Was Sidney Rice for real in 2009?
by KC Viking on Jun 29, 2010 4:00 PM CDT
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From the day that Sidney Rice was drafted with a second round pick to a team that badly needed help at wide receiver, expectations have been high. He didn't get off to a great start, though. In his first two seasons, he caught 46 passes for 537 yards. Even Todd Pinkston surpassed those receptions or yardage totals in 4 consecutive individual seasons. Worse yet, Rice's production had fallen off along a downward trend.
Then Brett Favre arrived in town. Guns were slung, games were won and suddenly Sidney was skyrocketing into the top tier of NFL wide receivers. Despite his relatively high average yards per reception, he rarely had much separation from the defender(s) on any of the 83 receptions.
What will come of Sidney Rice after Favre retires? Will he still be unsung and for real, or a one-and-done deal?
This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a community, that view is no less important.
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I voted for sort of. He’s got great size and great athleticism no doubt. So because of those things, I think he’ll always be pretty good. At the same time though, I think Favre helped him out a lot.
Don’t forget, he was a 19-20 year old rookie his first season and spent most of his second season trying to come back from a PCL injury in his knee. Obviously Farve had a hand in getting his numbers as high as he did, but most people expected Rice to have more of a break out year in his 3rd year in the league regardless of the QB. Definitely “broke out” more than most probably expected, but he is for real.
Definitely..
Most people forget that Rice injured his PCL in the preseason, re-aggravated it twice early in the season and was not fully healthy until well into the season.
Not to mention he only started 3 games that year.
Not surprised he did well..
.. But I am surprised he did THAT well.
I have been a Sidney fan ever since I came in. Had his jersey, etc. Just around the beginning of this year and late last year, my friends finally started prodding me.. why do you like that ‘nobody’ receiver? Needless to say, I had a big smile as a multi-Rice fantasy owner in ’09. :)
I saw all I needed to see with his 1st few TD catches (especially his very 1st one, rookie year). The guy achieves near-elite separation somehow almost every time the ball is in the air. Him working out with CC and Fitz is only strengthening his foundation for a productive NFL career.
Sid catches everything thrown to him.. ‘good’ or at least decent throws, that is. ;)
Not elite separation
He made most of his 2009 catches (plus the TD vs. ATL in 2008 which made some think that TJ was all that and a bag of chips) with very little separation. That is the #1 reason why some doubt him (I’m not alone).
I agree on separation
The thing Sidney does really well is body positioning like Antonio Gates. He doesn’t get great separation but as the ball is arriving he blocks out the defender and creates his separation as the ball arrives. I’m not sure if he’ll continue to be a deep-threat like last year but he will be a good possession and red-zone target for many years.
by CanadianViking on Jun 29, 2010 9:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Great ability to shield the ball
I’m not arguing that Sidney isn’t talented enough to have this sort of season again. I’m just saying that he will need high quality play from his QB since there is such a small margin of error due to the lack of separation. I doubt that shielding could make up for a less than great throw. Great or AMAZING accuracy would still be required.
I agree with you to an extent.
Rice did make some great catches on inaccurate passes last year though. His hands allow him to catch the ball out of frame quite often. Favre made Sidney better but there were a few times where Rice made Favre look good too. The late touchdown against the Bears and that sideline catch against the Steelers where he managed to get his feet down somehow come to mind.
by CanadianViking on Jun 29, 2010 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes
Those were good, and there were more. I can’t deny that he is an otherwise talented receiver aside from not getting good or better separation.
The Moss-like catch in the Dallas game??
Or was it the Giants, the over the shoulder snag…
But that play only illustrates KC's point
because that DB was all over Rice’s back. The only reason Rice scored that TD was because the safety inexplicably didn’t try to tackle him, because he was still looking for the ball. Otherwise Rice SHOULD have been stopped.
Like I’ve said in other threads, he’s not very fast and unless he’s wide open doesn’t get much YAC, but he does know how to catch the football.
Ehh
What about the Lions game? Favre was ranting on the sideline how they couldn’t cover Sidney….
Unfortunately
I didn’t get to see that game, I listened to it on the radio at work when I could and he did amazing I heard. But one game doesn’t break a trend.
Unless he’s wide open, he’s not going to get much YAC. I remember him getting run down quite a few times when he hauled in a long pass. If he was even a smidge faster, he’d have a few extra TDs on his stat sheet.
While he isn’t the fastest receiver out there and maybe his YAC aren’t topping any lists, the guy just simply catches the ball. We could have Troy Williamson still…no YAC or receptions with Old alligator arms. ;)
Bears vs. Vikings Tickets - $150
Beer and food for 24 tailgate bus trip - More than $150
Watching Jared Allen destroy Jay Cutler LIVE - Priceless!!!!
SKOL Vikings!!!!
Not denying that
he’s an excellent possession reciever with a great vertical leap. He’s a superb red-zone target and he seemed to know where to go to get open/Favre’s attention last year.
So...
You still have to give credit to Rice for that play.
Most defenders watch the receivers eyes, and react to their reaction. One of the things Sidney picked up from the Fitz/Carter camp was disguising his reaction to the ball.
That is why the defender was lost, because Sidney did not react to the ball until it was in his hands.
I dunno about that
Maybe you’re right that Rice didn’t react to it, but he was still a good 10 to 15 yards from the endzone when he caught it. The defender had plenty of time to stop the TD, and he just had a mental lapse and didn’t even try to tackle Rice.
A mental lapse?
A professional football player has a mental lapse and forgets to tackle a guy who catches the ball? No, that makes no sense.
He didn’t try to tackle Rice because he didn’t know where the ball was. He thought it was on the ground.
Watch the play again:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/minnesota-vikings/09000d5d815c9b02/Favre-to-Rice
The defender thought the ball hit the ground, he didn’t see Rice catch it so he didn’t try to tackle him.
That's not a mental lapse?
Thinking it’s on the ground when you just watched it fall into the reciever’s arms? Granted Rice did a good job of shielding it away from the defender with his body, but the DB SHOULD have made that tackle and stopped the TD. Hell, he even put a hand on Rice after he caught it.
You said:
he just had a mental lapse and didn’t even try to tackle Rice.
Which I would take as “forgot to tackle”. I am saying he didn’t think Rice caught the ball.
Look at his reaction, even after he is in the end zone the defender looks back behind him toward the ground trying to find the ball.
You seem to be missing my point. My point is that the defender NEVER SAW THE BALL. He never saw it land in Rice’s hands, because Rice did such a good job hiding his reaction to the ball.
He was a basketball player, right?
Kind of like going up for a rebound….
Gates was a basketball player.
Don’t know if Sidney was but it wouldn’t suprise me.
by CanadianViking on Jun 30, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Probably my misnomer with 'separation'
I never meant foot speed. I meant body positioning separation. It’s obvious he doesn’t have speed, nor any kind of exceptional burst.
The guy is a vacuum cleaner, that’s all I’m sure of.
by BleedingPurple on Jun 30, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions
..Last thing
To me, separation can mean ‘up’ just as much as it does ‘out’. Separating yourself from a defender, however a WR gets it done.
by BleedingPurple on Jun 30, 2010 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Agree with you.
Separation involves many different skills. In Sidney’s case it’s great body control, hands, and leaping ability that give him the separation he needs. I think he learned a lot from Fitzgerald who isn’t fast either but still manages to catch a lot of balls.
by CanadianViking on Jun 30, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes.
Rice is damn good, and I believe he’ll continue to be damn good once Favre retires.
-------
Stupid babies need the most attention!
Rice is The Man!
In the red zone, at least one play every set of downs should be to Sidin the end zone. He’s got hands of glue!
Rice
Had help from Favre, no doubt. But, I think he’ll be successful whenever a great or above QB is throwing to him.
He has time to learn the system better, get more receptions, & show what he is truly capable of.
Unless the starting QB (Which will be Favre) finds a more favorable target (like Webb/Harvin), we’ll continue to see great receptions by Rice.
I understand the poll ??
It is a compliment to Brett . Chris Carter made Sidney Rice and let’s not forget that . Another camp with Chris , a little bulk and lerning to explode of the line with his lack of over all speed and he will get better . Berrian healthy . Harvin more involved . Shank in the red zone . A freshman power back .AP . We face good OL’s and good run defenses this year . Not big Secondaries . Less snow games will assist to since he doesn’t have much experience with snow being from South Carolina .
I dunno if you can say it was the camp
I mean, yeah, I’m sure it helped, but I’d be more willing to heap the praise on Favre than I would a mini-camp. I’m sure he got some good tips out of it, no doubt, but I can’t see it being a big factor in his season.
Both
Favre deserves much of the credit, but there is no doubt that CC’s camp can teach many WRs several things, too. Rice is not the first WR to have a breakout year after going through CC’s camp.
I was bummed last year cause Jennings went to that camp too and if anything he regressed a little after it. I was expecting a GREAT year from him…I still think he probably picked up a lot of things though and it was more of his officially taking the #1 WR spot from Driver that caused a little regression.
I do think it probably helped Rice some. CC had a great work ethic and that is something these young kids need to pick up on. Guys like Rice and CC were consummate professionals that worked their tails off to become great.
Working with CC and Fitz
definitely helped his game as did Brett.
Rice is Real
Yes, certainly having an accurate QB with a shotgun arm is a huge help to any WR, but that doesn’t take away from the fact the WR still has to catch it. Rice doesn’t get big separation but he’s compensated for that with body-blocking and reach, snagging balls that are out of the reach of the opposition. Last year’s camp with Cris Carter, Jerry Rice, and Larry Fitzgerald, was clearly both educational and beneficial, and combined with healing up and taking off the leg brace that he had worn since October the previous year, we saw a vastly improved Sidney Rice.
Anyone remember seeing Rice on Special Teams, snagging the on-side kicks? Going up and over the pile, demonstrating that he’s the man with the hands.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I have been saying it since day one.
Sidney Rice is Randy Moss plus .25 seconds on the 40 yard dash.
.. this might raise eyebrows
.. or roll some eyes. :)
But I believe Sidney has better hands than Moss. Even the great Randy himself has strung together a few drops in his career. I hardly see Rice drop anything.
On Moss’ side. Rice also can never compare to the ’Freak’s’ burst.
by BleedingPurple on Jun 30, 2010 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Not even close
Rice has many years to go making great grabs before he can compare to Moss.
Rice will have drops too.
But he is not even close to Moss in terms of talent but he is damn good.
I don't think it is too early.
People were calling Moss one of the best ever in his first few years. But he also had a QB who could get him the ball.
Had Rice a top-10 QB and no injuries his first 2 years you would probably have a different opinion.
The key thing about Rice is his work ethic and attitude.
He wants to be the best, he fights to be the best, he puts in the work to be the best and he has the physical skills to be the best.
Moss simply had talent, he didn’t want to be the best, he just thought he was the best and may have been right.
I think Sidney has the ability to surpass Moss in a lot of ways, and with his attitude he likely will. But he will always be missing the burst that Moss was born with.
I'm gonna have to give Moss the total advantage
Rice has made some spectacular catches, but Randy is simply amazing.
Ya but
Comparing the two isn’t exactly easy
Favre threw to all sorts of receivers
Including AP & CT.. Even flippin Tahi got a TD catch.
Harvin & Taylor were favored 3rd down targets.
Berrian had a good fair share of catches
Shiancoe was a great Red-zone target
and Rice seemed to be the receiver who had the most catches & yards.
One of the most amazing things of Webb, is his leaping ability and large hands.
The large hands go great with being a QB, but, it would also go great with being a receiver. May as well utilize that leaping ability… I hope we see him at some WR this year.
He'll be the perfect wildcat option if he does eventually win the starting position
at QB. ‘Cause we wouldn’t need to take him off the field to suddenly change into the formation.
Definitely yes
He put in the work last offseason, has a great WR coach, is on a loaded team and he now has the confidence going forward in his career. Sure Brett did help but he didn’t make him, we saw flashes of what was to come his rookie year. Rice is the real deal no doubt about it.
Catch over GB @ 1:50 was very Moss like
as were a bunch of his other catches.
Sry peeps
But who did we have throwing balls to Percy his first 2 years and if they was such great Q.B.s how come we are all waiting for Favre to come back this year.
Hate him or love him Favre gets the most out of anybody he is throwing to,he picks up on little things and uses them to his advantage.
I think the skill set was there all the time,just needed someone to see and realize what skills young Harvin had.
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