Ridiculously Early Look at 53 Man Roster
by Ted Glover on May 11, 2010 7:38 PM CDT
in Minnesota Vikings
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Wow, it’s May already? Baseball season is well underway, the first of many OTA’s have come and gone, and training camp is around the corner. So, let’s take a peek into the crystal ball and do a ridiculously early prediction at the final 53 man roster, shall we? I’ll list everyone currently on the Vikings roster, to include the unsigned draft picks, and then put in bold the final cut. I’m even going to take a stab pass at the 8 man practice squad; it's insane enought trying to figure out what the 53 man roster is going to be. In May. Please make sure you bookmark this, so you can email me and tell me I’m an idiot in four months, but I warn you, the line forms behind my Dad and my teenager. Anyways, let's get on with it.
QB (3): Brett Favre, Tarvaris Jackson, Sage Rosenfels, Ryan Perriloux, RJ Archer, Joe Webb
I think it’s safe to say that the top three from last year will be the top three this year, barring catastrophic injury, or the Thing We Shall Not Speak Of happens. Favre was Favre, Jackson played well in garbage time, and Rosenfels offers a veteran presence in case, you know, a certain Hall of Fame quarterback doesn’t return in 2010…sorry, I said we wouldn’t speak of that. If I had to handicap the quarterback roster minus Favre, and I could only pick from these guys and assume no veteran signing right as training camp ends, I would go with Jackson, Rosenfels, and draft pick Joe Webb. I know a lot of folks think Webb will be moved to a receiver position like Brad Smith or Antwaan Randle-El, but I don’t see Perriloux or Archer out-performing Webb.
RB (5): Adrian Peterson, Toby Gerhart, Jeff Dugan, Ian Johnson, James Johnson, Darius Reynaud, Naufahu Tahi, Albert Young
Besides AP, Gerhart, and Tahi, I see the RB battle being one of the most intriguing ones of training camp and pre-season. Albert Young has looked good in limited action, and has been praised by Brad Childress more than once during the off-season as a legitimate replacement for Chester Taylor. Prior to drafting Gerhart, Chilly also announced the position switch of Darius Reynaud, erstwhile punt return specialist, and a guy that has playmaking ability. I envision Reynaud as a Percy Harvin hybrid receiver-runner type; a super H-back, if you will. With the drafting of Gerhart, I think the battle for the last RB position will be between Young and Reynaud. Reynaud has an advantage in that he can also return punts, but Young doesn’t have to learn a new position. I give the edge to Reynaud right now because of his return ability, but this will be fascinating to watch.
WR (5): Bernard Berrian, Taye Biddle, Marquis Hamilton, Percy Harvin, Jaymar Johnson, Greg Lewis, Aaron Rhea, Sidney Rice, Ray Small, Kelton Tindal
The front line guys—Berrian, Rice, Percy, and Lewis are really no surprise. But with the switch of Reynaud to RB, a position opens up for the 5th WR spot. If Reynaud makes the team as a RB, I am going to assume he also returns as the incumbent punt returner. But if Reynaud cannot make the switch, Ray Small, from…wait for it…THE Ohio State University, has a legitimate chance to make the team as the 5th receiver and punt returner. And if I can take my Scarlet colored glasses off for a minute…okay, I can’t…but seriously, Small is the Nuke LaLoosh of all 2010 draft eligible players. He has a million dollar talent with a five cent head. If he can grow up, he can make this team. If Reynaud cannot pick up the RB position, a door opens for Small. This isn’t meant to trash Jaymar Johnson, but he hasn’t done much of anything to stand out, so I feel he’s very vulnerable to lose his spot to a training camp invitee.
TE (3): Jim Kleinsasser, Garrett Mills, Visanthe Shiancoe, Mickey Shuler
RB Jeff Dugan, who can and does line up as a TE, gives the Vikings flexibility to only carry two TE’s on the roster, which I think they will continue to do. Kleinsasser and Shiancoe are solid players, and even though no one is guaranteed a roster spot in this day and age, (well, except for Favre and AP) these two are about as safe as anyone on the team. I think Mills gets a push from Shuler, but makes the team.
OL (8): Eddie Amanski, Thomas Austin, Adrian Battles, Patrick Brown, Chris Clark, Ryan Cook, Jon Cooper, Chris Degeare, Matt Hanson, Tommy Hernandez, Anthony Herrera, Steve Hutchinson, Phil Loadholt, Bryant McKinnie, Bill Noethlich, Drew Radovich, John Sullivan, Marlon Wynn
As much of many of you in Viking Nation would like to see Bryant McKinnie play elsewhere in 2010, it isn’t going to happen. The starting five from 2009 are set, Cook is set to be the primary multi-lineman back-up, and I see Cooper returning and the rookie Degeare rounding out the big ugly corps.
DL (9): Jared Allen, Ray Edwards, Fred Evans, Everson Griffin, Letroy Guion, Tremaine Johnson, Jimmy Kennedy, Cedric McKinley, Jayme Mitchell, Mike Montgomery, Brian Robison, Kevin Williams, Pat Williams
Allen, Williams, Williams, and Edwards will be back, obviously. Kennedy and Evans return as the primary backups at DT, and Robison and rookie Everson Griffin are the DE backups. With the suspensions of Williams and Williams hanging over the team, DT Letroy Guion makes the team as well. I don’t see them carrying 9 DL the whole season, but 9 DL coming out of camp almost seems a necessity with the suspensions looming.
LB (6): Jasper Brinkley, Ryan D’Imperio, Heath Farwell, Chad Greenway, Erin Henderson, EJ Henderson, Ben Leber, J Leman, Kenny Onatolu, Nate Triplett
EJ Henderson’s injury is a bit of a wildcard in this roster make up, but I’m going to assume that he can play a significant amount in 2010. So with EJ back, Farwell and Brinkley are the primary backups, and I think Nate Triplett makes the team as a special teams guy. If Henderson can’t go, add Onatolu into the mix. I am eager to see whether or not Leman or D’Imperio make the the squad as special teams guys.
DB (10): Husain Abdullah, Asher Allen, Colt Anderson, Chris Cook, Eric Frampton, Cedric Griffin, Tyrell Johnson, Jamarca Sanford, Benny Sapp, Lito Sheppard, Marcus Sherels, Terrell Skinner, Angelo Williams, Madieu Williams, Antoine Winfield, DeAndre Wright
Winfield, Griffin (when healed), Allen, Cook, Sapp and Sheppard are your starters, nickel, and dime backs. I think Winfield and Sapp start the season with Sheppard and Allen as the nickel/dime backs. When Griffin is healthy, he becomes the starter, and I think Cook gets in the mix as a dime and/or nickel guy by the end of the season, with Sapp and Sheppard fighting for the rest of the snaps. Williams and Johnson are your safeties, with Abdullah and Sanford as the backups.
Special Teams (4): Ryan Longwell, Rhys Lloyd, Chris Kluwe, Cullen Loeffler. Questions?
I understand we’re heavy at DB and DL, but injuries and suspensions really muddy the waters right now, and make it necessary to plus up in those areas right now.
Anyways, things will become clearer the closer we get to training camp, and the injury and suspensions are more clearly defined.
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I better early look would be the 80 man training camp roster.
But I think Reynauld will NOT beat out Young or Johnson at the RB spot despite his abilities to return punts.
I think that Mills is done and Dugan should be in the TE group.
I think Webb may surprise and force the team to consider 6 WRs.
I am hoping for one of the PS tackles to make the jump and beat out the undersized Cooper who cannot hold up at the point of attack.
I am hoping they bring in another DT and trade Edwards.
Triplett will be hard pressed to beat out Onatolu and Erin H that is for sure.
I can see them going with 3 safeties and 6 CBs. Cook who can also play safety as well as Winfield.
I think that EJ & Griffen start the year on the PUP.
thank you for the post. it is great time to be a Viking Fan.
here is my reply. Vikings 14-2 at the end of the season. bye now……
just kidding about the bye now.
QB. I think Sage gets traded, and we have Farve, TJ, and Ryan Perriloux are the squad members on the opening day roster. our present, our future, and our future future all present.
RB tough one, but obviously AD, A1B1, Albert Young, and Darious Reynaud for sure, and I have to say that Jeff Dugan gets cut in favor of youth, and supreme talent. which leaves tahi, or Ian, and unfortunately Tahi gets the call because he can block… I hope that Tahi is traded for superior talent and youth, Ian Johnson, or the LinebackerRyan D’imperio picked to be a fullback.
WR Rice, Harvin, Berrian, are locks, add in Webb, and a tie between Marquis, and Ray Small.
TE, Shiancoe, and Klinesausage, with Schuler beating out Mills.
The defense….. I will leave that up to Frazier, or up to my next reply.
This is a very hard roster to cut from…. all I can say is I hope we do not lose any quality players when we put them on the practice squad
Last but not least…… Longwell will be a difference maker this year, as he could have ben last year.
SKOL
Toby, everson and chris
all three will be here for a long time, if they reflect their college careers.
One question
By picking up kickoff specialist Lloyd, which one player from last year’s season ending roster is most likely to be cut?
Tough call
I would think a RB or WR, pick between Darius Reynaud, Albert Young, Jaymar Johnson? Tough to say, though
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
Jayme Mitchell
Probably don’t need him between JA, lame-o Edwards, Robison,
Bold to make a list this far out but commendable to make the attempt. Some thoughts.
-Your decision to leave Joe Webb at QB was an interesting one to say the least. I would be shocked if the Vikings even give him a second of thought as a QB. I’d also consider him a lock for the roster at this point unless he completely bombs out in training camp. He is simply too gifted physically for the team to risk on the practice squad.
-Frampton is our 2nd best special teams guy after Farwell. No way he gets cut.
-D’Imperio is a FB not a LB.
-You have the team carrying 6 linebackers, but 4 of them are MLB’s. I don’t know if there is precedence for this but it would concern me.
-Onatolu was a strong special teamer for us and will likely be back.
-This might be the year we finally lose Garrett Mills. He has never developed the way coaches (and fans) hoped when we signed him off the Pats practice squad. I wouldn’t be at all surprised to see him cut.
Fair point about Webb, and I agree
but until he makes the switch, I felt it was only fair to deal with him as he is listed on the depth chart/draft page.
D’Imperio is listed as a LB on the Vikes NFL.com page and their official page.
I don’t see Triplett playin the Mike in the NFL, but that’s just me, and Farwell can play multiple positions. And I originally had Onatolu making it, but with the d-line issues he was #54 or #55.
And I would agree Mills is on the bubble.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
I liked the Webb at #3 QB idea
NOT because I see them ever actually using him there… Your context was ‘no Favre and no new QB brought in’. In that scenario, they could park Webb at the #3 spot just for this year, knowing he’d likely never be called on to actually play QB. That would solve two problems: They’d make up for the roster spot spent on the kickoff specialist, AND save a ton of money that could be used to lock up future free agents like Greenway, etc., all of which makes it more feasible to make room for Webb while he works on the position switch. As long as they can survive the year without going 3 deep on the starting QB’s, they come out way ahead. In the unlikely (and horrible) situation that QB’s #1 and 2 go down with injuries, the season would likely be lost anyway. Not as risky as it may sound — look at the #3 QB’s on every other playoff teams’ roster, and you’ll be asking yourself why the Vikes have a 10 year veteran making 3 million dollars this year so far down the depth chart.
D'Imperio is a fullback.
He is listed as a fullback on the Vikings roster on the Vikings web site at www.vikings.com and in fact is wearing a running back’s number, that of former great Chuck Foreman.
Yeah, my bad on that
I didn’t see where the Vikes were going to convert him to a fullback, just went off his college position from the draft sites.
I think that lowers his chances to make the team, though. But they weren’t great to begin with.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
QB—-Brett,s recovery time will determine a Sage trade .
RB—-AP , Toby & six WRs w/Ian a better option than AYoung
FB—-D’Imperio may go to practise squad .
TE—-G.Mills injuries may move Shuler into FB & Dugan to TE.
WR—-3 plus Reynaud , Webb & a real battle for 6th.
OL—-six starters , Cook , (look for Pitts) , DeGeare
K
P
DE—-start , Robison , Griffen , Monty beats out F.Evans
DT—-start , Kennedy , Guion watch for Hanesworth to remove 5th DE
LB—-start , Brinkley , Farwell , Tripplet The 3rd we traded willbite us here.
S——Madeau-Johnson-Sanford battle for 2 starts , watch this Skinner kid and see if…….
CB— stacked .we will keep other safety and LB if IR fellas aren’t back.
I see a purging of one year free agents to create $$$$$$ for Adrian , Sidney & Ray
Ray was more productive than 75% of the league and you want to abandon him . Picture him in GB or CHI . That wouldn’t be pretty . We need him like McKinnie to make a run at a title . As injuries come you will regret your lack of wisdom. Hell , I might go out and find his jersey . Another good year like last year and he will be a real gem !!!!
One thing
I’d have to say there are 4 WR locks - Berrian, Rice, Harvin, and Lewis. Then Webb and someone else. As for Reynaud — he’s been moved to RB. That essentially opens the spot for Webb to make the 53 man roster while working on the switch, since Reynaud didn’t do anything at WR last year, anyway.
Ray Edwards is as good as gone in 2011 if they don't trade him first
Both Robison and Griffen can play both DE spots. I have to believe Ray Edwards’ FA status next year played into the decision to take Everson Griffen this year, just in case..
I'm excited about Webb
If he can run routes and catch the ball, he could be replacing BB in the 2011 season.
I’m also excited about the RB they drafted, I forget his name, but he looks like a beast.
With that said, I think Reynauld will fighting for a job this year,
Webb was drafted as a WR, and D'Imperio as a FB
I believe Shuler beats out Mills, and I would love to see D’Imperio beat out Tahi. All eight draft picks will make the team with some to the active roster and some to the practise squad. I really like Ray-Ray but if he doesn’t want to be here or wants more money than he’s worth then we should trade him and get something for him while we can. I think Shepperd is only insurance until Cedric is healthy and then we will cut him. oh one last thing Asher A llen is also good at returning punts, he lead the SEC in college so he could also be an option there. It’s going to be a fun training camp with all these roster battles going on.
Ryan Perriloux
is signed.
this is a great discussion post. thank you Ted Glover.
I say we trade the following
Dugan, Edwards, Rosenfells, and Tahi. I also think we keep Onatalu, but he went to school in my home town Omaha, so maybe a biased opinion.
SKOL
Perriloux??
As far as I can tell he has not signed as of yet, I hope he does though, I have a good feeling about him (if he can get his head out of his, well you all know). Like the other post on here, QB of the present, future and fututre future. Anyway very excited about this years team, and let the march to the final game in Feb. begin!!!
April 26th on NFL .com
If you choose transactions, and pick only Minnesota Vikings, you will see that Ryan Perrilous signed on April 26th. SKOL
Perrilloux is GONE
That ‘signing’ thing has already been corrected. He wasn’t offered any contract at all, just a tryout. And they didn’t keep him around.
Damn. Seriously?
That sucks. Why wouldn’t they keep him around for just a little longer? What exactly is the harm in letting him go to training camp with us? Its not like we have any other young QBs at all that would be taking his reps. Without him this literally has zero hope for the QB position in the future. I’m not saying he’s for sure the longterm answer, but right now he’s the only thing close to an answer that they’ve got. Why jettison him now?
Because he's obviously not that good
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
Jaymar vs Ray
This isn’t meant to trash Jaymar Johnson, but he hasn’t done much of anything to stand out, so I feel he’s very vulnerable to lose his spot to a training camp invitee.
You just spent a good portion talking up Ray Small and then making this comment on Johnson. Yet you have Johnson making the active roster. If you really believe he isn’t all that great and you really believe Small has a good chance, then why not have Small making the roster? Are you saying the Vikings would be making an error by selecting Johnson over Small?
Legitimate question
No, I’m not saying the Vikes would make a bad decision to keep Johnson over Small. It’s an uphill climb for Small, or any undrafted free agent, to make an NFL roster.
It’s tough for undrafted free agents to replace incumbents, even at the deep backup level. The only was I see Small making a run at a roster spot is if Reynaud can’t make a smooth transition to RB. If he can’t, and if Small impresses as a punt returner, and if Small plays as good as or better than Johnson, and if Small doesn’t let his five cent head take over and think for him, then he might make the team.
If all that does happen, which is a lot, the only guy that I can see Small replacing at the WR level is Johnson. Maybe Greg Lewis, but Chilly and him go back to Philly days, and the Vikes re-signed him in the off-season, so Lewis would really have to take a drop for that to happen, IMHO.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
I would be
very sad to see Onatolu & Frampton walk. They are fantastic special teamers. I would be surprised if Triplett made the final roster over KO.
If you can't laugh at yourself... Who can you laugh at?
The Packers, that’s who.
-- The almighty Manimal
An Insane Guess at the Final Fifty-Three
Which will go right out the window as soon as there is a major injury in summer camp, or some blockbuster trade for Haynesworth that includes Ray Edwards and Sage Rosenfeld, or an alien invasion that devastates the Minnesota legislature and allows a decent professional football stadium to be built within the state, none of which may ever actually happen either.
Lloyd, Rhys
Longwell, Ryan
Loeffler, Cullen
Kluwe, Chris
Allen, Asher
Cook, Chris
Griffin, Cedric
Sheppard, Lito
Winfield, Antoine
Allen, Jared
Edwards, Ray
Griffen, Everson
Robison, Brian
Brinkley,Jasper
Farwell, Heath
Greenway, Chad
Henderson, E.J.
Leber, Ben
Onatolu, Kenny
Abdullah, Husain
Frampton, Eric
Johnson, Tyrell
Sanford, Jamarca
Williams, Madieu
Evans, Fred
Guion, Letroy
Kennedy, Jimmy
Williams, Kevin
Williams, Pat
Hernandez, Tommy
Sullivan, John
D’Imperio, Ryan
Dugan, Jeff
DeGeare, Chris
Herrera, Anthony
Hutchinson, Steve
Favre, Brett
Jackson, Tarvaris
Rosenfels, Sage
Gerhart, Toby
Peterson, Adrian
Reynaud, Darius
Loadholt, Phil
McKinnie, Bryant
Cook, Ryan
Mills, Garrett
Shiancoe, Visanthe
Shuler, Mickey
Berrian, Bernard
Johnson, Jaymar
Lewis, Greg
Rice, Sidney
Webb, Joe
Now, figure out which five members of the 2009 roster I have cut, perhaps because I’m meaner and far more demented than Chilly, or because I just understand life, whichever you prefer to believe…
You cut
Tahi, Sapp, Kleinsasser, Jayme Mitchell, and Percy Harvin for some strange reason. Tahi and Mitchell make sense but I don’t see the other three being cut. Harvin will not be cut unless his head explodes from reading one of your posts : )
by CanadianViking on May 12, 2010 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't see...
Jaymar, Reynaud and Webb all making it.
I don’t see Shuler and Mills coexisting either.
The first 3 draft picks are locks. Beyond that I say DeGeare, Webb and Shuler have a chance to earn their spots in training camp. But expect a battle from Drew Radovich, Jaymar Johnson and Mills, respectively.
The only UDFA that has a chance is Terrel Skinner. But most likely that is on the PS.
I would not be surprised to see Hilton and Webb as new faces in the receiving corp. (Lewis and Johnson on alert).
I would not be surprised to see Shuler beat out Mills.
I think Jon Cooper is cut and replaced by either Radovich or Noethlich.
I agree with Ted Glover’s assessment of the DL.
There will be a dogfight between Triplett and Onatolu.
I can see Rhys Lloyd cut in favor of an additional DL or DB if the suspensions/injuries take longer than currently expected.
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
Elgar!
WHAT THE FLIP FLOPS!?!?!?! You cut my boy Percy??? :’(
I love Twins Baseball and Minnesota Vikings Football.
by Percy Harvin My Fav! on May 12, 2010 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Okay, I just wanted to see who was awake. (Out here in California, some people think medical marijuana should be shut down because it attracts criminals into robberies. For some reason they don’t feel that banks should be shut down for doing the same thing.)
I hereby cut Jaymar Johnson, and bring Percy out of Mayo with some mustard.
Kleinsasser needs to retire. Tight ends need to run. I have learned from personal experience that being old and running fast do not go together well.
Garrett Mills can actually long snap a football. Spare parts are important. Of course, maybe I should order spare parts for Mills.
Rhys won’t be cut. Seeing how a long kickoffs negate Percy Harvin sticks in the coaches minds (if not their craws).
Joe Webb can do things that will make DC’s lose sleep at night. Sleepy opposing coordinators are called goodness.
That’s my story, and I’m sticking to it (except of course for Percy).
P.S.: Reynaud can do damage catching passes coming out of the backfield, return kicks, and blocks better that Jaymar Johnson. With Chester Taylor gone, coaches are keenly aware of how many times they have looked down the bench at the active 45 and thought, “Who else catches well coming out of the backfield?” Counterpunching and backup plans are important.
Its a mightly leap, but
I hope Joe Webb surprises with great ability at WR and replaces Jaymar Johnson as the 5th WR. I know Lewis made that one catch last year, but that catch alone doesn’t make him a lock to make the team this year.
Pretty good anaylisis of the 53 man roster Milcard… no Mr. Glover. You’ll probably be off by 2 at the most.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
Incredible.
I just put together my early look at the Bears final-53 today to post at 4pm ET over at WCG. And I did it before I saw this post. Who thinks about stuff like this in May? We might have an addiction.
Good job on yours though, although tough call on Ian Johnson. Prior to the draft selection of Gerhart, I had figured he’d be given a healthy shot at being the primary backup. I’m surprised he hasn’t been given much of a chance.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
That profile pick is hilarious...
Too bad for you guns arent allowed in football. That is what it would take for the Bears to outright stop AP.
However I gotta give you props for originality.
Good luck with Chester Taylor. He isn’t going to look as good with the piss-poor blocking the Bears have. Why wouldn’t the Bears sign T.O.? I hope they don’t because it would make them better. Your WR core in thin, so why not?
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
reply fail.
the book (below) was to you.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 13, 2010 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL
I was told once that there was a fine line between hobby and obsession. As for Johnson, he was around all of training camp last year, was on the practice squad through the whole season, and is still with the team. I like the kid, but quite frankly, Albert Young has looked a lot better than Johnson when both were given opportunities.
And thanks for the good words. This is one of the few times where there really isn’t a whole lot of guessing needed for the Vikes, as they just don’t have many roster spots up for grabs. They’re a veteran team with very little holes, even in the two and three deep rotation.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
haha, thanks.
I’m a fan of Peterson’s, as you can see by this post I put up on the DN a while back – link.
I actually did this one for a photoshop contest that we had on WCG back in the day. It’s appeared on your site before with some good-hearted back-and-forth ribbing during game week. I do a weekly ’shop over there, if any of you ever want to stop by (link to the archive).
I agree about the line. It seems our management believes that Tice will be the fix-all for our offensive line, much like Marinelli was supposed to be last year on the opposite side of the ball. While our o-line did get better at the end of the year when they moved Williams to the left side (where he belongs) and gave Omiyale some time to gel. It still has a long way to go and a quality lineman, or at least a draft pick (traditional seventh rounder not withstanding), would have been nice.
As for Taylor himself, the Vikings – shockingly – were ranked a lot worse at run blocking. These are the player’s run protection rankings, according to ProFootballFocus:
Bears
Kevin Shaffer (1.4)
Chris Williams (-1.6) numbers got significantly better when he was moved to LT
Orlando Pace (-9.0) released
Roberto Garza (-0.7)
Josh Beekman (1.8)
Frank Omiyale (3.0) will be moved to natural position RT this year
Olin Kretuz (1.0)
Vikings
Bryant McKinnie (-4.4)
Phil Loadholt (-8.5)
Steve Hutchinson (-11.1)
Anthony Herrera (-11.6)
John Sullivan (-9.4)
Not that these numbers are the tell all, be all. But they do speak a couple things to me. One, I think Taylor has a good chance of producing the same kind of numbers, maybe even better. And the second being, that Peterson is really effin’ good. He had a “down year” and ran for almost 1,400 yards behind a line that was ranked that low. That, my friend, is amazing.
And for T.O., I’d pass. He’s got a load of skill, but I don’t want the distraction that comes with it. Plus, our receivers are under rated, they’re all extremely young, but give them some time and I think they’ll be very good. Especially now that we’ve got a coordinator with some creativity. That’s all just my opinion, though. I’m sure others would disagree.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
Tice is as good a hire as Martz
When Tice was the o-line coach here, he made good players great (Birk, Stringer), average players good (Dave Dixon) and mediocre players serviceable (Chris Liewinski, Corbin Lacina). Hell, he helped mold Birk from a 6th round draft pick into arguably the second best center in team history behind Mick Tingelhoff.
Tice was generally considered the best o-line coach in the NFL, and was being talked about as an offensive coordinator before Denny Green got shown the door and Tice was made coach. He’ll definitely make your line better, and if Martz can get through to Cutler, you have the makings of a good offense.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
Thanks.
Although we did hear some of the exact same things last year when Marinelli was hired. He was supposed to fix the existing defensive line, but in the end we ended up with more of the same mediocre play. We then we had to go invest more resources in the acquisitions of Gaines Adams, Julius Peppers and Corey Wootton to replace what he was supposed to be able to fix.
Concerning the Tice hire, I really do hope he’s as good as the hype that we’ve been hearing. I’m a big fan of winning the game in the trenches, so it would be nice to finally get the those two sides shored up.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 14, 2010 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Those O-line rankings
They seem like more like Pro Football Focus opinion. You can screw #s any way you want. Hutchinson is the best run blocker on both teams, by far and they have him ranked -11.1? That leads me to believe these rankings have no merit. Hutch is still considered to be one of the best guards in the league and that is after playing through injury last year.
As for T.O. he wasent a distraction last year and seems to be realizing his career isn’t going to last much longer so he will probably keep his mouth shut. Hester has terrible hands, but I can agree that Knox is good. Betcha Cutler would jump for joy if they got T.O.. I also didn’t see if the Bears drafted any WRs worth mentioning so who knows. It just seems they could use an updrade, but I hope they don’t. I don’t want to see them get any better. You guys already did by getting Peppers, thats enough.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
PFF
Like I said, these numbers aren’t the end all, be all. They are just numbers. ProFootballFocus may not be exactly right on everything, but they do analyze every play, of every game and grade each player using exactly the same methodology. If it makes you feel any better, they did rate him as the #1 OG in the entire league last year at protecting the passer.
And yes, I realize that Owens had a quiet season in Buffalo. Given his history, do you see that lasting? I, personally, don’t want him on my team. As far as your speculation on Cutler, here’s what he had to say on the subject:
“T.O. is a pretty good player, but for this system … I don’t know how he would fit in,” Cutler said. “Our receiver position, I think, is one of the strengths of the team.” link
While our receivers may not be your everyday names at this point, just give them some time. Knox is entering his second year. Bennett his third, but only his second seeing playing time. Devin Aromashodu (I know you remember him) has really surprised some people and Cutler is constantly calling for him to get more PT. A lot of people are figuring he’ll go into the season as the #1. And then we have Jauquin Iglesias who we drafted in the third round last year (along with Knox – 5th), who spent the year learning the playbook, much like Bennett did the year before.
And Hester, he has terrible hands, really? Can you back that up with something other than opinion? Last year, Hester had 6 dropped passes out of 89 balls that were thrown to him. For comparison’s sake:
Hester: 6 drops out of 89 passes = 1 drop per 14.8 passes
Knox: 4 drops out of 75 passes = 1 drop per 18.8 passes
Aromashodu: 2 drops out of 40 passes = 1 drop per 20 passes
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Berrian: 6 drops out of 90 passes = 1 drop per 15 passes
Rice: 10 drops out of 120 passes = 1 drop per 12 passes
Harvin: 17 drops out of 86 passes = 1 drop per 5 passes
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Owens: 10 drops out of 105 passes = 1 drop per 10.5 passes
Look, as the regulars on this site know, I don’t come here to bash the Vikings, and that’s not my intent by posting these statistics. While I know you aren’t going to hold these numbers to be true, because they are simply numbers. It would be beneficial for you to post some substance to accompany your speculation.
Bottom line, our receivers are young, but they’re an extremely talented group who are only going to get better as the years go on, and as Martz transforms this offense.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 14, 2010 7:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Reply beneath, wouldn't let me reply before for some reason.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
Okay
Rice have 83 receptions last year. Adding 10 drops would equal 93 total. Your talking about 120 total passes that were supposedly headed his way? Berrian had 55 receptions so those stats are saying a total of 90 were headed his way and he drops 6. Who decideds or reports how many passes were thrown his way. Show the stats on # of receptions and how many drops there were on top. The stats will look very different.
Hester had 53 receptions last year, so what he had another 46 coming his way? Kind of a weird way to look at things. The Bears took one of the best return men and the league and ruined it by turning him into a WR. He does not run good routes or adjust to the ball well especially if what you say that he had another 46 passes coming his way. Those stats are just weird. Drops compared with receptions are all that matters. To try and decide how many passes were coming a WRs way is more like guessing, especially when your QB throws 26INTS. Can you tell who all those passes were suppose to go to. There is no true exact # for that, just mind numbing speculation/guessing.
Admittedy Cutler has to be better this year with one year under his belt in the new system. No one knew who Aromashodu was until week 14 of last year at best. Three good games when no one is game planning for you doesn’t mean the guy is going to be lights out next year. He showed a bit of potential and you can hope for the best. I guess that is all we can do as fans. Realistically speaking the Bears could up a WR unit that was ranked in the bottom 5-10 teams last season on Yahoo Sports, NFL.com, etc. I hope they don’t.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
WR unit ranked in bottom 5-10 teams by NFL.com and Yahoo is some substance for you.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
The numbers I posted were taken directly from the site you discredited before, ProFootballFocus. Who like I said previously:
analyze every play, of every game and grade each player using exactly the same methodology
The additional numbers that go in are balls that were overthrown, intercepted, tipped away, etc. Basically passes that were un-catchable by the receiver who the pass was intended for. And it was actually (89 passes – 53 receptions equals) 36 more passes thrown to Hester, of which six were “dropped.”
If you actually watched the games last year, you would have seen the numerous errant passes thrown by our quarterback. You can’t have it both ways, bash our QB for throwing interceptions and discredit the fact that he throws balls away from and over our receivers.
But, since you’d rather look at just the receptions vs. drops instead of the pass attempts vs. drops? Here’s a looksee:
Hester: 57 rec 6 drops = 63 total = 1 per 10.5
Knox: 45 rec 4 drops = 49 total = 1 per 12.25
Aromashodu: 24 rec 2 drops = 26 total = 1 per 13
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Berrian: 55 rec 6 drops = 61 total = 1 per 10.2
Rice: 83 rec 10 drops = 93 total = 1 per 9.3
Harvin: 60 rec 17 drops = 77 total = 1 per 4.5
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Owens: 55 rec 10 drops = 65 total = 1 per 6.5
No matter how you want to slice it, Hester is still averaging out better than Rice, Harvin and Owens. And is right on par with the other three players on this list. I’m not making a case that Hester is the better receiver of any player in this group, just that your “he drops balls” argument is weak.
I’m with you on Aromashodu, I’m not as sold on him as a lot of people are. I do know that our quarterback is constantly calling for him and praising the guy through the media. That can’t be a bad thing, but I’m not ready to anoint him yet. I do think Cutler will have a much improved season this year and I personally can’t wait to watch a Mike Martz offense in Chicago.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 14, 2010 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions
And furthermore:
WR unit ranked in bottom 5-10 teams by NFL.com and Yahoo is some substance for you.
The Bears had 3,677 receiving yards in 2009, ranking them 17th out of 32.
These numbers were taken directly from NFL.com (which you sourced as your reference point and classified as your substance).
Now, when attempting to look at these numbers objectively, I realized that these they included balls caught by our both our RB group and our TE group. And I realized that you obviously want to focus solely on our Wide Receivers.
While I wouldn’t typically discredit a WR corps for this (especially given the style of offense Ron Turner ran), for example and clarification purposes, I will remove them from the equation and only look at production from our receivers alone.
2,334 (by receivers)
I looked at the teams ranked 23 through 32 in total receiving yards: Cleveland, NYJ, Buffalo, Oakland, St. Louis, Panthers, Tennessee, Tampa Bay, Cincinnatti, Kansas City. All ten accumulated fewer yards, from their receivers, than did the Bears. And like I said, this was just a look at the bottom ten, I stopped there because it was enough to disprove the “substance” that you so-called brought to the table.
But maybe you were speaking of other categories like fumbles (T-7th), 1st downs (T-19th), points (19th), drops (do you really want to go there?).
And just to make it clear, I’m not saying our WR group is lights out and without a doubt will be the next Greatest Show on Poorly-Maintained-Sod. But, your arguments are off-based and mis-informed. But please, keep bringing your opinion speculation substance.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 15, 2010 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Okay 2
The rankings on team WR units were not based soley on yardage gained. You take one part of the equation then pounce on my argument. I just said that Yahoo and NFL.com had them ranked in the bottom 5-10 teams in the league. “Yards gained” is not the only thing considered in these equations. TDs(yes there were 27recieving from the Bears), yards per catch and straight up opinion by the admittedly “so called experts” that wright for the sights. Some do know what they are talking about so I give them some merit. When they rank WR units they certainly take more than YARDAGE into consideration.
Also Matt Forte averaged a measly 3.6 yards per carry, under 1000 yards and only 4 rushing TDs. Thus the Bears were forced to throw more because they had no other option.
The amount of balls that are thrown to a reciever are off base and there is no way to accuratly calculate where every ball might have been going. To me that is just mind numbing speculation with NO SUBSTANCE! Basically a useless stat.
The Hester argument came from most of what I have seen out of him. I should have stated his biggest need for improvment was running routes and adjusting to balls. That is one area I have heard the Bears say is his biggest need for improvment. As for the drops, you have seen more Bears game than I and the drops I’ve seen have only been from a few games. I can admit that. I think it just would have been better for the Bears to keep Hester as their return man, save him for that. He was the best in the NFL at it so why ruin a good thing? Thats where I was coming from.
I am taking your stats on drops and won’t bother to look them up as you seem like a respecatable guy. I can pull stats from sites to and call it substance and with the ranking from Yahoo and NFL.com I did. Once again those ranking were not based soley on yards gained.
You have stated your own opinion and speculation a la Aromashodu after only having 3 good games last year when no one was game planning for the guy and barely knew who he was. I realize you hope for that to mean potential for the upcoming season and I too have made some glass half full statement of my own. I guess we as NFL fans can hope for the best, but I still don’t think it would kill the Bears to add WR help. Owens not being a head case for one year does not mean he would fit in for sure. I just think its worth a shot. We can agree to disagree there.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
Also
KC, Cincy, Carolina, NYJ and probably a few others had WAY better running games that the Bears so they werent forced to throw as much. If you had guys like Chris Johnson, Cedric Benson, Jamal Charles, Thomas Jones and D.Will/J.Stewart running the ball you wouldn’t have to throw as much regardless of who your WRs are.
I do bring up some relevant stats and an objective opinion that we do not have to agree on. Your drop stats are substance, but your passes supposedly headed to WRs I can’t acknowledge as anything more than speculation.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
Few things, and I promise that I'll let this die.
The rankings on team WR units were not based soley on yardage gained. You take one part of the equation then pounce on my argument.
Actually, I took what you said and looked at multiple stats (including fumbles, first downs and drops), I simply highlighted the yardage. But if you really want to factor in TDs into the equation, they were tied for 10th in the league in that category. Not really sure I see where this helps your case.
Your point on the Bears running game is a valid one. They were absolutely horrid last season. While I won’t pass all the blame on Forte as you would, it’s something they need to improve on. And you can take Carolina’s running game out of your list of four, since they had the same pass to run (60-40%) ratio as the Bears. For the record, Kansas City’s pass to run ratio was pretty close, as well.
As for the “experts” rankings… well, good luck with that. I’ve presented the numbers to you that stand up against every other WR group in the league and yet you still disregard this because of what some talking head thinks. One question for you, did they provide any statistical reasoning why the Bears fall into this category, or just merely opinionated beliefs?
You have stated your own opinion and speculation a la Aromashodu after only having 3 good games last year when no one was game planning for the guy and barely knew who he was. I realize you hope for that to mean potential for the upcoming season and I too have made some glass half full statement of my own.
What are you talking about here? I said that I wasn’t sold on him as most people are just yet. I never stated anything about blind optimism or false belief.
your passes supposedly headed to WRs I can’t acknowledge as anything more than speculation.
These are not my made up stats, they are done by a website that analyzes and breaks down every play of every game. Consider the site speculation, if you must. I do not.
And I have yet to argue with you on Hester’s role as a return man. There’s a few things on this that I could throw at you, but I’ll save it for another day, and another thread.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 15, 2010 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Been watching this back and forth and I
noticed that some of your #’s for dropped passes are incorrect. I checked ProFootball Focus and it looks like you copied the wrong column for the Viking recievers. The correct # of drops are Aromashadu 2, Hester 4, Knox 4, Rice 3, Harvin 4, Berrian 3, and Owens 10.
Doesn’t really end the argument you two were having but it does show Harvin and Rice in a better light. By your measures Rice is the most reliable of all these receivers and Harvin, Berrian, and Hester are all comparable when it comes to drops. Aromashadu and Knox are a little worse and Owens as usual leads the league in drops. Sorry if I prolonged this for you guys : )
by CanadianViking on May 16, 2010 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Ah, thanks.
I did. It appears I copied the MT column (missed tackles) for a few of the players, which is right beside the PD column (Passes dropped). Thanks for posting to clarify, I’d much rather have the most accurate information presented on all sides and have everyone judge the debate accordingly and subjectively.
I fixerized the chart for you below, it definitely makes a difference.
Hester: 57 rec 6 4 drops = 63 total = 1 per 10.5 14.25
Knox: 45 rec 4 drops = 49 total = 1 per 12.25
Aromashodu: 24 rec 2 drops = 26 total = 1 per 13
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Berrian: 55 rec 6 3 drops = 61 total = 1 per 10.2 18.3
Rice: 83 rec 10 3 drops = 93 total = 1 per 9.3 27.7
Harvin: 60 rec 17 4 drops = 77 total = 1 per 4.5 15
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Owens: 55 rec 10 drops = 65 total = 1 per 6.5
And there’s no need to prolong the discussion on his part. His point was that Hester drops too many passes. These new numbers still don’t back up that opinion.
And yes, as I’ve said before (ask Ted), Rice is a machine and is, by far, the best receiver of the group. And will probably be one of the best receivers in the league for many years to come. My whole goal of this was not to discount the Vikings’ receivers, but to show that we should do our own research and not let others tell us what to believe, just to pass it off as truth. I guess my errors in dropped balls only further drives that home. ;)
Sorry for the ill-posted numbers, and great catch.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 16, 2010 7:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Man, great back and forth, so let me jump in, ha ha
First, thanks to smudgers for giving me some good info on PFF. I’ve been really looking over the site, and I like it. I don’t know that it’s the be all end all to statistics, but it seems like a football version of baseball’s ‘Moneyball’ sabremetrics. It definitely adds to the argument, and can help augment or disprove a position, and it adds to the discussion.
So, let’s look at interceptions when thrown to, which was a big problem for the Bears last year. Let’s make a couple of assumptions, for the sake of argument. Both Favre and Cutler were considered top passers coming in to last season, both had recever corps that had a lot of questions about talent and experience (save for maybe Berrian in Minnesota), but Cutler had an entire off-season and training camp to work with his guys, and Favre was, well, Favre. Showed up late, sucked all the oxygen out of the room, and then was FREAKIN’ AWESOME. Sorry, I’m better now.
Anyways, Vikings receivers had 6 interceptions when thrown to them, with Berrian leading at 4, ironically enough. Both Rice and Harvin had one each.
Aromashodu had 4, Bennett 5, Knox 6 and Hester 3. Now, are these the results of terrible throws by Cutler, or is it the receivers not being where they’re supposed to be when Cutler lets go of the ball? When a quarterback throws the ball it’s either to a point, expecting the receiver to be there, or he trusts the receiver to go get it when he chucks it into a crowd.
Two things strike me about these numbers: either the Minnesota receivers are better route runners, or they can go get a ball better…or Cutler just flat out sucks. I think the third choice is ridiculous; he’s a former All-Pro, who despite throwing 26 interceptions, still threw 28 TD passes. I can’t stand the guy, but he can play.
So that tells me there has to be something more there. Either Cutler went from top notch talent to a guy that can’t hit water if he falls out of a boat…in one season, or there is something lacking in the Bears receivers.
With Favre, Rice became the best WR in the NFL last season. But Rice made Favre the best QB in the NFL, too. He caught some passes that reminded me of Cris Carter, and when he went up for a ball, he came down with it. If his job was to run a 7 yard out, it was 7 yards, not 6, not 8.
In the limited times I saw the Bears last season, they seemd to run sloppy routes, and were not on the same page as Cutler, a lot. So I think it’s fair to say that if Favre made Rice better (and vice versa) Bears receivers made Cutler worse (and vice versa).
As for the running stats for the linemen, hey, stats don’t lie, but the amount of times a team runs the ball has to be taken into consideration, and I don’t know that PFF did that. I mean, if you run the ball 10 times for 40 yards for a game, your run blockers will have better stats than guys who have to run block 30-35 times. You’re going to have more runs for losses, more busted plays, etc.
It seems like an unfair skew, and if they do adjust for that, I haven’t seen it.
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile way and you have their shoes.
this.
is a well thought out and very educated reply. And I don’t disagree with ANYTHING that you said here.
I don’t think that there’s an a, b or c pick one type of answer to why Cutler threw so many interceptions. To be honest, there were a lot of excuses reasons why, including (but not limited to) bad routes, youth, player development, bad decisions, bad throws, first year in a new system, expectations, etc, etc.
Bottom line, we all knew Cutler threw interceptions prior to becoming a Bear, and a good deal of us expected the same thing as a Bear. Especially in his first season.
I’m not making excuses for Cutler, he needs to be better – end of story. At the same time, I don’t want to make excuses for our receivers. However, they are a young group. Knox and Bennett were both (basically) starting their first full season as a WR, Hester his second, and we all know how much time DA has seen. That’s not a ton of NFL experience between the lot. Hopefully, they’ll progress, especially with the new system being installed and another year with Cutler. We’ll see.
As for the stats on PFF, I couldn’t agree more. Statistics are simply numbers, and we should definitely use a fair amount of objectivity when looking at them.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 16, 2010 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Glover
Big props to you for bringing in the INT when thrown to WRs statement. You are a smarter man that I for bringing that to the table, something I could definitly learn from. Then again my lazy ass would have to check PFF to see those #s.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)! Also, Lesnar, Lesnar, Lesnar!!!!!!!
No Problem,
I’ve been hearing people cite ProFootballFocus quite a bit and was surprised at the drop #‘s so I checked out the site and noticed the mistake. Thanks for getting me to check it out as they have some very interesting usage of stats. I’m not sure if I buy all their methodology but some of it makes quite a bit of sense.
Your receiving corps has a lot of speed and decent hands but I think they need to run better routes. They should be better this year with more experience and better timing with Cutler though. Thanks again for leading me to more stats to waste my time on : )
by CanadianViking on May 16, 2010 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
haha, no problem.
Glad I could help out. ;)
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 16, 2010 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
All good Smudgy
We can both pull figures/stats off many sites to argue a point. Some valid, some not. Depends on how you look at them.
The rankings from NFL.com and Yahoo were probably more opinion based, but these guys are suppose to be experts. Do they really know more than us? Who knows. I still think its hard to say where every pass is intended to go. Do they count the ones where the QB throws the ball away, but still look to be headed in a WRs direction? A website that breaks down every play can still be opinion on where every ball thrown is headed. I’m not saying PFF as a whole is speculation, I just don’t like that one catergory. We can agree to disagree there.
I did jump on Forte and improved run blocking would certanly help.
I just wonder if using Hester as a WR took away from his effectivness in the return game. From the outside(not a Bears fan that watches every game) it seemed to. He burned the Vikings a lot more soley as a return man.
For division rivals this went over pretty well. I hope we both can say we have more of a distain for the Packers, they just erk me somethin’ fearce. If not thats fine. Somehow if the Bears were to have won the division the last two years I would still hate the Packers more.
I see us having some good chirps this season when the Vikes play the Bears and look forward to them.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
My old man is Packers fan.
And yes, I dislike that team much, much more than the Vikings. ;)
I just wonder if using Hester as a WR took away from his effectivness in the return game.
The answer is a resounding yes. The problem that the Bears had was that he earned a big pay raise, and they were paying him too much to be just a return man the best d*mn return man in the NFL. I think they had to move him to offense, since his coverage skills were highly suspect. I just think they utilized him wrong. Hopefully Martz will have his say and utilize him as a slot receiver who’s brought in for a set amount of plays per game.
To paraphrase a random poster from WCG a while back, “the rest of the NFL couldn’t figure out how to stop Devin Hester, so the Bears went ahead and did it for them.”
As for the “passes at” statistic, it is what it is. PFF is said to have a zero question policy, basically meaning if they aren’t sure of it, they don’t register it.
You’ll be seeing me around throughout the season, I’m sure. Maybe I’ll have a new photoshop or poem for cryohavic when the Vikes/Bears game comes around. And no worries about it turning ugly on my end, it’s all in good fun. At the end of the day, we’re all people who just happen to root for different teams.
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"Newbie, if the next two words out of your mouth aren't 'See ya' then the third word will be 'Oh my god. My crotch. You've punched me in my crotch." - Dr. Percival Ulysses Cox
by David Taylor on May 16, 2010 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions
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