Veteran Players & Draft Picks we passed up. Shame on us.
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 8:50 AM CDT
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PrintThere were many good players the Vikings could have picked up this year to get us to the super bowl. I don't get why we didn't even make an offer to one of these guys ( well we did offer LT I guess). I suppose its just the fact that our coaches are stupid and incompetent.
Read on after the jump.
T.JHoushmandzadeh- He's terrific. In a close game with a 3rd year deep threat quarterback Housh actually caught one pass for 27 yards. Man I wish I had him.
Anthony Cromartie. My god our secondary is so bad and here Cromartie was available. The jet fans are screaming because Cromartie did exactly what he did with the Chargers. He let scoring plays go by him and he made penalties that basically cost his team the win. I sure would have liked him in our secondary against the Saints.
LaDamien Tomlinson: Boy he looked quick. His stat line looked OK with 11 carries and 62 yards. Of course when Shon Greene was taken out of the game and LT was given the running game responsibility he could not get a third down. I'm sure it has nothing to do with his age or ability though. He would have been the Godsen to the Vikings.
Kyle Wilson: Drafted immediately prior to the Vikings pick. Another Cornerback that got beat all night. Had a holding penalty on a 3rd down and 38 that kept a Baltimore drive alive.
Mark Sanchez: Drafted #5 in 2009. Yes the Vikes should have moved up and grabbed a franchise QB. I mean this guy threw for 60 whole yards. He actually threw for 2 first downs. And he isn't quarterbacking the Vikings? I think he played better than Mat Cassell in KC. Why oh why can't our draft people ever get smart enough to properly evaluate a Franchise QB draft pick. I mean it only would have cost us Percy Harvin, Chris Cook, and Toby Gerhart in picks or some veteran players. We are so stupid.
I'm sorry but I can't take this kind of stupidity anymore. I say we just throw in the towel and start over. Its obvious that taking other teams cast-offs or by drafting players that we do not evaluate as great fits for the Vikings, is the only way to succeed in the NFL. At least it is obvious after just one week.
This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a community, that view is no less important.
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I'm still not sold on Gerhart
I still think Jahvid Best would’ve been a good pick for this team
but that would mean no Chris Cook, so I don’t know
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on Sep 14, 2010 10:51 AM CDT reply actions
You mean the Javid Best that rushed for 20 yards on 11 carries against the bears this weekend?
"We have a right to be proud, for in our veins flows the blood of many brave races who fought as the lion fights for lordship. Here, in the whirlpool of European races, the Ugric tribe bore down from Iceland the fighting spirit which Thor and Odin gave them, which their Berserkers displayed to such fell intent on the seaboards of Europe, ay, and of Asia and Africa too, till the peoples thought that the werewolves themselves had come."
-from Bram Stoker's Dracula
I mean the Jahvid Best
that’s running behind one of the worst O-Lines in football
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on Sep 14, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions
It is a draft question that is always asked.
When we drafted Toby it was for several reasons I wager.
1st- AP’s contract is up in one more year. Do you draft Jahvid or Toby to back him up or replace him? Our philosophy is to have the big back not the scat back as your main threat.
2- The Vikings needed a top cornerback. It seemed wiserr to move back and get a top corner and a good back than to take Jahvid and not get the corner we wanted.
3- Javid had concussion problems in college and some thought he was susceptible to them in he Pros.
There is never a right or wrong answer to draft questions for a few years. Both could end up busts or very good players. Both could get injured or Neither will get hurt.
Impossible to tell. The question for each team is : Did you help your team in the draft?
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions
time will tell
No one will know this for certain until each player has three or four years of experience.
by TexasViking on Sep 14, 2010 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Toby hasn't had enough time or reps yet
Let him get used to things. The guys were tough on him in camp and took some mild cheap shots to let him know this is a different world than the college game. Confidence and playing time will cure him and I think you will be happy we have him
by CitrusFLViking on Sep 15, 2010 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't be too hard on Sanchez
He’s still learning, and the Ravens D can really mess with an inexperienced QB. Not saying he’s any good, but just don’t judge him yet, especially on this game.
Don't be to hard on a second year starter that threw for 60 yards?
Does he have a receiver? Oh yeah , he does. If Viking fans can make fun of T-Jacks second year I can sure make fun of this guy. But tongue in cheek. It is only his second year and only one game.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh yeah. Invinceable. Like Palmer, Leinart, and Sanchez
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah I agree it depends on context. I’m not a guy who ridicules TJack, so maybe its more natural for me to cut Sanchez more slack.
I also give him a lot of benefit of the doubt because of his offensive coordinator (and play caller). When Favre was there, there was a simmering battle of wills all season, Favre kept suggesting that the playbook was way more complicated than it needed to be. If a 18 year vet struggled with it, I imagine it must be bewildering for a guy who left college early with only like 12 starts under his belt at USC.
In fact, while researching something for this post, I stumbled upon something stunning: New York Jets: Schottenheimer-Led O Doesn’t Have One 300-Yard Passing Game Since 2006. This blew me away so much I searched three games in particular that I think of as Favre classic games in his year with the Jets: @Patriots, @Tennessee (breaking their shot at perfect season at 12 wins), and against Cardinals. And it’s true: he didn’t throw for 300 yards in any of them! Wow.
Now I understand more than ever why Thompson wanted Favre in New York:
When Chad Pennington signed with the Dolphins, many questioned his ability to play quarterback at a high level. By the time he left the Jets, many fans, including myself, wanted to be rid of Pennington’s weak arm and injury prone shoulder. I remember Chad saying at the time (I’m paraphrasing), "people who know this game know the circumstances under which I play." It’s as if Chad was trying to tell us all something about Schottenheimer on his way out the door. Chad Pennington, with the pop-gun arm, wound up throwing for several 300 yard games for the Dolphins during his first year with the ball club….. it appears if you’re a QB, a wide receiver or tight end in his system, it’s akin to being sent to a super max prison: you can’t break out no matter what you do.
I know they’re a run-first team, but … wow. I am suddenly way less afraid of the Jets, not because of what Sanchez didn’t do yesterday, but because of what his playcaller hasn’t done for five years.
Thanks for the research. Didn't know any of that.
This is why they will stick with Sanchez. He is learning. He already knows some of the playbook. The scary thing is that if they all stick together and learn it? They might be a very scary team. Because their Defense is very very good.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Welcome. Yeah that was my point: not that Sanchez didn’t look terrible on Monday, because he did. But that even so, it is not enough to judge that we are glad not to have him. We can’t judge him yet because he’s only had a year, and he played against the Raven’s D, & with Schotty’s playbook. Three very big hurdles to overcome, and he dealt with them all at once.
Good Post
I agree with every issue you raised. I don’t know how drafts have turned out for other teams but the Vikings front office’s performance in the drafts of the past four years have been very good.
I DO remember the Hershel Walker trade and it made the Cowboys a three time Super Bowl champion and killed the Vikings’ chances for at least four years. Mike Lynn should still be hunted down and made to do hard time for that trade.
I like the team’s draft picks and I like our chances with the team now assembled. My one suggestion is that we need more AP, especially after he and the offensive line have softened the opponents defensive front and linebackers.
Some day we will have to write about the trade. But I will wait until I have the flu and I am on my deathbed first.
Your suggestion as to using AP more I am sure does not fall on deaf ears.
But I stand by ny theory that if AP had been used on 2nd down 3 more times ( that is all that was available) and failed to gain many yards, then the fans would be calling for Beville’s head because he wasn’t inventive and avoided using the great Brett Farve on 2nd and long situations.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Damnit, the batteries went dead in my sarcasm detector.
Somehow the thing still went off and I’m not sure how to shut it down. Um, I disagree with everything. No wait, Chilly is a horrible guitarist! Or, er… dolphins aren’t fish anyway so technically it won’t be a fish-fry!
by Jshore on Sep 14, 2010 11:23 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Won't be a fish-fry. Deserves a rec
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
I think your being a little hard on Sanchez and Wilson. Qb’s generally don’t develop until their 3rd or 4th year in the league. And corner’s usually take even longer then that. Having to play opposite of Revis and Cromartie make things harder on him too. Doesn’t leave many people to try and exploit. Hell, even LT did look pretty good.
I get what you’re doing here but the fact is all of these guys still very well could have an impact this season, and I’m sure some will.
yup, way too early to make comments like that.
in the future there will be no war...there will only be rollerball.
Well I think you missed the point a little.
This really was an attempt to get people at getting back to looking at the Vikings, not other players. The criticism of others was simply a literary device for getting people to not criticize our new people and younger players, rather give them an opportunity to learn. Of course what I said was true in that many highly ranked players don’t perform as expected. Neither do some veteran players ( cough, cough, Farve, Berrian, cough) in certain games.
But really. If Aaron Rodgers had thrown for 60 yards in the first game of his second season what would you be saying?
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I picked up on that. Maybe I took your evaluations a little too serious.
Haha good point.
by packallday555 on Sep 15, 2010 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Some we did miss on
First of all, great, great post. Awesome.
Second, we did pass on Eric Decker, which was a mistake.
Some rookies haven’t had a chance to do anything: Toby Gerhart, Everson Griffin, and Chris DeGeare.
Jimmy Clausen will start for the Panthers next week. I don’t know what to expect, although I was in the camp of “don’t draft him in the 1st or 2nd rounds.”
We’ll see.
I agree with the decker comment
I really wish we had him!
it is better to be thought of as dumb then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
Ben Franklin
by montana vikes fan on Sep 14, 2010 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I liked Decker also but he didn't shine for Denver and their receivers need a shining star.
As for Clausen. He is a rookie. Expect 10-12 TDs and 20 INTs. At least that is the norm for rookie QBs in the NFL. At least for the good ones. I don’t care if he turns out to be great. We did our evaluation and determined he didn’t fit our team. Even if he makes it with Carolina I don’t fault our people for following their evaluations.
The better question is why are they giving up so early on Matt Moore? Is it like pulling T-Jack in 2008?
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 14, 2010 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
The real joke is your laughable analysis
TJ Housh: Are you suggesting that he couldn’t have done more for an already good team like the Vikes than with the poor Lions and so little time to fit in? If you really believe that he will catch 1 ball per game, then you will be eating so much crow that you will be growing your own feathers in some unimaginable places.
LT2: He didn’t look washed up, but Albert Young did. You see, this is possibly or probably the last year for this team to make a serious SB run without spending a few years rebuilding again. If LT2 had one more season in him, then the Vikings should have wanted him—and they did! Nobody can really whine about no LT2 because we all know that the team tried to sign him, and that may have been one of the best moves of the offseason, even though he didn’t end up wearing purple. On the other hand, if Young and/or Gerhart establish themselves before too much of the season is gone, then it will be a really good example of sound decision making at the RB position; however, we shouldn’t assume anything yet with 2 unprovens factoring into the running back position. They still must prove themselves.
Cromartie and Wilson: Yeah, an INT with a 66-yd return is just terrible, and go on pretending that SD didn’t go to the playoffs during his time there. Throw in the fact that Flacco is one of the best QBs in the NFL regardless of age, and it’s ok that BAL only managed 10 points against them. You made it seem as though Cromartie gave up 4 TD passes or something when BAL scored all of 1 TD, and it was on the ground!
Sanchez: He was facing one of the best defenses in the league (6th vs. the pass last year by most measures) and didn’t throw a pick. His rating for week 1 is about the same as Favre’s, against a far more permissive pass D than NO’s, and Sanchez will presumably improve with time. Sanchez’s performance was better than a rating of 26.4 and 4 picks against the lowly Lions in 2007. (And speaking of Cromartie and QBs that only throw 60-something yards, look up T-Joke’s start vs. Cromartie and the Chargers in ’07, also.)
It would have cost us Percy Harvin, Chris Cook and Toby Gerhart…
Not necessarily, and the last 2 of those three have not proven themselves in the NFL at all at this point. Lots of other scenarios could have happened:
- Draft WR DeSean Jackson instead of Tyrell Johnson in ’08.
- Keep Sharper in ’09 and draft a CB like Vontae Davis, Darius Butler or Jairus Byrd.
- Draft the best RG available in the first round of 2010 (safety in FA and Gerhart in the 2nd round if getting rid of Sharper then).
See? The team could have addressed WR and CB earlier and protected Favre better from this point forward, too. Gerhart could still be the exciting backup that he is.
Correction
Sanchez’s rating for week 1 is about the same as Favre’s, which was against a far more permissive pass D (NO’s)…
Laughable analysis.
Yeah, that was the point. It was suppose to be laughable. As is so much of the criticism pointed at the Vikings for losing to the Saints, on the road. It is way to early to be jettisoning this team as a super bowl contender. Of course it is way to early to be calling any 1st or 2nd year player busts or not. Of course it is easy to find fault in every draft when looking with perfect 20/20 hindsight.
The point of the post was not to criticize players from other teams. It was to suggest that Viking fans who covet other players should really ease up and take a look at how talented out players really are. I should give up on sarcasm. It rarely works well for me.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 15, 2010 5:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Right.
Sanchez and Kyle Wilson are busts because they play on another team while Chris Cook and Toby Gerhart are teh aWEsUmz without even seeing the field.
Your sarcasm didn’t work because what you wrote really made fun of any conclusion that the FO didn’t miss out on any high quality help in recent offseasons or that guys like C Cook and Gerhart are sure-fire aces in the hole.
Good points but....
Where those guys in the argument? Maybe I missed it, I admit that I usually only get to the DN once a day and on the weekends I run a day late, and maybe I’ll get to it soon on my upwards path :)
FTR, I was never in favor of any of those guys in Purple, unless the FO vetted and vouched for them. I’m big on that, our FO does an excellent job of it. I almost got hooked into the Whole Housh but he calfed out on us before I felt compelled to learn how to spell his name.
On LT…. I was (and am still) in a certain amount of angst over the loss of Chester Taylor. That one still bothers me, LLV. If we’re going under the presumption that the Vikings are playing for the SB NOW, then why not give the man his 3 or 4 year contract, whatever it takes. Unless they projected his decline…. in which case, if Chester Taylor turns out to suck tail this year, then I have been utterly wrong.
I notice you didn’t put Skelton in the list :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
My understanding was that
we liked LT but he liked the Jets. Remember, he had the opportunity to be picky.
This wasn’t meant to be a complete list. But you and I will be keeping our eyes on Mr. Skelton.
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?"
Joe Kapp
by lifelongvike on Sep 15, 2010 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions
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