Vikings Offseason Plan v3.0
by MarkSP18 on Jan 24, 2012 12:45 PM CST
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PrintIt appears the team is sticking with the 4-3 defense. This is not a bad thing but the results have not been too good the last couple of years. Hopefully, injuries are the main reason. I have my doubts. But the main players fit better in this defense so I understand the thinking. Hopefully, the team will add some more talent in order for the defense to really get better. If they are going to be successful in this division then they need to be able to stop the other teams more often than they did this past season. That is for dang sure.
So let is move on to the plan.
Here is an article with some very good information regarding the rules ... http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/faq.asp
Just remember that the salary floor is 89% of the cap which for 2011 was $120.375M per team. But this does not start until 2013.
Here is a good breakdown of the current cap situation done by DJSkillz http://www.dailynorseman.com/2012/1/5/2685018/a-look-at-the-2012-minnesota-vikings-cap-situation
Thus I do not need to replicate his fine efforts. I will just go with his numbers.
Here are the free agents in 2012 that have not been offered new contracts yet and are likely to test the market.
Jim Kleinsasser 34 * retired
E.J. Henderson 31
Visanthe Shiancoe 31
Benny Sapp 30
Greg Camarillo 29
Kenny Onatolu 29
Fred Evans 28
Eric Frampton 27
Devin Aromashodu 27
Xavier Adibi 27
Tyrell Johnson 26
Husain Abdullah 26
Letroy Guion 24
Erin Henderson 25
Matt Katula 29
Scott Kooistra 31
Jarrad Page 27
Sage Rosenfels 33
Lorenzo Booker 27
Patrick Brown 25
This is 20 players.
These are the players that the team could consider releasing for salary reasons. But possibly not.
Steve Hutchinson 34
Anthony Herrera 31
Cedric Griffin 29
That is another 3 players for a total of 23 players. I think that if the Vikings did decide to not sign any of the free agents and release the 3 veterans there could be about 35 mil available for free agents.
Looking at free agency there are plenty of players who would help the Vikings.
So the free agents I think the Vikings could take a shot are ...
SS - Tyvon Branch 25 6-0 205 4.31
Branch is a very good tackler. Hopefully his passes defended and interceptions will improve under the tutelage of Williams and Frazier.
CB – Tim Jennings 28 5-8 185 4.32
I think Jennings can play both inside and outside but is a better fit covering the slot WRs.
DT - Brodrick Bunkley 28 6-3 306 5.01
Bunkley plays the run very well which is a huge need for the Vikings.
OLB - Manny Lawson 27 6-5 241 4.41
I like Lawson because he is fast and he did well last year when given the opportunity. He is also good in coverage.
MLB - Dan Connor 26 6-2 231 4.67
I like Connor. I think he may be ready to come in to his own
WR – Laurent Robinson 26 6-2 199 4.38
I think Robinson is a deep threat and is coming into his own. It may take a little more to woo him.
TE - John Carlson 27 6-5 251 4.72
I think Carlson would be a nice replacement for Shiancoe. Since Musgrave likes the two TE set, Carlson would be another young TE that has proven he can perform in the NFL.
OT - Jared Gaither 25 6-9 340 5.06
I have been wanting to get Gaither for a couple of years now. Why the boneheads did not pick him up last year is a mystery. At worst he can be the bridge between a young tackle being groomed.
So now to the draft.
I think the first two picks are Indianapolis taking Andrew Luck QB obviously and St Louis taking Matt Kalil OT. I switched this pick from Blackmon because I think the Rams will sign a free agent WR (or two) and can select one at the top of the second round or third round if they wanted. I think Jeff Fisher will want to build that offensive line and he is a USC graduate (which probably means nothing). This draft could be cruel to the Vikings because the Rams could be selecting the very player Vikings fans want most in the first 3 rounds. I also think that they know if they pass on Kalil then the Vikings will take him thus making it doubtful they move down IMO.
So that leaves the Vikings in a pretty good position. They could have some offers from teams to trade up so that team can select Robert Griffin III. It is very hard for me to pass on RG3 right here because the Vikings are still unsettled at the QB position despite drafting Ponder last year in the first round. I am not sold on Ponder as are many Vikings fans. But just as many want to give him a chance and think he could be OK. Funny that not many say he is going to be elite. In the end, I think the Vikings will pass and trade down because they do not want to have egg on their face for the Ponder pick (just yet). Interesting that Cleveland is willing to move on from McCoy and is a favorite candidate to land RG3 in many mocks. So why could they move on already and not the Vikings? Is one season going to make much of a difference? And Carolina moved on from Clausen when they had the opportunity to select Newton. You just cannot pass on an elite QB. But sadly, the Vikings probably will.
I do not see Cleveland giving up too much to move up one spot. I do not think it is Holmgren's style. http://clevelandstrikesback.net/browns/statistical-approach-browns-2011-draft-part-one/
Of course Holmgren had some good QBs in place and never was faced with the decision of needing one. I still do not believe he will give up as much as another team.
Thus, I would trade the #3 pick to the Redskins for their #6, #38, and their 2012 2nd round pick.
So now the Vikings are sitting at #6 and I see the first 5 picks going like this ...
1. Indianapolis - Andrew Luck QB
2. St Louis - Matt Kalil OT
3. Washington - Robert Griffin III QB
4. Cleveland - Justin Blackmon WR
5. Tampa Bay - Morris Claiborne CB
Now I think Cincinnati is going to be calling to move up to #6 in order to select Trent Richardson RB. They are not going to resign Cedric Benson most likely and can afford to give up the picks to move up and get the best RB in the draft by far. Since they got that extra first round pick for Carson Palmer they can put it to good use. Having Dalton, Richardson, AJ Green, & Gresham is not a bad core. If they keep Jerome Simpson they will have a nice #2 WR. Plus they get back Jordan Shipley who did well in the slot his first year. I think this would be a fantastic move for the Bengals. They could wait and try and get a different back later but while that seems to be the trend, special backs do not come around too often.
Thus the Vikings trade the #6 pick to the Bengals for the #17 and #21 picks. This is a little steep for Cincy but if they want Richardson then they are going to have to pay a price. He is worth it too. Plus they are asking the Vikings to drop down pretty far.
So now the Vikings have picks 17,21,35,38,67,comp,98,130,193,194,219,222,comp
With the picks here is what I would do …
17. Michael Brockers DT LSU 6-5 306 4.95
The Vikings begin to retool their defensive tackle position which needs immediate help with KWill turning 32 and Ayodele a disappointment. Plus Evans and Guion are free agents and will hit the open market.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/post/2012/01/michael-brockers-2012-nfl-draft-scouting-reports.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=41015
http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2012/01/michael-brockers-scouting-report.html
21. Stephon Gilmore CB South Carolina 6-1 193 4.53
Gilmore is a nice sized prospect that can only help the awful secondary. I think that they need to get him before #35 because other teams like Green Bay or the Rams could snag him.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/gilmore%20stephondd7fe0e2c1/1.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=42021
http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2011/11/stephon-gilmore-scouting-report.html
35. Alshon Jeffery WR South Carolina 6-4 229 4.54
I think Jeffery could drop and the Vikings will only be too happy to take him and develop him into the WR he was in 2010. Many scouts are doubting him and some do not like his conditioning. He will go to one of those pre draft places and get in great shape and probably be taken in the first round by a team like New England. The Vikings may need to trade up a few spots to get him if he does will at the combine. I hope he does not do too well and falls to the Vikings. He falls in this mock.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/jeffery%20alshonb4f61f4f1f/1.html
I went back and forth with Dwight Jones on this pick and if Jeffery is gone I would take Jones most likely.
Now the Vikings make a trade with the Eagles who want to move up. The Vikings trade pick #38 for picks #51, 99, & 145.
51. Kevin Zeitler OG Wisconsin 6-4 315 5.26
The Vikings need a guard in case Charlie Johnson disappoints once he moves inside. Plus in a couple of years Johnson will be gone anyway. Also, if they keep Hutchinson for his last year then Zeitler can step in starting in 2013.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/zeitler%20kevin323f152dd6/1.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=38155
67. Nate Potter OT Boise State 6-6 298 5.18
I think Potter is underrated because of his size. But he already is a pretty good pass blocker. With the signing of Gaither the Vikings have time to allow Potter to gain some weight and strength.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/potter%20nate13d6945dd3/1.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=39208
http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2010/05/nate-potter-scouting-report.html
I would probably go with Mike Adams at #21 if the Vikings do not sign Jared Gaither.
comp. Keenan Robinson LB Texas 6-3 240 4.68
I am hoping that Robinson is still here at this point. I like his game and aggressiveness.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/post/2011/12/fanatical-football-fiends-2012-nfl-draft-scouting-report-on-keenan-robinson.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=37542
http://nflmocks.com/2011/11/19/2012-scouting-report-keenan-robinson-olb-texas/
98. Jeff Fuller WR Texas A&M 6-3 220 4.52
I like adding another big WR who is more of a possession type guy like Michael Jenkins. I think that these are the types of WRs that Ponder needs because he does not throw the deep ball very well. He can throw it deep but it is not his specialty.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/fuller%20jeffccacf1088a/1.html
99. Audie Cole LB North Carolina State 6-4 248 4.72
The Vikings add another young LB to groom to take over in a couple of years hopefully. I know that signing Dan Connor and having Brinkley makes this pick a curious one but Brinkley is a free agent in 2013 and Connor has been banged up quite often. Thus Cole makes some sense to be in place to take over in a year or two. At least to me it does.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/cole%20audie1ad3196516/1.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=36197
I wavered on selecting Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, or T.J. Graham here. But the LBs were not looking too good later.
130. Brandon Taylor SS LSU 5-11 195 4.57
The Vikings need new depth for the safety position. The Vikings need players that have the potential to be a starter as the backups. Not special teams "aces" or players who have probably reached their ceilings.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/taylor%20brandone32b8bdd90/1.html
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=41058
145. Janzen Jackson FS McNeese State 6-0 190 4.49
Another safety with talent who I am hoping is still here in the 5th round.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/jackson%20janzen310a725641/1.html
193. Evan Rodriguez FB/HB Temple 6-2 250 4.67
I like Rodriguez a lot and compare him to Aaron Hernandez. I think he can be that HB the Vikings need. D'Imperio will have some tough competition.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/rodriguez%20evancb5fe5149b/1.html
194. Dominique Hamilton DT Missouri 6-5 320 5.02
A big DT that should be able to contribute a few snaps here and there during his first year.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/hamilton%20dominique403348aeb3/1.html
206. Devon Wylie WR/PR Fresno State 5-9 186 4.39
Wylie was one of the best punt returners in the country. Plus he can catch out of the slot.
http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/leader/national/player/split01/category04/sort01.html
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/wylie%20devond501d16ae1/1.html
219. Adonis Thomas RB Toledo 5-10 185 4.45
The Vikings need another back to go with Gerhart, Todman, and King. I think AP should start the season on the PUP list and I would not play him until November at the earliest. That would give him 10 full months of recovery. He can possibly practice once he comes off the PUP list. If the team is not doing well I would strongly consider putting him on IR for the year. Thomas will probably go to the pracice squad (hopefully).
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/thomas%20adonis17640b2b3a/1.html
comp. Demario Davis LB Arkansas State 6-2 232 4.60
Another linebacker prospect that I like to see get a shot.
http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/davis%20demario81384e68ba/1.html
I like these UDFAs ...
Darren Thomas QB Oregon 6-3 215 4.58
Chigbo Anunoby DT Morehouse 6-4 324 5.?? http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/anunoby%20chigbod8f62289e6/1.html
Desmond Marrow CB Toledo 6-2 210 4.52 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/marrow%20desmond64cdd74488/1.html
Tony Dye SS UCLA 5-11 216 4.52 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/dye%20tony8385d5df1f/1.html
Broderick Binns DE/OLB Iowa 6-1 261 4.79 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/binns%20brodericke5d250d773/1.html
John Potter K Western Michigan 6-2 209
Brad Smelley FB/HB Alabama 6-3 229 4.75 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/smelley%20brad6bfe19f4a8/1.html
http://tommeltonscouting.wordpress.com/tag/brad-smelley/
James Carmon OT/DT Mississippi State 6-7 330 5.43 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/carmon%20jamesc6ba9620d9/1.html
Adrien Hamilton DE/ILB Prairie View A&M 6-2 255 4.84 http://www.fanaticalfootballfiend.com/3/category/hamilton%20adrianca1796c365/1.html
Here is what the roster would look like
QB – Ponder, Webb, Rosenfels, Thomas*
RB – Peterson, Gerhart, Todman, King, Thomas*
FB – D’Imperio, Rodriguez, Smelley*
TE – Rudolph, Carlson, Schuler*, Reisner*
WR – Harvin, Jenkins, Robinson, Jeffery, Fuller, Burton, Wylie, Arceneaux*
C – Sullivan, Fusco
G – Johnson, Berger, Zeitler, DeGeare*
T – Gaither, Loadholt, Love, Brown, Potter, Carmon*
P – Kluwe
LS – Loeffler
K – Longwell, Potter*
DE – Allen, Robison, Griffen, Ballard, Hamilton*
DT – Williams, Bunkley, Brockers, Ayodele, Hamilton, Anunoby*
OLB - Greenway, Lawson, Robinson, Davis*
MLB – Connor, Brinkley, Dean, Cole
CB – Cook, Winfield, Gilmore, Allen, Sherels, Burton, Marrow*
FS – Raymond, Taylor, Jackson
SS – Branch, Sanford, Dye*
I still have not quit my day job. :)
This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a community, that view is no less important.
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Comments
really milking this Draft RGIII thing huh?!
McCoy was a third round pick, and has had off-seasons to work with his coaches and offense.
McCoy has had his shot, and failed. Ponder has not been given the same opportunity, and should be allowed a fair shot.
If Ponder proves to be a bust then at least our next QB will have an OL to protect him after this year’s draft. RGIII would suffer behind our OL too!
by Scottish Viking on Jan 24, 2012 1:06 PM CST via mobile reply actions
I agree with that
Jimmy Clausen was a 2nd rounder as well. Plus there was a new staff in Carolina. Rivera didn’t care about who was drafted the year before.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I'm willing to give Ponder one more year
I just hope they make up their minds about Webb. Either develop the dude as the back up QB, or make him Slash. Not both.
Ponder and Frazier have one more year. If they don’t improve dramatically this year, blow it up.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
yeah,
If Ponder sucks as much as everyone says he will then we will have a shot at one of the top QB’s next year….
Although, if he is given the supporting cast, I think Ponder could develop into a pretty nice QB for us.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 24, 2012 2:04 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
That is assuming the Vikings will be picking #3 again
That is not a guarantee. Perhaps Webb will come in and lead the team to a few victories?
When you are picking #3 you cannot assume that you ever will be doing that again in the near future. So if a guy is your BPA and your philosophy is to take the BPA then you take the BPA and let the chips fall where they may.
I do not know if Ponder will suck nor do I think he will. I am worried about his injury history. That is all and it is my main concern.
I should not have included the comment in this thread because there is another thread that discusses RG3 sufficiently. No need to rehash it here.
No one knows which way it will go.
so if Trent Richardson was the BPA, would you be advocating we draft him?
by Scottish Viking on Jan 24, 2012 5:09 PM CST up reply actions
I dont think he will be eiher. but the example shows a flaw in your arguement.
For the time being, we are set at QB, there are at least 5 players (not including Luck) in the top 10 that would be an instant upgrade over our current players. RGIII is not one of them.
Kalil, Blackmon, Claiborne, Reiff and Martin would all be an upgrade which we desperately need right now.
You go BPA, unless the BPA is at a position where you are set. And currently we are set at DE, RB, C and to a lesser extent QB.
Fans would go beserk if we drafted Trent Richardson with our first round pick – regardless if he was the BPA when we are selecting.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 25, 2012 3:15 AM CST up reply actions
There is no guarantee AP is going to comeback 100%
He may not look right next year and then the Vikings have to make a decision about his future in 2013.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/All-Days-Nightmare.html
Back to Peterson, the Vikings will certainly want to keep him as part of the team and spend the resources they need to progress his rehabilitation. Thus, he will make his scheduled $8.25 million ($8 million salary, $250,000 workout bonus) for 2012.
The issue for Peterson and the Vikings is not 2012, but rather 2013, when Peterson is scheduled to make $11.25 million. What if he is still not recovered going into that season? What if he has recovered but it is clear from either his play in late 2012 and/or in minicamps in 2013 that he does not have the explosion that he had in 2011? What to do?
-————————————————————————————————
There is no guarantee he comes back 100% or if they will want to pay him that money in 2013 when he will be 28 years old and could have close to 1500 carries under his belt depending on how much he does next year. Right now he has 1406 carries. Running backs usually decline once they get past age 28.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/articles/age.htm
Now I do not think AP will decline if he comes back 100%. He can still be very effective. But it is a consideration for the team when they have to pay him 11.25 mil in 2013.
If Toby is doing adequately then they could be willing to trade AP prior to the 2013 season. I am not saying they will or am advocating it at this point in time.
The bottom line is that Trent Richardson is already #5 overall at cbsspots.com and #3 overall at nationalfootballpost.
He is definitely a top 5 pick right now and worth consideration by the Vikings. They are already looking at backs because they are unsure of AP and they need someone behind Toby. Todman and King have not done anything yet and Booker puts the ball on the ground too much.
Trent Richardson is a very good back and can already catch the ball out of the backfield very very well.
I would not be too disappointed with whomever they choose with that first pick. At #3, I think they should go BPA if they stay there no matter the position. That is my opinion and I am sticking by it.
They can address the rest of the roster after that pick.
You go BPA, unless the BPA is at a position where you are set.
I disagree, I’d rather pick positional priorities and pick the BPA to fill those needs. Straight BPA leads to imbalance, thus the Vikings current and recent rosters.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:07 PM CST up reply actions
thats my point.
and at presnt the only positions you could argue that are not a need at this time are QB, DE, C and RB.
Our biggest needs are LT, CB and WR.
It just so happens that the BPA available at 3 (or 4-6 if we were to trade down) will either be a LT, CB or WR.
Yes you could argue that RGIII could be BPA at #3, but only if Kalil is off the board – but in my opinion QB is not a position of need right now.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 26, 2012 7:19 AM CST up reply actions
The RG3 thing
And all the hating on ponder being “injury prone”(if no one knew about favre being the iron man before his 2 years with the Vikings, everyone would think he’s injury prone too AKA our line sucks) and “he won’t be elite” without a fair shake is starting to make me undervalue your opinion. I swear every post/article of yours mentions rg3.
Who knows maybe you’ll get your wish but please give it a rest, we all know your feelings on the matter. Ponder deserves a chance for a full offseason to learn, upgrades at O-line, and some legit targets to throw to.
by reebs on Jan 24, 2012 9:07 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Sorry to disappoint you but I probably will do a mock with the Vikings actually selecting RG3.
Will it be my final mock? Probably not. But he is in the top 5 of players coming out and deserves consideration.
I really do not care if you “undervalue” my opinion or not. It is an opinion only and you know what they are like.
I have not told lies about Ponder. He has been hurt in each of the last 3 years. I do not like it but it has happened. That is why I am worried. I know the line is not very good but I think he will get shots behind any line.
Comparing him to Favre is just idiotic. Favre played 18 seasons before he was injured. The line caused some of it and maybe his inability to move much caused some of it too. Maybe his age and years of playing caused some of it because of the accumulation of hits. Comparing what has happened to Ponder in college and now in the NFL to Favre is beyond ridiculous and is grasping for any excuse.
I do not need to give it a rest. This board is for any topic you like. If you do not want to converse about this topic then you have the freedom to not comment. Now it seems you are trying to control what I post.
So what subjects would be OK with you?
i'm not trying to control anything
I was meerly saying it gets old hearing the same thing from you every article that is on here…not just your own. i’ve seen you bring it up on completely unrelated subjects. the more you say it doesnt mean the more likely frazier and co. are going to do it…in case you didnt realize that.
I was not comparing favre to ponder, I was asking you a question which you dont seem to be able to ask as it was asked by someone else before this and you didnt give a real answer. this is football, people tend to get hurt when you are sacked a bunch of times and picked up and pile drived into the turf. I dont care who you are, if a big 300 pound dude land on top of you after being held up in the air there is a chance of getting hurt. That doesnt mean he is injury prone. you keep bringing up that he was injured 3 years in a row which undoubtably(to you) means he is injury prone. The question had something to do with since favre was hurt his last 2 years for us does that make him injury prone. I dont, but it seems to you that if you get injured you’re a wimp and cant be a QB. Ponder did play in every game since he came in for mcnabb.
you can mock who ever you want obviously I was just stating that I enjoyed reading your posts. Now it seems to be the same thing everytime…RGIII OMG HE’S TEH SHIT I <3 HIM11
I think you are reading too much into it and taking it personal
Favre is not injury prone. The fact that he finally succumbed to injuries after 18 years is no surprise. Playing behind the Vikings offensive line is hazardous duty for sure.
I just cannot make the leap in logic that you and the other person who made the comparison. If that is refusing to answer then so be it. I just would never put Ponder in the same sentence as Favre. Ever.
Every scouting report mentioned Ponder’s injury history as a concern. It is hard to find even one that does not. Then he gets hurt again this year. Is that injury prone? You tell me. If a player gets hurt every year what is that? It is unlucky for sure.
I never said Ponder is a wimp. This is where you are losing it and starting to make things up. I think he is tough as nails actually. A lot tougher than me. But I am not an NFL QB either.
The problem I have with many is that they have a closed mind in relation to evaluating the best players available for the Vikings at pick #3. Robert Griffin III happens to be one of them. He won the Heisman and had an outstanding season passing the ball while also running it very well too. In fact he had a few good seasons passing the ball at Baylor. He is a very good college QB. He has many of the symptoms you look for in a QB.
Will the Vikings take him? I do not know. If I had to put money on it, I would say no. But that does not mean he doesn’t deserve consideration. I probably would take him if I was in charge. I like his upside much more than Ponders. But that is just me.
I think every prospect should be discussed. If I have a favorite then that is my preference. I will probably change my opinion as we get closer to the draft.
Certainly not close minded
I would love to have that guy on my team. If we could trade ponder for a high enough pick/good enough play then I’d be all for the Vikings taking him. Watching this kid play I’m starting to think I’d rather have rg3 then luck if I were given the choice…I like me some luck.
I guess to me, I always thought of mock drafts as being what the person making the mock thinks the team/teams will pick. Being that I think there is roughly .07 % chance the Vikings pick him is where our differences lie. I know it’s all in fun but maybe my way of thinking is wrong and/or we have different visions for the future of the team.
by reebs on Jan 25, 2012 6:29 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
No worries
You make very good points.
I do not believe they will draft RG3 either. But now is the time to discuss it rationally. It is a good way to discuss the upcoming draft. Hash out all the possibilities.
That is all I am doing.
Ponder doubters
Mark, I’m sorry but your evaluation of Ponder is pretty flawed. In my opinion, Ponder looked brilliant in numerous games this season. He definitely made some mistakes, but the majority of them were as much a result of the quality of his teammates as anything. Ponder ran for his life every single game because our O-line was pathetic. When QBs are constantly under pressure, they ALL start to make worse decisions and turn the ball over. Case in point – Aaron Rodgers in the playoffs this year. As we all know, he had one of the greatest seasons ever but when he ran into the Giants defense he became ordinary.
The second problem is that our receiving core beyond Harvin was pathetic. Jenkins was decent, but he got injured halfway through the season and Ponder had very little time with him. It’s easy for guys like Brees and Rodgers to rack up yards when all of their receivers are legitimate threats. Ponder didn’t have that.
Third, Ponder didn’t have Peterson for half of the games he started. Gerhart did pretty good, but he wasn’t Peterson. As a result, the offense relied more heavily on Ponder than it should have and almost every rookie QB will struggle if they have to be the sole offensive force on the team.
Comparing Ponder to McCoy and Claussen is way off base because neither one of those guys really showed any kind of promise what-so-ever. Ponder however has consistently drawn rave reviews from both announcers and our very own Fran Tarkenton. Although he frustrated me at times this season, Ponder definitely needs another chance because he is miles better than anyone we’ve had in years (minus the one good year from Favre).
I think that you have me confused
I am not sold on Ponder because he is hurt too much for my tastes. That is just me and my opinion. I do take solace in the fact that I am not lying.
I do not recall any post where I said he was not good. I did post that I am concerned about his throws to the sidelines. I think he has a strong arm but he does not get much zip (velocity) on his passes on a consistent basis. Many confuse that with not having a strong arm. I am interested in how long the pass takes to get there.
In comparing Ponder to McCoy and Clausen, it was in relation to drafting a QB and then drafting another one the next year or in McCoys’s case two years later.
The fact of the matter is that since the new CBA does not require a huge financial commitment to the #3 pick and did not require a huge commitment to Ponder, the Vikings could select RG3 and it would not cost much money making it very doable. The Rams doing it would not be wise since they had to give Bradford so much money.
McCoy was pretty similar to Ponder his first year by the way so I think the comparison is pretty good ….
http://www.nfl.com/player/coltmccoy/497123/profile
http://www.nfl.com/player/christianponder/2495215/profile
As I said above in my post, some fans want to give Ponder every opportunity to succeed. That is cool. Some fans would not be upset if the Vikings thought RG3 was too good to pass up. That is cool too.
All we know for sure is that we do not know anything for sure.
So as Spielman said himself …
Everything is on the table.
Regarding Ponder...
He definitely made some mistakes, but the majority of them were as much a result of the quality of his teammates as anything.
He actually made a lot of “unforced errors”, as they say in tennis. Almost all of his interceptions were completely decision related, not pressure related mistakes. I have watched the film of him and noted how he simply looked down recievers, made inaccurate throws or panicked, fled the pocket without any defensive pressure, and made ill advised attempts to force a ball into total coverage.
And, comparing him to Mccoy is actually a pretty good comparison at this point. Mccoy had a very similar scouting report coming out of college and has produced similar numbers to Ponder, although Mccoy’s are a little better. The comparison to Clausen is also a very good one as his college career stats and scouting report were extremely similar to Ponder’s.
The idea tha Ponder is “miles better than anyone we’ve had in years” is really just homerism. Perhaps we haven’t drafted a qb prospect in the first round for years, and that is what you are referring to. Let him go earn his position, and prove he is worthy of that kind of praise. In the meantime, I’d rather look at the good and the bad to be realistic about him.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:05 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Ponder > Clausen
Now and then. Physically, I get the comparison. But that’s where it ends. Part of what was so attractive about Ponder at the Senior Bowl last year was his leadership ability and his intelligence. Clausen was/is a pompous punk who never took responsiblity for his shortcomings or mistakes. Clausen doesn’t have the “it” factor. Ponder does. Even though Ponder is clearly limited in terms of stature and arm strength, the kid has a winning attitude and is very underrated as an athlete. I only hope he can stay healthy long enough to develop.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
It's his instincts that worry me, those are not easily correctable.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:33 PM CST up reply actions
Instincts cannot be measured objectively
Starring down receivers and forcing throws can. And I agree with you that he did both of those on multiple occassions. That does not worry me at this point. He was a rookie with less than 11 games under his belt and no offseason. Most rookies make those types of mistakes. If he continues to make those mistakes at a high rate, then I will worry.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Revenge
Revenge, I’m not sure were you get the “homerism” that you are referring to. I didn’t say that he was the best thing I’ve ever seen – that would be homerism. I said he is significantly better than anything else we’ve had in the recent past (minus Favre). Would you rather have Tjack, rosenfels, mcnabb, brad johnson, etc? I think not.
As for his throws to the sideline, yes they were maddening but that is something that is coachable. You will see almost every rookie try to make that throw. What was frustrating is that he did it a few too many times and didn’t immediately learn from his mistakes.
I could care less if McCoy and Claussen had similar scouting reports to Ponder in college. That doesn’t mean they have the same skill level that he does. Remember how Ryan Leaf was supposed to be a can’t miss prospect? That was what his scouting report said but as we all know, that didn’t translate to the NFL. Ponder has definitely shown that he has the potential to be a legitimate starting QB, while Claussen hasn’t even gotten close to showing that. McCoy is better than Claussen, but he hasn’t shown a whole lot either even if his stats are “similar” to Ponder’s. There is a lot more to the game than stats. There is the “it” factor or the ability to lead a team. Ponder has shown he has the ability to lead a team where the other two have not shown that skill set.
he has shown that he can be a game manager in a short passing game.
I would not go so far as to say he “can lead a team”, but, he likes to “look the part” and say ther right things in pressers. I need to see a lot m ore from him to be convinced that he can make improvements on his problem areas and where his skill set seems mediocre (passing more than 10-15 yards, staring down recievers and “panic mode” fleeing away from imaginary pressure). Then I will be happy to think of him more as a possible solution, but as for now, I see him as just some rookie we are trying out and hope he can make improvements. You shouldn’t knock the comparisons, they are fair.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
I don't recall anyone pointing out the idea that Ponder will suck.
Just the fact that he was a reach pick who has not shown enough to be crowned any type of savior, and that he resembles his scouting reports pretty much to the letter.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 4:56 PM CST up reply actions
I understand your line of thinking...
But i dont see the Vikings trading down twice to end up with a DT in their first pick. We need people, i know, but we need quality. If its not Kalil, then following your first trade its gonna be one of the other top OT prospects
The DT position is in serious trouble
It is really interesting to see so many fans believing it was a good group last year. Ayodele was practically non existent, Guion is just so so after four years, and Evans is what he is. A backup who has probably reached his ceiling.
That leaves KWill and an undersized Ballard (at 286 pounds). Maybe he is a little heavier now but that is not enough.
With Guion and Evans being free agents this year, and the team not offering them new deals yet, I think that DT is a major need. The Vikings were not that good against the run last year. There were too many runs right up the middle. They need to get that position group back to being a force. I want a defensive line like the Giants.
They had Tuck, Omenyiora, Matthias Kiawnuka and still drafted Jason Pierre-Paul. They drafted Linval Joseph in the second round in 2010 and Marvin Austin in 2011 in the second round while signing Rocky Bernard and Jimmy Kennedy as free agents. Plus they had Chris Canty on the team too.
You never want to take your defensive line for granted. Same with the offensive line.
No, the Vikings need an immediate upgrade. A player to take over for KWill in a couple of years or if he gets hurt.
Brockers is a stud and is a redshirt sophomore. He is already 6-6 306 pounds an can run a 4.95 forty. I like him a lot.
I say re-sign Guion, he is actually pretty solid when given playing time.
i’d rather focus on the other positional needs first, and try to sign a stout free agent dt to sign in the meantime if possible.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:03 PM CST up reply actions
I saw Guion with his agent in Wash DC on Dec 23
I don’t know what he signed, but he was in the Hotel Lobby for at least 30 min with said agent
"never want to take defensive, offensive lines for granted"
I couldnt agree more but the O-line has been ignored for far too long and our first pick should be an O tackle. If we don’t get Kalil they should trade back once and stay in the top 10 so they can still get reiff or maybe martin.
D-line is still average against the run while good against the pass. I think they can grab someone later. Poe comes to mind and they can get him in the second. with his size could provide a big body against the run. I’d be ok with this while I’d prefer they grab the best DB available there. Maybe they could get both after trading down in the first.
by reebs on Jan 24, 2012 11:00 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Look at San Fran right now
Three of their linemen are first round picks, you can’t say that’s not helping them. Then look at their QB…
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Our DL is in the top 3 in the league
We ranked at the top of the league in sacks, 11th against the run. The second DT spot needs to be filled by a good nose tackle on first and second down then Ballard on 3rd then we are really set, isn’t Franklin from the Saints a FA this year? Id like him.
They have Guion and Evans as free agents
They have Ayodele who was a disappointment by most accounts.
So they need to do something.
KWill will turn 32 next August. How much does he have left before he declines?
I like what the Giants do. They always grab the DTs high. Grabbing them later get you a Guion or Evans.
Ayodele stinks, guion and evens were never all that good, decent backups if anything
Losing all of them does not spell doom. Kwill is at the end/past his prime,true. I still would rather see us draft a more pressing need first like CB or Oline. We could get Poe in the second that will give us what we’ve been missing since pat left. Then next year in the first I’d be all for drafting dline high to be kwills replacement. I’d rather take your boy rg3 at 3 than a DT mid to late first. When was the last time we drafted CB or OT in the first? Mckinnie? I can’t remember but that sounds about right. And I can’t remember a first round DB. It’s long overdue for an overhaul to them units.
by reebs on Jan 25, 2012 6:16 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Poe in the second is not bad
I think Brockers will be considered a top 10 pick before it is all said and done.
I agreed with your first point
And then I read your second point, and agreed with it too. Not to mention, I found your third point to be very agreeable as well. You are a wise sage.
by IL PurpleRain on Jan 30, 2012 7:08 PM CST up reply actions
I like it
But mostly because we end up with a fullback named Smelley.
Day Job?
You may not have “quit your day job,” but with as much time as that took to think and write about, you must have quit working at your day job.
How much time did you spend away from performing your job to read this post and write this comment?
Seriously dude. If you can’t add anything by way of draft discussion, move along.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
by NMVike on Jan 24, 2012 1:33 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
l like pie.
inane comments help promote a sense of inner peace.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
theres the grime we all have come to know and love
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
You are assuming I even work at my day job :)
Maybe I just show up and stare at the computer for 15 minutes every hour?
I was working on this one for about a week. I have not posted any other fanposts in that time.
The main body is done. It is the trades and the draft picks that I keep going back and forth.
Mark what do you think about going after Ladarious Webb?
What are the chances the ravens let him walk and move up your boy Jimmy Smith?
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
cool. I wasn't sure
I’ve mentioned him before as a potential FA pick up, but ya it wouldn’t be worth it.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
RE: this draft
Here’s the question I have: Is Brockers that much better than the next tier of DT’s in this draft? Because if he’s not, then I would wait until the 2nd round to address DT. If you stayed at #6, you could have had Reiff or Martin. Surely they are both head and shoulders above Potter…
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
100% agree.
Regardless of how you feel about our QB position we will never succeed without a good OL and this draft position is a great place to start, whether Kalil falls to us at #3 or we trade down and pick up Reiff or Martin.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 24, 2012 1:43 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
The reason he is not taking a LT in this draft is because
of the Gaither signing. He would be out LT for a few years
Ya, I'm not sold on Gaither as a bookend LT
I’d take Martin or Reiff over him.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
and that maybe true
but in this mock, we signed Gaither, who has completely dominated since joining the Chargers. So it would make more sense to take another prospect and an LT in a couple years, while developing Potter.
Yes Gaither played extremely well the last 5 weeks in San Diego
I like signing him and sliding Johnson inside or as a backup in case they keep Hutchinson for his final year.
Gaither had 28 starts (or so) in Baltimore before he hurt his back.
He is fine now and only 25.
Picking up Potter is good in that it allows him to bulk up a little and just get naturally stronger as he gets older and as he practices against the defense on the scout team. He may have to play right tackle if Loadholt does not improve.
You think the Chargers will let him go?
I mean you have a point, he did do well and the end of the season, and a good LT is hard to find, just ask the Ravens Oher didn’t quite pan out the way they thought….
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
He is going to be a free agent
I do not understand the “let him go”.
What letting go are they doing? If they have not offered him a new deal then it is likely they will not. Just like the Vikings with Guion, Erin H, etc.
Maybe they will but it seems unlikely.
How would you even know if they have or have not offered him a deal
or are not in negotiations with him for any type of deal? you don’t.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 7:00 PM CST up reply actions
Usually you read something about talks
There is nothing on Gaither. With Marcus McNeil expected back next year and set to make 10.5 mil it seem highly unlikely they will offer him an attractive deal …
10/11/2010: Signed a six-year, $48.98 million contract. The deal contains $24.5 million guaranteed, including a $1.791 million signing bonus, McNeill’s first-, second-, and third-year salaries, and $1.75 million of his 2013 salary. 2011: $10 million, 2012: $10.5 million, 2013: $7.75 million, 2014: $8.75 million, 2015: $9.75 million, 2016: Free Agent
… but you never know. They could be in very super secret talks right now that even the local San Diego reporters have no clue about.
I do realize they could offer him a deal right before the league year ends and free agency starts. It all depends if they want him to play right tackle because they are not moving McNeil to right tackle.
Gaither did not like being moved to the right side in Baltimore when they drafted Oher. Turns out he was right as Oher is playing right tackle for Baltimore. I think he wants to play left tackle and he wants to start and get close to starters money. I could be wrong though.
But there is no “letting him go”. That statement means diddly. They can offer him a new deal and then he can accept it if he wants. How that is deemed “letting him go” is a mystery to me.
Same thing happened here with Rice. Many posters said the Vikings would not let him go (not saying you). But he went anyway.
I look at the fact that the team has not offered a player a new deal and equate that to the player most likely hitting free agency. Erin H, Guion, Evans, and other Vikings fit in this description IMO.
I forgot about McNeil coming back actually.
and the let him go mentality comes from a player being on a team and ‘usually’ looking to them first for a rehire, even if they do let him test the free market. If the Chargers believe McNeil is recovered and if good form then Gaither could be looking at a pretty serious pay day next year. Personally I’d be happy to see him here, hell I was on board with it when he was moved to the right side in Baltimore.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Maybe theyre happy with how Gaither played
And they cut McNeil? Neck injuries are nothing to take lightly.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I do realize they could offer him a deal right before the league year ends and free agency starts.
The free agency signing period does not start until March 13. They can’t do anything right now, but are probably evaluating all of their options. The fact that the chargers didn’t extend him before the end of the season says alot, they need offensive linemen, and they have left him dangling for the meantime.
Since Gaither has been released by 2 different teams in the last year, and has had a couple of major injuries in the last few years, and has a documented “attitude problem”, I am a bit leary of this guy. I highly doubt that he is the type of player I would want to include in a re-build process.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:17 PM CST up reply actions
Not true
The Chargers can sign their own players now if they want. That is why the Saints are negotiating with Brees right now. If they do not get it done by the time free agency starts, they will have to franchise tag Brees. Then they cannot use it on Nicks or Colston if they wanted.
That is why the Vikings tried to sign Greenway right before the lockout.
A team can sign it’s own players at any point in time until the league year ends. When the league year ends the player becomes a free agent at that point. Not before.
I think Gaither is really good and does not have an “attitude” problem. I really do not know what we down in Baltimore but he had started 26 games for them and graded out very well during that time. Then they draft Oher and want to put him at left tackle right away. That would probably cause anyone to be pissed.
He was released because the Raiders and Chiefs did not want to make sure he was 100%. In the last 5 games for San Diego he proved he was 100%.
I would be very happy to have him start. Meanwhile I would be grooming someone to take over or if something happened.
Kalil and Gaither
Suddenly we are set at tackle forever.
Hey one can dream!
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
The Raiders never released Gaither cuz they never signed him.
And the fact remains that Gaither was still released by 2 teams in one year. His attitude problem is well documented, his own college coach even came out and said so in the media after Gaither FAILED TO MAKE HIS GRADES IN COLLEGE. For a football player at a major university to flunk out of his classes is a complete joke. How can a guy flunk a curriciculum which includes “The History of Gym Class” and “My Tutor is Taking My Test for Me”? (I kid, of course. It might have been “Intro to Recreation” and “Advanced Weightlifting”).
He also played in 10 of 11 games for Kansas City last year, unable to break the starting lineup because he apparently couldn’t pick up on his assignments. His San Diego tenure was only a few games.
The guy also has serious medical issues. I don’t doubt that San Diego is considering their options, but I am not surprised that they haven’t signed him to anything. His foot injury apparently caused his first referenced back injury, which was the reason he lost a sunstantial amount of weight prior to the 2010 season. It is ironic that he didn’t even bother to tell the team of his medical condition and took it upon himself to lose weight in order to take pressure off of what was reported as a degenerative condition in his back that is caused by an apparent collapsed arch in his foot. The funnier part is that this happened simultaneously with Sidney Rice’s decietful approach to dealing with the Vikings by covering up the fact that he had HIP ARTHRITIS…..the funny part being that they both have the same douchebag agent.
I want to steer clear of this guy, but if they do take a chance on him, I hope it comes with a caveat, that he is a stop gap that doesn’t get paid very much. I don’t want a McKinnie/Herrera hybrid, and the mediocrity that comes with it.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
oof-da...lots of typos, der don'cha know.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
hrm didn't know all of that.
Thanks for the info R4W.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Gaither does not excite me at all. He has had several injuries and was let go for a reason.
He may have filled in for a few games, but I seriously doubt his ability to laast a whole season. His foot injury alone is said to have him fending off permanent degeneration. I’d rather get guys who are solid both talent wise and health wise. I am tired of screwing around with bargain bin free agents and draft picks.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:06 PM CST up reply actions
Yes I understand that
But even Mark put in a plan B. If Gaither isn’t signed, then he would draft Mike Adams, OT Ohio St. So the question still pertains. Is it worth trading down and ending up with Mike Adams when we could have had Martin/Reiff?
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
It depends on how much you like Brockers.
But all 3 could be gone by 17. I just want the picks in the first two rounds.
I can live with an Adams or Zebrie Sanders.
I think that there could be surprises with the tackles. Maybe Martin drops?
Have you studied the average time for a DT to make an impact?
Suh stands out as an immediate impact player. JJWatt was terrific. Kevin Williams was solid from day one, even though they played him at End occasionally early on. Brockers scares me a little because of how young he is. The talent is there, no doubt.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I would take him in a heartbeat.
In theory he would not have to play many downs. Next year he can play more downs. Two years from now he can take over for KWill.
Who knows though? He could do pretty well right off the bat.
Why is brockers' size ok but Ballard is too small?
Brockers is 6’6" and 255 according to yahoo which seems more suited for a LB or end spot. It seems to me that he would have challenges in the run game. As size goes I would think Ballard would be better suited for our DT spot comparatively.
What’s your thought on Poe? Our run D hasn’t been as good since phat pat left. Memphis’ website has him at 6’5" and 350. He’s projected as a NT in a 3-4 but I’m thinking he could be a decent guy to line up next to Kevin.
by reebs on Jan 24, 2012 11:41 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
From what I heard when Phat Pat left
It seemed like the defense was looking for a smaller more agile player to take his place. Maybe they are rethinking that with the new D Line coach, I’m not sure.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Must have put on weight since that page was put on the net
I tried to find it again and couldn’t. Anyway I found his recent weight and confirmed what you said.
To the post above… I hope they change their minds. With pat in the middle it was pretty much impossible to run up the middle taking away a whole demention of opposing offenses.
by reebs on Jan 25, 2012 6:43 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Agreed
Would not put your LT hopes on one signing. I’d grab Reiff or Martin too !
by BleedPurple60 on Jan 24, 2012 1:55 PM CST up reply actions
I don't mind picking more than one top rated o-lineman at one time.
That way we might actually build a unit that can hold together for a while. The group we have now is just a patchwork of mediocrity. I hate to say it, but if Sullivan is considered our top lineman, then we are in trouble.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:09 PM CST up reply actions
Worst comes to worst we have martin on the right and Gaither on the left with Loadholt in back up
Then if Gaither can’t keep healthy we just slide him out Martin to the left and hope Loadholt takes to heart that you have to excel in the NFL to keep playing.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
I'm just....not....buying....it.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:18 PM CST up reply actions
Buying what?
That Gaither is a left tackle? That Martin (projected as a left tackle) couldn’t play better than Loadholt at RT? Or that Loadholt would make one of the better back up linemen in the league?
Now if you’re not buying us actually picking up Gaither then yeah I can see that, would be nice, but I don’t think it’s going to happen. We’ve passed on him to many times already. :p
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Not buying that Gaither is worth the risk/trouble.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
Too many picks and we still don't have a QB
Vikes have 10 picks the way it is and with salary floor looming in 2013 they shouldn’t draft rookies if they have no way to retain them anyways. If they move down in some places then I think they have to move up in others.
Ponder is not a proven elite prospect. Nothing he did is any different than what TJack did in his first season. I’m not trying to hate on him but that is the honest truth. He put up mediocre passing statistics, couldn’t stay in games, and made his fair share of horrendous throws while showing very little in downfield effectiveness and looked uncomfortable in the pocket. I’m not saying he has no chance but the Vikings are foolish to hitch their wagons to him this early based on what he’s shown.
If they are sitting with the #3 pick then they need to maximize the value of that pick. They need to ignore the fact that they have a mediocre QB prospect that they reached for in the previous draft. If maximizing value means moving down with a team to load on other picks then so be it. But if nobody is offering good value for them to move down then they need to take RGIII and roll with him. Simply selecting Blackmon would be ungodly stupid if Kalil and Luck are gone and nobody wants to give great package for the Vikes to move down.
I mean the pro day results could color everyone’s opinion but I think most actual scouts see RGIII as the second best player in the draft.
Actually
“most actual scouts” all have Kalil at #2, with no one else in the class of Luck or Kalil. Griffin is the #2 prospect becuase 3 QBs that were rated higher them him all elected to return to college. It just speaks to how bad the QB class is in this draft
I think only Barkley would be rated higher if he entered the Draft
Hell, some people are saying that RG3 is better than Luck ( I dont think so).
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
One Year Wonders
Too many times you see a player kill it in a season and then not pan out. Luck has been progressing every year, trust Luck more than I would Griffin.
by BleedPurple60 on Jan 24, 2012 2:12 PM CST up reply actions
RG3 is not a one year wonder
See my response to Scottish Viking below. He actually played 3+ years at Baylor.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Robet Griffin is not a one year wonder. Each of his 3 years as a starter are better
than any of Ponder’s years as a starter in college. He is far superior of a prospect coming out of college than Ponder was. I’m not saying we should take him, but he is a pretty nice qb prospect.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:11 PM CST up reply actions
You guys are completely nutzo.
Ponder played in the ACC, they didn’t even have a top 20 team, again.
Griffin played in the Big 12, they had 6…yes SIX teams in the top 20 this year.
Luck played in the PAC 12 and played 4, yes FOUR top 10 teams this year.
To try to minimize Griffin’s accomplishments in order to coddle Ponder and create some form of false glorification of him is nonesense. Griffin is a great prospect coming out of college, he probebly would have been the top qb picked in last year’s draft based on what he has done through this year.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:25 PM CST up reply actions
I think we agree??
I’m just commenting on all the hype that is given to any player. Yea they we big fish in a lake but the NFL is a salt water ocean.
I don’t care about what these superstars did against average joe’s in college. We have to find out what they can do against other superstars. Many college superstars have come to the NFL and become busts no one is above reproach. Everyone should earn their jobs.
Draft lines and picks are based on more than just the skill of the player. Honestly do we believe that if Kalil or Claiborne had the same level of skills that they have right now, but were in last years draft they would still be in the top 3 or 5 spots. I doubt it. Luck was presumably head and shoulders better than all the QBs in last years draft so the hype stayed with him.
I’m not saying he isn’t good just that if the 5 teams that need a QB right now had somehow got the crop of players they currently have to work. Luck would not be getting drafted at #1.
by midnightwonder on Jan 25, 2012 5:28 PM CST up reply actions
everybody overlooks...
…attitude, both from the player and the team.
Dalton was given a chance to excel, and he went into it with a motivated attitude. the Bengals believed in him, and that goes a long way in cultivating a rookie QB. (it doesn’t hurt that he had AJ Green.)
another example is if a player attaches himself to an offense, or that offense is a tight ‘match’ for the QB. see: Brady, Tom.
if RG3 steps in with a similar attitude, in a system that best suits his abilities, then he has the best chance to succeed.
"Th_r_'s n_ h_p_ f_r _ssh_l_ f_ckw_ts."
Can I buy a vowel...?? +1, Kluwe.
Thats one reason why i think Ponder will progress next season
He’s the man now – he’s going into the offseason knowing its his to job to lose, he knows that the offense is going to be tailored to fit his skill set and that his team are going to be looking to get him some weapons.
I love Ponder’s attitude, he is a winner – and is as dedicated as they come. I’m looking forward to seeing what kind of plays Musgrave is going to call when he has complete trust in his QB.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 27, 2012 8:53 AM CST up reply actions
"in 2013 they shouldn’t draft rookies"
Should they draft veterans? I know what you mean, but that was too good to pass up.
i dont think you can hitch your wagon to a QB with 1 season of spread offense to go on
And I know you will point out Newton but I actually think that he won’t be an elite QB either and wouldn’t have selected him first either.
I’m not ready to crown Ponder as our QB for the next 10 years, but I’m sure as hell not ready to ditch him after 10 games either!
Nope this is the time to improve our woeful OL, pick up a top WR FA, get a NT or CB in round 2 and provide the kid with the opportunity to.show what he can do on a team with some talent around him!
Like I’ve said before, if Ponder plays like he has this year after we have a No1 receiver and a good OL then we can talk about him not being up to the task, but I doubt RGIII would have fared any better on our team this year.
Would he have the time to use that cannon arm? Would anyone be open down field if he did? Sorry but even an elite QB would have put up pedestrian numbers for the 2011 Vikings.
by Scottish Viking on Jan 24, 2012 1:58 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 3 recs
I agree with almost every word
But RG3 was not a one year wonder. He actually played 4 years at Baylor. He was granted a medical redshirt his sophmore year (torn ACL in 3rd game of the season). He was conference freshman of the year in the Big 12. But he played 12 games as a Frosh, 3 as a soph, and played full seasons in 2010 and 2011.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
True
He did progess in a depleted Big 12, I hope and I mean it hope he does well.
by BleedPurple60 on Jan 24, 2012 2:16 PM CST up reply actions
He progressed with very, and I mean VERY
Little talent around him. This year Wright emerged. But other than him, not much.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Again agreed
You are definately correct, Baylor never does have alot of depth. Hope your right he will be fun to watch
by BleedPurple60 on Jan 24, 2012 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not advocating that the Vikes draft him
Or even that he will be a better QB than Luck. I think Luck is the best QB in the draft. But all I am saying is that it is a misconception that RG3 was a one hit wonder. He played very well for 3+ years.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Scottish said...
i dont think you can hitch your wagon to a QB with 1 season …
That part of your statement speaks to the idea that we should not hitch our wagon to a kid who had mediocre success in a second tier college conference and has the upside of a Mark Sanchez, Colt Mccoy, or Chad Pennington.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:13 PM CST up reply actions
Chad Pennington was pretty good.
Just injured a lot.
☠★☪Creator of http:/vikescity.info/ and dedicated DN reader.
by UnBannedVikingholic on Jan 24, 2012 10:50 PM CST up reply actions
Something we could very well be saying
In a few years about Ponder.
by VikesFanInTulsa on Jan 26, 2012 10:43 AM CST up reply actions
It's obvious you put a lot of time into this, but how do we possibly pass on Blackmon at 3
I know we need help all over the place, but no way u pass on elite players over depth guys or even possibly good guys like Brockers at 17….i.e. 2007 Lions draft Megatron over Joe Thomas, both guys ended up as great picks, but Megatron strikes fear into defenses like no other. AP at 6 was elite and we’re lucky he fell to us, this is what we need and we can address the depth later. It’s Kalil if he’s there or Blackmon to me. We need studs dammit. But overall great job with the post.
Blackmon is no Megatron
I like Dwight Jones or Alshon Jeffery just as much as I do Blackmon. I know Blackmon is good but I do not believe he is that good. I saw Leonard Johnson do a pretty good job on him when they played Iowa State. In the NFL he is going to face much better DBs than he faced in college.
He also does not have elite speed so comparing him to Megatron is a bad example. Very bad.
Blackmon played in a hurry up offense and finished with 121 catches for 1522 yards and 18 TDs. Not bad at all and nothing to sneeze at.
But a player like Robert Woods played in a traditional offense and caught 111 passes for 1292 yards and 15 TDs. USC did not run a fast break offense. They did not run as many plays as Oklahoma State (987 to 839). Woods is mush faster too.
I could live with a Michael Floyd who caught 100 passes for 1147 yards and 9 TDs who also did not play in a hurry up offense.
I think Blackmon is overrated a bit and I would not select him at #3.
If I stayed put then I would take Morris Claiborne. I could take Mohammed Sanu in the 2nd round too.
Claiborne works for me as well, dude is a stud, that's my point, get ELITE players. Add depth later.
I will be anxiously awaiting Claibornes Weigh in at the Combine
If he is legit 6’0" then I will feel a lot better about taking him #3. If not, I will wait for Casey Hayward in the 2nd.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I'd rather take Hayward anyway.
He had more tackles, passes defended, and interceptions in the last two years.
Very true
But I wonder how much of that was because Claiborne wasn’t thrown at as much. Bama clearly stayed away from his half of the field and attacked the Honey Badger with success.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I stand by my question
Who has LSU faced? What top QB or WRs have they faced in the last two years?
I mean NFL draft worthy QBs? It is a big difference trying to guard Kendall Wright with RG3 zipping him the ball as opposed to some of the SEC players the past two years. Not all but the majority.
I will take Hayward off of production.
who's to say Griffen's stats would have been as good if he had to play against Claiborne?
by Scottish Viking on Jan 25, 2012 3:20 AM CST up reply actions
All I know is what they did do
RG3 did very well and won the Heisman.
Claiborne did well at LSU but faced not may top offenses.
RG3 did not face many top defenses.
But maybe those defenses were not good because they were facing top offenses. The BIG 12 was pretty good this past year. Landry Jones, Ryan Tannehill, RG3, Brandon Weeden, Seth Doege, and Collin Klein were all pretty good QBs.
I did not see LSU facing these kinds of QBs or offenses. Maybe they could have shut them down. Maybe not? We will never know because the SEC offenses were horrible this year and the draft prospects coming out this year confirm this to be true.
Maybe next year the SEC can produce some decent QBs or WRs. I think they will have some WRs but Claiborne will be gone.
Same thing could be said for Luck
just because his name has been thrown around for the past couple of years. Who really has Stanford played against.
by midnightwonder on Jan 25, 2012 10:18 AM CST up reply actions
Luck played against 4 top 10 teams this year.
And they play in a conference that is far better than the ACC.
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 25, 2012 3:27 PM CST up reply actions
True but...
the defenses in that conference is no way near as good as SEC’s. I’m not comparing Luck to Ponder or Ponder to RG3 just stating that comparing any of them head to head is very hard because of the different conferences.
by midnightwonder on Jan 25, 2012 5:32 PM CST up reply actions
Robert Woods had a much better QB throwing to him and a great #2 WR who took the pressure off him. Oklahoma State’s receiving corp is Blackmon followed by a huge drop off.
That said, I agree. If Kalil is gone and we want to stay at #3, I’d go with Claiborne.
Then next year, once everyone realizes how bad Ponder is, maybe we can draft Barkley.
Come on. Weeden was pretty good.
And they had a pretty good line at OSU too.
He had more opportunities to make catches is all I am saying.
His 40 time needs to be around 4.45 for me to pick him 3rd.
IDK about you, but
I think this whole stadium issue will have an impact on the players and coaches. With a frustrated Owner, frustration could slide off to other people in the organization. I hope I’m wrong.
☠★☪Creator of http:/vikescity.info/ and dedicated DN reader.
by UnBannedVikingholic on Jan 24, 2012 4:52 PM CST reply actions
The stadium issue just got pushed off for another year (is my interpretation of Dayton's latest)...
You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him
by REVENGE4WEBB on Jan 24, 2012 5:15 PM CST up reply actions
In what regards?
Do you think that the team will not be proactive in free agency because of the stadium?
Maybe they will not be as active going after the top free agents but the bottom line is they have to spend 89% of the cap in 2013. They need some contracts on the books that will cover a lot of that this year. Next year’s free agent class will not be as deep because many of the free agents signed one year deals this past off season.
The team has no choice but to spend money. Plus they have 18 free agents of their own and probably 10 draft picks.
They are going to have to sign some players.
I was meaning in terms of
performance because of the distraction and schisms.
☠★☪Creator of http:/vikescity.info/ and dedicated DN reader.
by UnBannedVikingholic on Jan 24, 2012 8:19 PM CST up reply actions
Well I could see Free Agents not being to excited abotu coming to Minnesota if the team might be moving
Why go to some place which might make you move, and could very well change pretty much everything next year (coaches, owners, venue…)
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Money wins
and it looks like the Vikes should have a bit of it this year to spend. Get a big name and people will feel much better about coming here. Vincent Jackson would make Ponder a much more credible threat.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Credible threat?
I am just hoping for a completion percentage closer to 60% than 50%.
And of course, starting and completing most of the games.
woah there man
Let’s start off with baby steps. How about we give the kid a pocket first :D
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
I'd like to see us trade down with Wash like you suggested
Pick Reilly or Claiborne then trade back into the first to pick up Barron if he is still there at 23 later.
Claiborne will not get past the Bucs at 5
And I would not trade back into round one for Barron. If he’s there at 35 I’d think about it, but I wouldn’t trade up for him. There will be good value in the 2nd for a safety. Markelle Martin for example.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Im Kinda high on Barron
He was pretty much the key to the Bama D and exactly what were looking for, solid tackler and good ball skills much more likely to hit with him for me. I agree Claiborne will probably be gone but who knows what will happen, i’m very happy with picking up Relly and Barron and then addressing Corner, Wr and DT in the later rounds and FA. I agree with Mark that Dan Conner is perfect for us to bring in at MLB very underrated.
I like Barron too
But the early reports are that he might be stiff in the hips and a little slow to be effective in the pass game. Combine is around the corner…
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I like most of the moves but...
I think moving back that much takes away the prospect of getting an impact player from the draft this yr and that is what we need, not necessarily a playmaker but a guy who can start from day 1 and do his job or more, that is why I say no matter what get the best Left tackle we can get.
In free agency I’d rather they go for Nicks in a deal like they went after Hutch all those yrs back and have a proven beast on the line for yrs to come just like when we got Hutch, I would also like them to add another vet or two to the O-line. I’m not too high on Conner either, I’d wait for a late season cut or vet that’s more proven, then I’d make a more bold move and trade a later pick for a guy like Taylor Mays, I think he could move to MLB in the Cover Two and be a beast there like what the Bears did with Urlacher out of Arizona, if nothing else he’d give us a guy w some potential who could help fill a couple need areas.
The two secondary moves I like, i also like Michael Griffin, Carr, and Carlos Rogers as guys to target. as for d-line I’d rather get a bigger stop gap type than Bunkley and groom Ballard to take over for K-Will.
Brian Urlacher, University of New Mexico
By way of Lovington, New Mexico. Not Arizona. Please don’t compare Mays to Urlacher. Urlacher was drafted number #9 overall to play linebacker, not safety. The only conversion that took place was when they originally wanted him to OLB. Brian Urlacher was 6’4" 250 lbs coming out of college. He benched 225lbs 27 times and ran a 4.57 forty at the combine. He didn’t need to grow into the position.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I didn't really compare them
I referenced Urlacher as an example where moving a big athletic safety to a mike lb worked to the highest degree. I surely doubt Urlacher had 4.3 speed so acting like he’s a way better athlete is ridiculous, mays is 6’3" 230 and I’m sure his strength isn’t far from a cover 2 type lb right now, he’s def bigger than Ernie Sims. But thanks for being a dick and not just correcting me on his school, I obviously was going from the top of my head and was pretty close IMO.
by SpanFan on Jan 25, 2012 8:50 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Urlacher is a way better FOOTBALL PLAYER
That’s all that really matters. Why is Taylor Mays even brought up? Isn’t he on somebody’s practice squad?
So you weren’t just being corrected about Urlacher’s school. You were being corrected in thinking that Mays should even be mentioned in the same sentence as Urlacher. Besides, It’s a myth that Urlacher was a pure safety in college. He played nearly every position on the Lobo defense, a few on offense and even returned punts.
If it were the year 1846, then ya you would have been close. But since 1912, Arizona and New Mexico have been 2 different states.
Oh and youre welcome for the football and history lessons.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
Sorry, I didn't know you had a love affair w Urlacher
And I sincerely doubt you have more history knowledge than I do or are as educated as I am, since you seem to want to force a pissing match… The point wasn’t Mays, it was that they need to be creative and find some lb’s that are better suited to cover two, I love EJ but at this point in his career he has no business covering the middle in our scheme. It looks like Speelman had the same type of idea and signed this Solomon guy, I’m just looking for some creativity and maybe some intuition from the front office to find some hidden gems who fit the puzzle here.
by SpanFan on Jan 26, 2012 8:46 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Not trying to force a pissing match
Nor did I intend to come off as a jerk. I just happen to be proud to have played on some of the same high school football fields as Brian.
With your “level of education,” I would assume that you knew that all intelligent discussions end once the first insult is is cast; or at least know that NM and AZ are two different states. Even if they are neighboring states that were once part of the same territory, by defending yourself which such braggadocio only exposes your ignorance and places your knowledge of history and level of education in serious doubt.
In any case, I have heard this comparison, logic, or whatever you want to call it before and it is flawed. Brian Urlacher is an exceptional football player. Taylor Mays is not. Brian Urlacher played linebacker (among various other positions previously stated) in college. Taylor Mays did not. About the only thing they have in common is that they are both freakishly athletic for their size. But that does not mean that because one excelled in the NFL when he was “moved” to MLB that the same will be true for the other.
While we do agree that the middle linebacker position for the Minnesota Vikgins needs to be upgraded, Taylor Mays is not the answer. That is my point.
"At this point, what we got to lose, right? So we might as well throw caution to the wind and hit people in the face."
--Vikings DE Jared Allen
I should not included the comment about Ponder
This thread is being hijacked with the Ponder backers debating the RG3 backers (if you will).
There is already a thread that has covered everything about the subject.
My mistake to those that would just want to talk about the picks or the trades.
What I am interested in is what picks would others make if they did all the trades.
That is where it becomes interesting and educational for me. Finding out what players others like and in what rounds they would take them.
Different draft ideas, to go along with all your trades.
17. same as you
21. Dont’a Hightower ILB Alabama or Luke Kuechely ILB BC whichever one is there
35. Stephen Gilmore if available, if not Janoris Jenkins/Chase Minnifield
51. Same
67. Markelle Martine FS Ok St. U, I think we need a starting quality FS versus a project LT here
comp. Same
98. Same.
99. Andrew Datko, OT FSU. I think here is a better time to take a project Tackle, if fully healthy he will be the heir apparent to Loadholdt at RT, possible able to shift to LT.
121. (trade 130 and 193) Brandon Brooks OG Miami Oh. Lots of potential and good value, he can sit behind Hutch for the year if we keep him and start at RT next year when we move Zeiter over to LT.
145. Same
194. Same
206. Same
219. Same
Interesting
I thought about Hightower but I am concerned about his coverage abilities at his size. If we were switching to a 3-4 defense then he would be an excellent inside LB. Imagine him and Griffen playing as the ILBs in a 3-4 defense?
I could see waiting to get a project left tackle but I think most will be gone by the end of the third round. Remember that jah Reid went at the end of the third round last year. He was the 9th OT taken (10th if you count Ijalana as a OT) last year. The longer you wait, the more of a project it will be. How much of a project would you want?
I do not think they take two guards but I like your picks obviously. I recall reading Spielman talking up Brandon Fusco. I think Fusco is going to get every opportunity to get that job. I suppose if they let Hutchinson go then two guards would be good.
That would make for a solid 3-4 LB core, but it looks like for at least the next couple years we will be in the 4-3 still
I was thinking a LB core of Greenway, Hightower, Lawson, would make a huge leap in talent for our LB core.
I think Datko could slip due to injuries, also picks 98-99 are at the very beginning of the 4th round, he could still be available. I think he is the 10th rated OT now.
I do not think they will take 2 OGs either but THEY SHOULD. We need a starting RG now and will need a replacement for Hutch next season at the latest, I think Fusco had plenty of opp for playing time this year and could not get in, so we should at least give him some competition (i.e. Brooks)
You Missed a Critical Pick
One that needs to happen BEFORE the draft.
I think the Vikings should dump Speilman, and hire you, Mark :)
I don’t know if the Vikings can swing 3 trade-downs like that, but damnit, I like the thinking that dares to try to get it. Maybe the Vikings can hire a ball-hawk to hunt through Ms. Spielman’s testicular lockbox and see if they can find Spielman’s ’nads in time for FA and the draft.
I also like your FA picks, and those are so critical to the equation. You didn’t over-reach with pie-in-the-sky notions like grabbing Manning or Colston, and kept it with reasonable and fiscal bounds.
Passing on Blackmon is right on. Maybe some other year, but right now, the Vikings have bigger needs in the O-line, Secondary, and D-line. Looking at the points spreads, if the Vikings could have stopped just 1 TD on the other side, in each game, the record improves from 3-16 to 12-4. I’m looking at Claiborne if there’s no trade-down.
If the Vikings could pull this off, I’d be damned excited. I just don’t know if Spielman is up to it, his past record doesn’t give me reason to think so.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Thanks but it is easy to do this on the internet
When you are in the actual war room and the clock is ticking and you have to make decisions it is a whole nother story. I give Spielman and company a lot of credit. Drafting for an NFL team in 15 minutes time is tough.
You could have your plan all laid out and then a team trades up in front of you and grabs the player you wanted. Then you have to decide which other player you had rated that high is worth the pick and if that position may be thinning out in the draft.
Let’s say you wanted a DT and someone snagged him before your pick. So now you think grab a CB but feel you can get one a round later and should take a WR now because there may not be any later.
That is a tough job and the clock is ticking, teams are calling to talk about trades or to distract you (perhaps), and you have your coaches and scouts all in your ear too.
Running the actual draft is a tough job because the picks are final and your job is on the line. I wanted to get Taylor Mays and Brandon Ghee and neither one is doing too well. Those may have been considered bad moves on my part. Of course I wanted Nate Solder and Stephen Paea last year too. Although I probably would have taken Mallett in the second round last year after selecting Solder in the first.
I would love to sit in the draft room just to see it in action. I do not know if I could do it as well as Spielman or any other GM for that matter.
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