolphins are cutting him loose to make room for Richie Incognito. Not sure Smiley would fit with the Vikings, though.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Daily Norseman
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Roger Goodell wants Wi-Fi in every stadium
- Plaxico Burress wants to workout for the Dolphins; Dolphins don’t want Plaxico Burress
- NFLPA files collusion claim against NFL, claiming salary cap arrangement in uncapped year
- Donald Driver compared winning ‘Dancing With The Stars’ to winning Super Bowl
- Report: Most NFL players would have no problem with an openly gay teammate
