Albert Haynesworth Reportedly Interested in Joining Minnesota Vikings
by Christopher Gates on May 8, 2010 11:50 PM CDT
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Apologies for a bit of a lull over the past couple of days, but after the laughable decision that came down on Thursday, yours truly hasn't been in much of a football mood. However, there is something (potentially) on the horizon that might make things a whole lot better.
According to ESPN 1500 in the Twin Cities, current Washington Redskins defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth is reportedly interested in joining the Minnesota Vikings.
If you'll remember, Haynesworth had a monster season for the Tennessee Titans in 2008, and cashed in big time by signing a deal that is "worth" $100 million over seven years with the Redskins that off-season. The contract contained $41 million in guaranteed money, and a bunch of stuff that Haynesworth would never, ever actually see. But, hey. . .$100 million sounds a whole lot more impressive than $41 million, so there you go.
The Redskins were reportedly trying to deal Haynesworth in the days leading up to the 2010 NFL Draft, and the asking price was said to be a second-round draft choice. If the stupid, arbitrary suspensions levied by the NFL against Pat Williams and Kevin Williams are allowed to stand, I would do that deal without thinking twice if I'm the Minnesota Vikings. Particularly in light of the fact that Pat and Kevin could be allowed to serve their suspensions separately rather than both of them having to sit at the same time, as was talked about when there was talk of the New Orleans Saints losing Will Smith and Charles Grant at the same time. (Of course, that's the Saints. Since we're talking about the Vikings hoping for this to happen, the chances if it going down are every bit as good as the chances of Roger Goodell once again telling the Vikings to go screw themselves.)
But let's pretend that it would actually happen that way. If that were to happen, for the first four games, the Vikings could be starting Haynesworth next to Pat Williams at defensive tackle. For the next four, we'd see Haynesworth out there with Kevin Williams. And in the eight games to close out the season, the Vikings would have a three-man tackle rotation unlike anything the NFL has seen in. . .well, maybe ever, but certainly in a long damn time. Even if Pat and Kevin were suspended at the same time, Haynesworth could work with Jimmy Kennedy, Fred Evans, and Letroy Guion to hold down the middle for those first four games. . .which, considering that Pat is generally only a two-down player these days anyway, might not give us that big a drop-off after all. And then from Game 5 through Game 16, Kevin Williams, Pat Williams, and Albert Haynesworth could strike down upon opposing offensive lines with great vengeance and furious anger.
As far as Haynesworth's contract is concerned, we really wouldn't have a whole lot to worry about as far as money goes. According to the story that ESPN put out as soon as Haynesworth's deal was signed, he was scheduled to make $32 million of his guaranteed $41 million in the first 13 months of the contract. Since we're already past that point, Minnesota's obligation to Haynesworth would be for two years at a cost of about nine million dollars, according to this breakdown of his contract.
Guaranteed Money:
- Signing Bonus: $5M
- 2009 guaranteed P5 salary: $6M
- Option Bonus: $21M
- 2010 guaranteed P5 salary: $3.6M
- 2011 guaranteed P5 salary: $5.4M
TOTALING: $41M guaranteed
And, as I said, the first three items on that list have been graciously taken care of by the Redskins already, leaving the Vikings to (potentially) take care of the guaranteed 2010 and 2011 salaries listed above. (Read the rest of the story at the link and see how the rest of the money is broken down. Then laugh at Daniel Snyder.)
But if there is a potential upside to the idiotic suspensions levied by the NFL against Pat and Kevin Williams, this could be it. While some people might think that Haynesworth's motivation could be a problem, as long as Karl Dunbar is the Minnesota Vikings' defensive line coach, I don't see motivation as being a problem for anybody at that position at any time.
I think this is a move the Vikings should most definitely consider making. What do you folks think?
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I kinda like the move if it happens
With most of the money taken care of by Washington, there really isn’t much to lose. I think there is enough veteran leadership to keep him in line if and when he does get out of line or lazy. I say go for it. You could do worse.
by SeanInEauClaireWi on May 8, 2010 11:55 PM CDT reply actions
I like the pulp fiction reference
by J.A. Aka The Mullet on May 9, 2010 12:19 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
But
it should be offensive, not defensive lines
The best defensive line is very, very offensive :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Phat Pat considered retirement this season...
So what stops him next season? Load up with talent I say, and if Pat retires, you’re good. The downside is guys like Kennedy and Evans who filled in nicely last year would see the field less and may cause them to grumble, but, best 11 guys right?
by Runt of the Litter on May 9, 2010 12:32 AM CDT reply actions
Kennedy and Evans filled in nicely, but
It was noticibly easier for teams to run up the middle when they(especially Evans) were in. Haynesworth all the way! Like its been stated, with the hefty portion of his contact taken care of Albert could step in and after Pat retires at this seasons end were all set.
Haynesworth biggest problem with the Redskins is that he doesn’t like his role in the 3-4. He wants to play in a 4-3 and would be a monster for (us)the Vikings.
Get it done yesterday!!!!!!!!!
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
Sign him...
Sounds like a good insurance policy to me and a smart move for us long term…few downsides with this for us, think he will fall into line to play at the same level as the caliber of players surrounding him do…
I would rather be IN the Arena than watching from the stands...That is my life!
* Read Teddy Roosevelt's "Man in the Arena" if you need further explanation...
by vikingfanfrom afar on May 9, 2010 3:10 AM CDT reply actions
Why isn't it done yet?
It makes sense to me. The Vikes would have to give up a draft choice next year for him, but it does make a lot of sense. As I said to a friend earlier today too… there will be no motivational problems working for coach Dunbar. He doesn’t allow it, nor would the other guys along the best defensive line in football.
It may take a village to raise a child, but it takes a Viking to raze a village.
Can we really talk about Hainesworth?
Is he the kind of player that the Vikings hire? A high priced older player that decides when he will play and when he won’t. A player that absolutely failed in every aspect of his position last year. A player that did not make those around him better. A player that decided he owed the team nothing when the team needed him to play the NT position in the 3-4 set.
Would we like it if Robison decided never to help at the DT position when the coaches ask him to? Would you think he was great if Jared Allen decided to go against the coaches wishes to have him pass cover at times?
Hainesworth might be a stand-up guy that has the best interest of his teammates at heart. But he sure didn’t show that ever since he went to Washington. He wants to play for the Vikings. A team that stands for everything he is not. A team that was built on the kind of ethic he doesn’t show. I bet he does want to play for us.
We will get along just fine with our DT rotation. Why? Because we have players that can contribute when asked. Not just when they feel like it.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
So you’re saying just trying hard and being a good teammate are the keys to winning the Superbowl?
Ya, you’re right. There’s certainly no need for talent if everybody just “gives it their all”. Go ahead and avoid bringing in the best talent available and just stick with a team full of backups who try hard. That should be enough.
I'm saying we already have the talent to win the super bowl.
The run defense and sack ability of our D-Line is good enough to win the Super Bowl. They proved that. It is a D-Line that excels. But for you to suggest that bringing in unmotivated, dispassionate, and overpaid talent can help the Vikings is ignoring the bad effect it can have.
Could Albert help? Sure. Did he prove that for 39 Million he would help his team? No.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 7:19 AM CDT up reply actions
thought it was nine million not 39.
So thinking on that level it’s not a much of a risk as you think it is. Nine million for Haynesworth is pretty dang cheap, it would be nice, it would be even better if we could move that to third round and TJ.
I’m big on team chemistry and I think Haynesworth could be a blight on it. However, without KWill and Pat I’m not sure we can win enough games to beat the Pack out as division leaders.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Link pay to performance
Then if he doesn’t ‘feel like it’, he can sit down and make much less money while Jimmy Kennedy makes him look bad for his next team interview.
“Mood? What has mood to do with it? You fight when the necessity arises — no matter the mood! Mood’s a thing for cattle or making love or playing the baliset. It’s not for fighting.”
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Impossible!
You are picking up a contract that is owed 61 Million dollars for the next 6 seasons. If you fire Albert after the next two seasons you only have to pay him the 9 Million owed during that time. You can not add incentives or restructure unless Albert is willing to tear up the old deal. Of course he has shown that he is such a great team player that I am sure he will gladly do that.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Even Flash Gordon couldn't do it
Wow, I missed the part about a 6 year remaining contract, I thought it was just 2!
No wonder they can’t motivate the guy now….
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
the thing is,
He has 9 mil of guaranteed money left on his deal, after that, we would not owe him much. however you slice it, 2 years for 9 mil would be a steal. we would only owe 9 mil for a potential game changer. Look at Washington’s roster Would you REALLY be motivated to play? He wants to win a championship, with Minnesota’s Roster, he would have the motivation to actually play. I guess I look that the rewards greatly out weight the negatives.
What are you waiting for Mr. Spielmen?
I can understand why he wouldn’t want to be the NT in a 3-4. It’d be a waste of his talents. The man is a beastly 4-3 DT. It would be like asking Jared Allen to play DT. You’re telling me he would just go ahead and do that without griping about it? Because I kind of doubt it.
Will we be fine with our rotation at DT? Eventually, yeah. For the first four weeks? . . . No, probably not. Because guys won’t need to double our backup DTs as much, which means Allen and Edwards are going to see more double-teaming, which means less pressure, and therefore our secondary getting carved to pieces.
If I paid Hainesworth 39 Million dollars I would expect his loyalty and effort, not griping.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 7:21 AM CDT up reply actions
If you were an idiot like Snyder and didn't realize that sticking a 4-3 tackle
into a 3-4 NT position was a bad idea than you’d deserve the mess you got. Snyder hired a man for a position that he didn’t play, based on the idea that he was good player not good at that position. When people are idiots they have to take responsability for their actions. I’ll tell you this, if my company suddenly had me doing COBOL work I would bitch and moan and in about 2 months leave, and I wouldn’t have any issue about myself because of it either.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
They had his loyalty and effort
when they were a 4-3 defense. He did fairly well considering what they had on the D-Line in his years in Washington. But switching to the 3-4 and telling Albert, one of the better pass-rushing DTs in the league, that he’s just going to take up space is asking for trouble. I mean, it would be like us telling Chad Greenway that he needs to become our LDE. What a waste of an OLB that would be.
Loyalty and effort is a two way street, you have to give it as well. Telling the man you’re going to waste his considerable skill is not loyalty at all.
Loyalty and effort is a two way street, you have to give it as well. Telling the man you’re going to waste his considerable skill is not loyalty at all.
Exactly. The only coin that buys real loyalty is loyalty given.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Asking a man to do something for your team that he can do
is asking Albert to be a football player. Albert’s not wanting to play NT is a far cry from not trying. A far cry from not helping. A far cry from living up to your obligations. The fact that he was paid all that up front money just worsens the situation for Albert. I understand Albert not wanting to be a 3-4 NT. But that doesn’t excuse him from being a good teammate.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions
It's a business
If he plays NT, and his production goes down, which it would since he’s not supposed to be getting penetration, then so does his contract value. I don’t remember hearing about how he’s a horrible teammate, he’s just not showing up to the camps because he’s protesting what the team’s doing. He’s thinking ahead, which is what all players do. Are you gonna say Chris Johnson isn’t a good teammate either, because he’s holding out for a better contract?
Can we sign him?
I know there are some weird rules this year about only being able to sign if we lose people…does this apply to a trade as well?
If he was a free agent we couldn't
But since it’s a trade were we would be alright
by J.A. Aka The Mullet on May 9, 2010 8:35 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
He fits in as a DT
It’d mean Pat Williams stays in for the first, maybe second down, then Haynesworth goes out. I mean, honestly, Pat gets winded a bit out there it seems, this will help keep both him and Kevin fresher all season.
sounds good, but
what would be the redskins asking price now, after the draft. they could have addressed his departure with a second round pick, i guess. but now that opportunity is gone.
something tells me that this is just the kinda guy that shanahan wants to keep around. a guy with an attitude that he can use as an example to show everyone else that he won’t let prima donna get his way….
but i’ll still laugh at daniel snyder anyway.
besides, we already have a starting prima donna, hehehe !
in the future there will be no war...there will only be rollerball.
AH...A lot more upside potential than downside.
This deal really is a no brainer if we get him for 3.6 mil in 2010. If he plays well 5.4 mil in2011…get while the getting is good.
a week ago, hells no
right now, hells yeah! I am also imagining what would happen we swung kevin to DE and kept pat and al in the center, holy shit! but that is only if kevin can play DE effectively. purple people eaters anyone? (ps this also means that albert doesnt suck or get injured)
Didn't we try Kevin at DE once?
I don’t think it worked out to well
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on May 9, 2010 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes and yes
10 sacks that year (2003). That’s his 2nd highest sack total to date.
Another stud Vikings DT, John Randle, amassed 38 sacks in the 4 seasons he played primarily or entirely as a DE.
Man that'd really grind Edwards gears..
if we get Haynesworth, throw him in the middle with Pat, and put Kevin on Edward’s side.
I think moving KW to DE would be a mistake
I think he’s too big (300 pounds) to be an effective edge rusher. He’s an up the middle bull rusher.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
The case for Henderson is being made for his malcontent due to a position switch...
And now we want to ask KWill, the best 3 tech in the league, to change positions as well?
Think about that for a second…
I see Haynesworth as insurance for the upcoming suspensions of the Williams Wall, nothing else. That would be ironic crazy to ask the anchor of our defense to move outside to accomodate Haynesworth.
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
Some places weren't meant to be.
Clearly, Washington was not for Haynesworth. 3-4 obviously was a problem for him, but nothing 41 million dollars couldn’t help ease. He’s not worth that much to me, since he didn’t really do well except when he had a superb DE playing next to him. The upside here…he does have a superb DE playing next to him. Even better, he (eventually) would have a superb DT next to him as well. Kevin is probably the most dominant DT in the game, and Pat the greatest at what he does. I think if you add Haynesworth to our D-line it would be a nightmare for teams to establish a productive running game. He surely wouldn’t be asked to be the best player on the defense as he was asked to be in Washington. (They too have great defenders though)
I say let it happen. Worst case scenario, it doesn’t work out and we still have 2 pro-bowl DT’s to finish the season with very serviceable Back-ups. I’m all for it, and I hope Frazier can see what kind of asset Haynesworth could be.
SKOL
They weren't a 3-4
when Haynesworth signed the contract. They were still a 4-3 defense at that time. They only recently decided to change to a 3-4, which is why he’s not happy.
Exactly, I can completly understand the frustration that someone like Haynesworth is feeling right now
Who wants to be made unproductive because the coaches are pigeon holing you into a style of play that you don’t do well in? 3-4 is set up for linebackers to make plays and linemen to hold up other linemen.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Right, but it's not just that
… Actually now that I think about it, I’m not sure if that was sarcasm or not.
Anyway, the 3-4 isn’t a terrible system. Really it’s not. The only issue I would have with Washington switching to the 3-4 isn’t that the linemen hold up other linemen. That’s going to happen in any system, and it’s part of the dirty-job of the linemen, particularly the DTs. What I would be most upset with is that Haynesworth is so much more than just a big body to clog up space. He’s better than that. It’s just a complete waste for him to be taking up defenders, rather than trying to split them.
I don't understand your point.
Haynesworth is so much more than just a big body to clog up space.
The Redskins expect their LBs to rush the passer and make sacks and hurries. The three down linemen stop the rush and create rushing lanes for those linebackers. Just because he has shown some pass rush abilities ( 27 sacks in 7 years prior to the Skins) does not mean being a NT is not an extremely good use of Alberts skills by the Skins. But we won’t know because Albert is to selfish to try. To selfish about his sack numbers to give effort for a team that paid him 39 Million dollars in one season. Money that was suppose to cover three years worth of production.
His action speak louder than his words. He is not a good team player.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Ok, lets look at this
Hanesworth starts as a 4-3 he does reasonably well and is highly paid. Now, they move to a 3-4. Hanesworth’s production goes down because what they need him to do suddenly becomes one dimensional. It was not his fault that he got put into a bad system for him. He decides he needs to leave. If this were someone on our team I think your position on him would differ.
Personally, I don’t see Hanesworth doing anything that is terribly bad, but then i don’t really pay attention to him that much so he could be slacking off every other play for all I know.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Haynesworth has had as many arrest warrants
as he’s had good seasons in the NFL. Add in the infamous stomping incident, he’s had more run in’s with the law than he has Pro Bowl team pictures.
Haynesworth is a huge gamble, and is in a lot of ways the Randy Moss of defensive tackles. If he wants to play, he’d be an asset.
If he doesn’t, he’s just an ass.
So I used to go by MilCardFan, but I was able to change my screen name. Because I'm kind of a big deal. People know me. Yeah.
Get Haynesworth in a 4-3 where he belongs
On a championship calibur team, with Karl Dunbar coaching him and added years to learn from his mistakes. He would probably learn to appreciate this opportunity and not be as big a risk as one might think.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
5 Game Suspension, Fines, Arrests, Unmotivated, Selfish, Arrogant...for starters
I can’t believe you’re the first one to mention the stomping incident. We’re worried about 4 game suspensions with Kevin and Pat. Imagine signing Haynesworth and then having him do this giant angry baby routine while in Purple: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwxMRPTsYeo
The suspension is the longest in modern NFL history for an on-the-field incident. After his big mea culpa dog-and-pony-show saying he was going to take anger management and would be working with kids (!), he served out his time and then in the game against Jacksonville was penalized and later fined for unnecessary roughness, slamming Maurice Jones-Drew to the ground. His reply: “I’m not going to be any gentler or whatever. Maybe I’ll just help them up.”
So, you can see, he learns from his mistakes.
“An incident occurred at a Titans training camp in 2003, where Haynesworth kicked his former teammate, center Justin Hartwig, in the chest, and had to be restrained by other teammates.”
Sounds like a team player, huh?
And then there were the arrests too:
Arrest warrants were issued against Haynesworth in two Tennessee counties in May 2006 stemming from a traffic incident on Interstate 40. Both sets of charges were dropped in June 2006. The judge in the Putnam County case tossed the charges on the grounds that the alleged offense happened out of their jurisdiction. In Smith County, the district attorney dismissed the charges. In March 2009, Haynesworth was indicted on two misdemeanor traffic charges stemming from a December 2008 car accident in Tennessee.
He leaves the Titans for not just a bigger paycheck, but insist on inflating the image of the figure to $100 million, because he’s the most important and valuable player, ever. Right? And after all that, he wants to come to the Vikings and won’t even show up for the Redskins OTAs?
To me, it’s kinda like buying a monster truck with a lot of miles and wear and tear on it. You have to get rid of at least one of your other garage toys. It costs you a lot to buy, to maintain and to keep fueled, if you can find the right fuel that is. And for all that, when you take it out to have fun, it’s loud and obnoxious. All your neighbors hate you, for good reason. And you get fined by the cops and have your DL suspended.
by Oregon Viking on May 22, 2010 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Could be a good insurance policy
if let’s say, Ray Edwards, were to hold out. Could move Kevin to the DE position. In which, I think he would be a stud at.
For a second round draft pick?!? NO FREAKIN' WAY.
That was Washington’s asking price a couple weeks ago. The guy is starting his 9th year in the league, and has had a series of injuries, along with a few incidents that have made him a bit of a problem for both teams he’s played for. No way I’d want to see the Vikes even come close to giving up a 2nd round pick for all that. DT’s Brian Price and Terrence Cody were both selected in the 2nd round this year. I’d much rather get a young, healthy player with the potential to play another 9 years, than a guy whose already played that long. His salary is fine. I wouldn’t mind seeing them pay that money if they think he can help, but for a guy who’s likely to give you two years (at best) I’d limit the draft pick to a 4th rounder or later.
2 years at best.
That is really cutting it short. The guy is 28 years old and has had injuries, but has given 12 or more games in his last few seasons, which with the Vikes depth would be at least 12 or more. He wouldn’t be worn out to the extent he has been on the Vikes.
My guess is the Vikes have a late(hopefully last) 2nd round pick next year. I would give that for what Haynesworth bring in a 4-3 D in a heartbeat.
Favre's ankle, Starcaps BS and hopefully a busy Piston offseason, oh my. Go Netherlands/Holland/Dutch Soccer(no its not Football)!
How many guys who 'need motivation' do you risk putting on one roster?
Jimmy Kennedy was a 1st round draft pick who failed with his first 4 teams because he supposedly ‘lacked motivation’. Now they have Everson Griffen, the rookie who many thought had first round talent, but who went in the 4th because he ‘lacked motivation’, too. Now Haynesworth? He’s been tagged with that same label (as well as some other issues). Just think – in a couple years, they could have Haynesworth, Kennedy, and Griffen all starting on the same line. And don’t give me this ‘Dunbar can keep them motivated’ BS. If making millions of dollars a year doesn’t light a fire under your ass, no coach is going too, either. Coaches TEACH players how to be good. They don’t make people WANT to be good. That comes from the players. Tread with caution on Albtert ‘HEADCASE’ Haynesworth. I don’t think he’s worth it.
I'm gonna have to disagree with the whole
‘Coaches just teach players how to be good’ If that was the case, then our defensive line wouldn’t even really need a coach at all, since they perform so well and are pretty experienced. Part of the coach’s job is to motivate players, that’s just how it goes.
Your point would hold more weight if you hadn't misquoted me
I didn’t say ‘coaches JUST teach players how to be good’, but that was awful nice of you to go ahead and insert that key word. Let me ask you this: At your job, if your boss needed to motivate you to show up, to do what you were hired to do, to get along with your co-workers, etc., how long do you think he would keep you around? THAT is what I’m talking about, and the fact that first round talents like Jimmy Kennedy and Albert Haynesworth are now working on a combined EIGHT teams in the NFL careers, proves my point about bosses not wasting their time with people who can’t motivate THEMSELVES. Now, consider the fact that they also make millions of dollars more than I’m guessing you or any of the rest of us make, and you can start to imagine the high premium that is put on athletes who not only have talent, but who also prove they have DESIRE. These guys haven’t always done well in that department, and that is why they’ve earned their tainted reputations.
Well I am a boss, and I motivate people all the time.
People need motivation, not to work, most people will do that anyway. However, if you want them to work with a high degree of competence, then it is your job as the manager to manage that.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
There's a difference, though
Big difference between motivating someone who wants to succeed by saying and going the right things to push his buttons, vs. motivating someone just to want to play the game. What worries me about this character is that a lot of people have claimed he’s not really that into his whole gig until he’s in the last year of his contract, which won’t be for another 2 years. I’ll defer to Childress and Spielman on this, as their track record has been excellent with regards to personnel. If they think he’ll play up to his potential (which makes him a suitable 4 to 8 game cover for either of the Williamses), and do it for at least the two years left on his current deal, then I’ll be all for it. I still wouldn’t give up a 2nd rounder, though. Not when a long term starter can be drafted with that pick.
You're right
My mistake for throwing the word ‘just’ in there. How you used it in your original post made it sound like you thought that was all they did, however, which is probably why I threw it in like I did.
Also, while you can throw Kennedy into the example of switching teams, since he’s been getting cut from them left and right, you can’t do that with Haynesworth. He’s switched teams because he hit free-agency and teams wanted him, not because of motivational problems. The Titans would’ve kept Haynesworth if they could, believe me.
Question
Are we allowed to have a 5 man defensive front?
That is actually a half-serious question haha.
Yep
defense can line up anyway it wants (on it’s own side of the field of course)
A 5-man D-Line just isn’t a good idea
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on May 9, 2010 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Or...
A brilliant idea?!?! Naw you’re right, I don’t see a 5 man D-line working at all. With all of the talent on the D-line I don’t see Zygi bringing Albert in. We already don’t have enough spots on the starting lineup for the talent we have. Jared +Pat + Kevin + Brian + Ray + Everson. All starters imo
I like Robison over Edwards though
It's called a 5-2 or 5-1 you see it in high school sometimes but it's only good against certain things
so if they opposing offense has any skills at all they end up shredding you.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Can you imagine running a successful trap play against a 5-2
Good for 10 yards or more every time you break the line of scrimmage.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on May 10, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions
I actually would
Love to see that. Jared, Albert, Williams Wall and Ray-Ray Against any line= 1/2 second to get the ball down the field.
With Leber being a Rotational Line backer behind Henderson and Greenway, Why wouldnt this work? If you ask me, A 5 man D-line would make total sense.
No more of that BS chip Block/2 men Hold on Jared Allen. Plus, they can have Ray or Jared Fake a rush and Drop back into Pass Coverage. (I feel theres a Term for that, i just dont know what that would be called?)
This would cause serious accuracy and timing issues, no matter how good any QB we face. (Especially Brees, that Dou. I cant wait to see his @$$ hit the Turf Faster than JaMarcus (?) Russel can shovel a McGangBang down.) (I dunno if that was funny to anyone else, but i LOL’d!
IMO Brian “White Chocolate” Robison should be starting over Ray-Ray. Seems like every time hes on the field, he flushes the qb out of the pocket or gets a Sack.
But back to my original point, If we had a 5 man line, there would be no double teaming, someone would get in the backfield every time, there would literally be no time to get rid of the ball, therefore shoring up the hole’s in our Defense. Maybe its something they should explore in Training Camp, even if they dont trade for Albert. ???
Also, I believe that in order for B-Rob to get more Playing Time, He should switch to OLB.
Problem with it is
it leaves one man open. Much as I love the D-Linemen, we have trouble covering TEs with a LB enough. No good giving them a free catch-and-run. So we should probably just stick with 4.
This is it really, the 5-1, 5-2 is really just a variation of the 3-4
Except your olb end up coming up to the line, they usually don’t even get into a three point stance. So most of the time they will fall back into coverage on teh TE. It does allow you to send the house at the QB as well, however, it allows him easy dump passes if you do.
It's a lot easier to love the Vikings when they win...
Not really
The 50 and the 3-4 are different schemes fundamentally and philosophically. They are both odd fronts but thats about it.
The type of players are different, the gap responsibilities are different, the pass coverages are different just to name a few.
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
Go For It
Realistically, this next year is our best shot at the Super Bowl if Brett comes back. How many average or below average QBs win it all? Only a few. Trent Dilfer?
The window won’t close after this year, but it will slide much closer to the latch. Bring him in.
If we build an amazing defense like the 2000 Ravens
Then T-Jack or Sage could possibly do it
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on May 9, 2010 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Haynesworth test of Childress judgement of character
I’ve heard all these stories about how Childress visits potential Vikings talent’s families and how important character is to him. Haynesworth is very sketchy in the character department and unlike, say Perrilloux (or however you spell it)….a bit too old to change at this point. When he was younger he was just plain vicious and now he’s got motivation issues.
But desperation (Williams bros sit) makes strange bedfellows.
Wild twins Kevin was drafted as a DE .
1. He definately fits the pay range .
2. Dunbar can work with anything !!!
3. He played a lot of DE at Tenn . and has a quick 1st step that’s lost at NT .
4. Sliding Kevin over to Pat’s spot will help Ray/EGriffen (the appeal will block)
5. Hope they don’t want Ray in trade . not good value .
6. Best scenario for QB backups w/BUF-NYG-CHI at home & PHI-DET away at the end
7. All this and HOU-LG Pitts to compete with Herrera and we are ready pending a
backup QB trade .
Not crossing my fingers...
As a Viking fan, I say do it… Great rotation..(no need to move K. Dub to DE) I think Hanynesworth play would be at a high level with the guys around him, and keep Phat Pat on as a asst. D. Line coach after he retires to keep Haynesworth at that level!! lol
I like the idea....
We need the added insurance because of the following..
A pending Williams Wall 4-game suspension, the idea of P. Williams possibly retiring after this season, and the fact that we didn’t even pick a DT in this years draft. We are a super-bowl caliber team and sometimes veterans only have that to play for. And don’t worry about motivation, when you play for a team like the Redskins, it is probably hard to stay motivated.. He could easily be another guy to switch into the defense to keep our defensive line fresh..
Could be a real threat by doing that..
2 year deal could still give us a chance to add depth next year at DT and give a rookie a little bit of a chance to learn from some pro-bowl DTs
Make it so
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Would be good move
The Vikings are all about winning NOW. This will be in line with that to make a superbowl run.
by greenbay packers backer on May 10, 2010 10:12 AM CDT reply actions
Just get it done already
Although, if the NFL sees that we now have Haynesworth, you can bet your bottom dollar the Williamses will be suspended at the same time!
Maybe when Pat & Kevin come back
he can play RG as well. Cause we all know we need all the help we can get there. Anything to keep the brittle old man off his a** again. Better yet we can use him to take the same dirty cheap shots that the Saints took on Favre on Brees in the opener and see how they like that. Put a softball size inflation in their star QB’s ankle and see if they repeat.
He'd look good in Purple!
and he looks like he might like pie…
I BELIEVE...
by ArizonaVikingsFan on May 10, 2010 12:38 PM CDT reply actions
Lets get him.
Phat Pat will probably retire next year so Albert could be shuffled around this year & settle in next year next to KW. Its also good injury insurance. D line is a strength for us lets keep it that way.
Albert is an odd guy...
Had a reputation as a loner while at UT. Rarely hung out with teammates and had had some major blowups on the practice field both with the Vols and with the Titans. Supposedly came after a teammate after the fact with a broomstick and had to be restrained from attacking Jeff Fisher as well. All that being said, bring him on :)
Maybe he'd knock some sense into Childress
“WHAT WERE YOU THINKING PUTTING TWELVE MEN IN THE HUDDLE! I KILL YOU!”
Now that you say that
If for some reason we do sign him… And during the season when things are not going in the Vikings favor at all and Albert is blaming Childress chasing him along the sidelines.. I will think of Frost’s post and laugh even more.
What would we give up for him?
What about the rights to Ray Edwards? He’s obviously unhappy as a Viking. Trade him for Haynesworth straight up, giving us a lot of flexibility for DT (and a pro-bowl starter while pat/kevin are out). We lose Ray Edwards, but Robison can fill in for the short term and we just picked up a new version of Ray in the draft.
Seems win-win-win to me (Vikes get DT depth, Ray Edwards gets out of Minne and a new contract, Redskins get a good DE (maybe convert to LB?) and get rid of a costly contract/unhappy player).
Some people
Are claiming even the 2nd round pick is not worth it for him.
Some would rather see a 3rd & a back-up QB, or just a 3rd.
I think he would be great insurance… And if his ears are perked with the idea of playing as a Viking… We should look into it…
If we don't
someone else in our division could grab him and that isn’t a good thing. There’s a long time from now until next the next draft so I wouldn’t worry what our 2nd round position might be. It’s not my money but if I was making the decisions I’d jump at the chance and leave the rest up to my training/coaching staff to fix/motivate/light a fire under.
Depth at defensive line is always good
It won the Giants a Super Bowl a few years back
------------------------------------
Read my
Minnesota Vikings Blog (The Viking Ship)
... or my
Minnesota Twins Blog (Twins Dugout)
Do the Vikings want to FINALLY win a Superbowl or are they STILL content with losing in the playoffs???
Haynesworth = Superbowl
No Haynesworth = No Superbowl
This isn’t the case for the Redskins because they aren’t any good, but with the accumulation of talent and experience the Vikes possess, I believe he will put them over the top. He won’t be as good as he was with the Titans the year before he went to the Skins, but he won’t need to be. With Haynesworth and the additions of Gerhardt, Sheppard, and Cook you can put it in the history books: Vikings first Superbowl victory!
How bad does MN want that elusive Superbowl victory???
I guess we will find out
This could work!
We know Haynesworth doesn’t want to play NT in a 3-4 and Ray Edwards wants a new contract. Trade them straight up like PurpleDork suggested..
The Vikings would be even more scary with a rotation of PWilliams, KWilliams, Kennedy, and Haynesworth on the interior of the Dline. Robison can definitely start at DE.
Edwards would bring good experience to the Redskins; Phillip Daniels is 36, Adam Carriker sat out last year with a shoulder injury, and Rob Jackson lack’s experience. Edwards would give the Redskins a nice bookend for Andre Carter. Although he might have to bulk up some (10-15 lbs.) to play in a 3-4 but he has shown that he has the explosiveness to handle the transition.
Haynesworth would need to transition to LDT as his primary position (just like Pat did when he joined the Vikings in 2005).
Both teams would rid themselves of disgruntled players. An additional bonus for the Vikings is that this could extend the window for a possible Superbowl run.
Do not get trick into picking up Haynesworth
Haynesworth was out atleast half the season last year with foot injuries which seem to be a regular problem for him. I guess we were not watching the same games last year the defensive line was the strength of this team. The offensive line had problems opening up running lanes for Adrian and Brett got absolutely massacared in the championship gave. What we need is veteren offensive lineman. It is great we picked one up in the draft. But it is long season we can not count on everyone being healthy. I still beleive with these running backs and wide receivers with a good offensive line this offense would be unstoppable. It would help the defense also by keeping the ball away from the other teams offense and forcing them to score faster. Our advantage with the pass rushers we have. Be smart trade for an offensive lineman.
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