Perspective on Sticking with the Tampa-2

is our pass defense has been in the bottom half of the league in yards and TDs allowed. That needs to change more than anything. it’s great that we have a great rush defense, but w/ 2 teams in the NFC north being primarily passing teams (GB and Det), and the other was a passing team (we don’t know what they’ll do w/ Tice at the helm) we need to improve our pass defense DRASTICALLY in order to compete in the division.

GB and Detroit have both shown they can be successful without a running game (though both were far more dangerous when they were balanced) and we have shown we are most dangerous when our defense can defend both (08 and 09)

And FLSKOLMAN is right on the money. Offenses have evolved while the Tampa-2 has stayed basically the same. And has a Tampa-2 defense ever struck fear in the hearts of another team? MAYBE, Chicago’s defense when they had the extremely talented personnel to run it.

Other schemes are more adaptable to your personnel’s strengths.

Obviously running in the Tampa 2 defense greatly improves overall defense, but mostly a result of superb run defense. There could be some things that attribute to the poor pass defense that we don’t usually take into consideration. Some of those years our run defense was so good teams would just abandon the run all together and go after the weaker side of our defense. In 2009 we scored a lot of points, which would force teams into throwing situations. However just those two alone wouldn’t be enough to have a consistently bad pass defense.

I think the talent level of our secondary over this decade has left much to be desired. Are there schemes that could protect a weak secondary? That is something I am not well educated in. Perhaps it is time to move our defense into multiple configurations, depending on what look the offense is running. Cover 2 has its weakness in seams, the very furthest part of each zone. Perhaps starting out in a Tampa 2 and dropping an athletic DE (we have plenty) into coverage WITHOUT running a zone blitz could be an effective way to counter pass happy offenses. This would free up a linebacker to help coverage, and by not rushing a corner or safety we would not have a zone meant for a DB defended by a DE. We would need great push from the remaining three DL so that is the weakness.

if the NFL has shifted to a passing game.

Why the heck are we not beefing up that part of the defense to effectively counter it?! Is there a scheme that will present challenges to any of the final 8 NFL playoff teams this year? If not, then tampa-2 leaves us exposed all day long via passing attack and likely to face an early round exit in the playoffs (assuming we make it that far).

I’m not getting a warm fuzzy feeling but give the vikings the benefit of the doubt.

It is a fixed zone defense, and the breakdown almost always occurs in the handoff from corner to safety in the Tampa 2 scheme.

Even when you have players with great skills, speed, and athletic ability it is not enough, because you have to have smart players, too, who can process the nuances of exactly where that zone is so the entire field is cut off to the passing attack…

Ok, a lot of non-Tampa-2’s around here.
It’s easy to ditch it, but I haven’t seen anyone make a suggestion of a "better" defense (and don’t say 3-4, that’s a defensive scheme not a defensive strategy).
Cover-2 (tampa-2), cover-3 are zone strategies meant to free up extra pass-defender(s) and only making pressure with the front 4. Extra pass-defender? Pass happy league? Hm… Sounds good to me. But we need the right guys for that.
To be able to run man coverage (cover-0, cover-1) you need even better DBs than in cover-2/3. So we need the right guys for that.
Conclusion: We need the right guys and foremost better guys.
(If we can sign Revis, Bailey v2.0 and some suitable DBs in the draft then I’m all in for man coverage)

And the results since 2007 have not been too good. Yeah there have been some injuries but it has only exposed the depth that he has allowed to remain on the team.

I just cannot see how a head coach cannot at least have the one area he is good at be the worst unit on the team.

Sticking with the Tampa 2 is fine but it only makes other teams jobs’ easier when game planning for the Vikings. All they need to do is chip or double Allen on almost every play and let the rest of the line try and get a sack. Then they can pass at will on Greenway who is awful in pass coverage and the rest of the linebackers too. Then they can just throw the ball to the same holes in the secondary that are always there in this defense.

They can practically use the same game plan they had this year on us for next year.

Seems to me the defense will remain the same. So why should I expect different results?

I did not like the Cook pick when they made it and still do not now. And it has nothing to do with his legal issue. It was because he was injured too much in college and did not even make honorable mention in his own conference. I just do not like players like that when drafting. And Frazier personally went down to Virginia to work with Cook and gave his endorsement for the pick. So far, not too good.

any zone defense can be beat all you need is time and a smart QB and WRs. Zone defenses aren’t designed to completely stop a pass. It’s designed to put bodies near WR route trees for down and distances.

Tampa 2 has man zones or Safeties in zones but CBs are man-on-man, most zone schemes or plays rely on pressure from the front 4. The most effective way break this zone is with 3 – 4 wrs sets, forcing the defense into nickel/dime sets then you run screens and draws until that front 4 gets winded. Then it’s game over.

Defenses in general are all the same once the play starts, its the pre-snap reads that really determine how successful a play might be (ergo) we have audibles. And that can happen on both sides of the ball. Many DC with good to great players disguise their blitzes and coverages until the ball is snapped. DB greats like Troy P (pittsburg) routinely comes to the line like he’s blitzing only to be back deep in coverage when the QB launches the ball thinking there was an opening there.

Rookie QBs are baited that way alot, thinking they have an easy out or curl route because the DB simulates a blitz or press man coverage as his pre-snap read only to realize after the ball is snapped that that WR is actually double-covered.

sorry starting to ramble.

Let’s take a look at our defensive needs before we get to bent out of shape here. For our run defense to get back on track we need a true run stuffing NT, Remi is not the answer. For the Tampa 2 to work we need an athletic MLB who can cover and cover a lot of ground (like Urlacher).
We need a WLB who can help in coverage, take care of the flats and run with TE’s ( Leber was good here).
We need CB’s that can press and disrupt the timing on routes ( Cook has shown potential here), and that can help in run support.
We also need safeties that have range, ball skills and can tackle.
We only have two young payers on our roster who can help us and they are Mistal Raymond S, who has good speed and coverage skills and can tackle ,but he needs coaching and experience, (hence hiring someone who is good at that). And Brandon Burton CB, he is good is good at press coverage and has the speed for zone, but he may only be a 4th CB and nothing more.
I left out Cook until further notice.
So we can see that we need more than a few good pieces for us to really make the Tampa 2 work where we want it. But we have the pass rushers for it and we just hired a good DB Coach who can teach it properly and we are going to have about 13 draft picks plus some $$ for FA. So we have hope and I for one am happy and excited for these next few months to see what moves we make.