Is Spielman Ready to Wheel & Deal?
by SFViking on Jan 26, 2012 6:36 PM CST
Email
Print
Rick Spielman was on the NFL Network yesterday and let it be known that he was very open to trading down. This appears to somewhat weaken the Rams ability to force the Redskins or Dolphins into giving up too much to jump ahead of the Browns.
If it's true, it looks like Spielman could possibly even pass on Kalil for the appropriate "Godfather" deal, especially if he can trade down within the top 10.
Also, Mike Mayock is not as impressed with Kalil as the rest of the free world. He has Riley Reiff ranked as the #1 offensive lineman.
This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a community, that view is no less important.
51 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Hutch
will either be a Viking next year, or he will be retired, there won’t be room for any trades in between.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Jan 26, 2012 9:12 PM CST up reply actions
agree...
or cut, depending on the cap hit.
Hutch has a no trade clause in his contract
and who would want him at 7 mil per year, in the last year of his deal, and going to turn 35 in November?
The answer is no one.
I don't know, they did just give up a 1st and 2nd for Carson Palmer
U know they got a new coach and new GM but Al Davis son kind of seems like an idiot
yeah
We are the dumb things crew of the NFL as of late.
\m/
by Edgecrusher71 on Jan 27, 2012 1:23 PM CST up reply actions
I like Speilman's move
It now makes St Louis decide if their going to trade with Cleveland or whoever, or draft Kalil and leave us the luxury of extra picks that they want/need themselves. I think it kind of forces them to trade with Cleveland and that leaves us Kalil.
ha... maybe people will actually entertain Reiff as an option now
Mike Mayock is not as impressed with Kalil as the rest of the free world. He has Riley Reiff ranked as the #1 offensive lineman.
i’m sure eventually Kalil will take the #1 spot in Mayock’s rankings — but i expect a lot of people who were ‘down’ on Reiff will have a convenient change of opinion very soon.
as for Spielman, i’m glad he’s out there saying this. the options are being left open, and there’s a lot of time to analyze our options. better to be completely prepared when we will ultimately only have 10min to pull the trigger.
"Th_r_'s n_ h_p_ f_r _ssh_l_ f_ckw_ts."
Can I buy a vowel...?? +1, Kluwe.
I have Reiff as the #2 OT
That is probably where he will stay for me, but in my opinion he is at least as good as martin
This comment goes along with his other comment that everything is on the table
The Vikings should explore every possible option and player. And they will.
Thus they have to consider RG3 and Trent Richardson at the #3 pick. They were already looking at backs at the Senior Bowl.
AP is no guarantee to come back 100%.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/All-Days-Nightmare.html
Back to Peterson, the Vikings will certainly want to keep him as part of the team and spend the resources they need to progress his rehabilitation. Thus, he will make his scheduled $8.25 million ($8 million salary, $250,000 workout bonus) for 2012.
The issue for Peterson and the Vikings is not 2012, but rather 2013, when Peterson is scheduled to make $11.25 million. What if he is still not recovered going into that season? What if he has recovered but it is clear from either his play in late 2012 and/or in minicamps in 2013 that he does not have the explosion that he had in 2011? What to do?
-—————————————————————————————————————————-
The Vikings could very well take Trent Richardson. He can back up Gerhart and AP. AP will probably start the year off on the PUP list anyway. He would if I was running the team. Then before 2013 the Vikings would have to make a decision with AP going to be 28 going in to the 2013 season and having close to 1500 carries.
Now do I think they will draft TRich. No I do not. Would I. No I would not.
But it has to be considered seriously. That 11.25 mil is no joke in 2013. If they had TRich and Toby they would be looking pretty good at the RB position.
I think the trade down option is probably the best way to go no matter who is there. Even Kalil. I do not know who is better between Kalil, Reiff, or Martin. I do know that Kalil is ranked a little higher on the majority of boards right now. If the Vikings got one of the three then they would be in decent shape on paper.
Do you think Gerhart has earned a chance to be the full time back?
I think he has shown the ability to be just as productive overall as AD last year. His YPC was actually higher I think. He may not be as flashy but he moves the chains and if they need to change it up, just throw Percy back there. I think we have too many other needs right now to take what in reality could be a 3rd running back on the depth chart?
Toby deserves to get carries
but if AP comes back 100% then he will not get them and nor should he. Not many backs deserve to carry the ball more than AP.
I think Toby is a back that gets better as the game goes along because of his size and running style. I could be wrong but that is my initial impression. Thus I think he needs to get close to 20 carries a game.
Richardson is really good. He can already catch the ball out of the backfield and looks to be a good blocker too. He is in the discussion for the number 3 pick IMO.
The Vikings need to get the BPA period. If that is Richardson then so be it.
Toby had a knee issue too. If he goes down next year and AP is not back yet, then what?
All of a sudden it becomes a need.
If Ponder goes down then they have Webb and Sage maybe. That is why RG3 should be in the discussion.
They should take the best player available on their board and let the chips fall where they may.
1st Vikings Pick
The Vikings need to get the BPA period. If that is Richardson then so be it.
Mark, it’s a rare day that I disagree with you, but this time I have to.
BPA stocks the team with plenty of star-power, but it leaves positions of real need, badly neglected. We see the results of BPA drafting right now, and it’s not pretty. The Vikings have a handful of truly great players, and a lot of medicority everywhere else.
This year, the Vikings need to take the BOLP; Best Offensive Lineman Available. And if they can pull a trade that brings them multiple picks for that 1st rounder, then it’s an O-lineman and Defensive Secondary.
Of course, whatever needs they’re able to fill before the draft is a huge bonus, and could change the entire draft map for them.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I know they will not pick Richardson but I would not be upset
AP is not a guarantee to return to 100%. Toby had a meniscus injury that he is letting heal on it’s own.
AP is probably going to start the year on the PUP list. He would if I were in charge.
What happens if Toby goes down?
TRich is the real deal and can catch the ball very well.
The Vikings are definitely looking to add a running back. Todman and King are unknowns and may never amount to anything.
All that being said, I would not put any money on a TRich pick.
I think it is something the team will discuss though as they should.
Passing League
That’s the other issue, Mark. Yeah, it’s been absolutely awesome, watching AD break free and bust tail en-route to another rampage down the field. But honestly, I’d rather have a WR with equivlant talent at that position, than an RB.
I just don’t think that building up the running game with early round picks, without at the least taking care of the O-line, is going to be very effective and help win games. And even with a great O-line, will a great running game be the key to get the Vikings all the way? Highly questionable.
I’m comfortable with Toby and Harvin out of the backfield until AD gets back on his feet, and let those draft picks take care of the O-line, secondary, and WR issues.
It might be a good idea to look over who’s available in FA this year, and who’s likely to test the waters. That has to be part of the draft picture.
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
I am all for the BPA if the Vikings stay at #3.
I can live with a tackle in the second round. I do not want them to reach for a guy just because it is a need. That is where you really can mess things up.
Whomever the BPA is at #3 no matter the position is the player they should select. That is the best way to help the team IMO.
I do not want the team to be forced into selecting a position just because people feel it is a huge need. Once we see what happens in free agency it could be that the Vikings do not have to select any specific position.
I think BPA works very well most of the time.
there is BPA and there is tiered BPA
Where you have a selection of people you want to take and they are all close to the same value level, but some fit the holes in your team better than others. I understood where people were upset with Ponder last year because he was looked at as a second round prospect. But if Reif is considered a 7th to Trents 3rd then I don’t see that as being a huge hit. I wouldn’t mind waiting to the second for our positions of need if I thought we could actually draft people other than in the first round that were going to work out for us.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
by Grime on Jan 30, 2012 10:04 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Keep making sense and you're going to earn yourself a slice of pie :)
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
As they say about a million monkeys on a million type writers
that’s a lot of poop.
The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.
Zone Blocker?
I keep hearing that Martin would fit best on a team that uses zone blocking?
Does Musgrave favor zone blocking or some other scheme?
Nobody knows, because he apparently uses some of both.
AWESOM-O is now initiating fart smell sequence.
You have to factor in AP's bonus money when trying to cite salaries.
He is due to make $40 million in 2011-2012-2013 alone, with $36 million guaranteed. That is a pay out of $13.333 million average. Nobody knows the details of the contract, you have only listed his base salary numbers.
AWESOM-O is now initiating fart smell sequence.
Here is what various sites have
rotoworld …
9/10/2011: Signed a seven-year, $96 million contract. The deal contains $36 million guaranteed, $32 million of which is guaranteed for skill and the other $4 million for injury. Another $4 million is available through escalators. 2011: $8.25 million, 2012: $8 million, 2013: $11.25 million, 2014: $11.75 million, 2015-2017: Under Contract, 2018: Free Agent
http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/minnesota-vikings/adrian-peterson/
His guaranteed money is 32 mil with another 4 mil for injury. The guy I quoted has done contracts in the NFL and he believes the Vikings have an out after 2012.
You should check the whole article. The injury clause is significant.
the point is that base salary is not what really matters.
it’s that the nfl uses the infamous “salary cap”, each player contract will have a “salary cap number” associated with it. and this is what matters, because teams have to meet the season’s salary cap requirements. there is both a maximum and minimum salary cap and a bunch of rules associated with calculating it. it is just a big numbers game.
you listed only base salary, and you just copy and pasted info from the article you linked. but the thing is that the author also does not know any of the real details of the contract, so he didn’t refer to any salary cap numbers or salary cap implications of cutting peterson. he only mentions a provision that allows a player to recieve a portion of his non-guaranteed base salary in the event that he is cut after he suffers an injury (for the 2 years following his injury) and can’t play.
the fact is that peterson is due to make $40 million over the first 3 years of his 7 year contract. and that $36 million of it is guaranteed. his base salaries for the first 3 years adds up to $27.5 million. that means that $12.5 million is remaining in the form of bonus money, most of which would be signing bonus money. we don’t know the exact amount, because “they” won’t tell us, but we can figure out this much.
if the vikings cut him, they will immediately be responsible for the remaining guaranteed money on his contract with regards to the salary cap. it will all be counted against that year’s cap number.
that is significant, base salary amounts really are not important when there is any bonus money involved, you have to add it up. you should notice that the teams are not disclosing contract details in order to keep their finances a bit of a mystery. i’m not surprised.
the additional injury protection benefit is a smaller sum of money that potentially could apply and could be in addition to the guaranteed money that is listed. andreew brandt’s scenerio is only a vague “what if” question and only pointing out that the vikings have big money invested in a guy who now has a shredded knee.
fyi, sporttrac is a joke. it is inaccurate, incomplete, and inconsistent. i have perused that site several times and it is always piecemeal. i noticed that they have ryan perrilloux listed as a 2011 viking for $330k. and, it lists usa today and rotoworld as it’s sources. this is pretty telling. usa today hasn’t had it’s salary cap database working for over 2 years, and rotoworld doesn’t have any real information for salary cap purposes, smartly, they don’t even bother to list it a a catagory. they only list the info that is released in the media to the public, thus incomplete data.
it is pretty clear that it is in the vikings best financial interests to take a wait and see approach to adrian’s shredded knee and hope for the best. they are on the hook for boo-koo bucks for the next 3 years with him any way you look at it.
AWESOM-O is now initiating fart smell sequence.
Everything you say is true
but Brandt served as a team vice president of the Green Bay Packers from 1999 to 2008, negotiating player contracts and managing the team’s salary cap.
He knows there is a reason why the Vikings put in that injury guarantee as he says here …
In light of Sunday’s injury, it is interesting that there is a $4 million injury guarantee. This means Peterson would be paid despite the fact he suffered an injury that prevents him from playing. That clause seemed far-fetched to be thinking about when negotiated for 2013 – the year for which it is applicable – but with the severity of the injury, it may turn out to be prescient.
-———————————————————————————————————————————-
It is hard to find any site that has accurate details of the actual contracts and how much counts against the cap each year.
I still think the Vikings could decide to release or more likely trade AP prior to the 2013 season if they feel he may not get back to the old AP. Yeah they will take a cap hit of close to 12 mil. But they really have no one else on the team that is going to be due for a new deal in 2103 besides Percy, Loadholt, Allen, Brinkley, and Sanford.
They may be willing to have that 13 mil count against the cap. The only question would be how that would affect the 89% requirement that the team needs to spend starting in 2013.
I doubt it happens but it could be interesting.
I do.
I also feel that it is much easier to find a good to great RB in the later rounds of the draft than it is for most other positions.
Toby, while technically outperforming AP’s numbers last year, is not nearly the runner AP is. But he might have a higher ceiling in the blocking and passing game. I would not be upset if Toby was our starting RB. (that is, if AP were not an option for us.)
by Bjorno on Jan 27, 2012 10:49 AM CST via mobile reply actions
Damned mobile
That was supposed to be a reply.
by Bjorno on Jan 27, 2012 10:50 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Why not sign a stop-gap free agent to fill in at rb. there are some good choices this year.
AWESOM-O is now initiating fart smell sequence.
Stop-gap is the way to go
there are so many holes on this team. Running back is not that valuable of a position to invest a lot of money into it, unless he can be a factor in both the running game and the passing game.
by Are we cursed? on Jan 27, 2012 8:16 PM CST up reply actions
Mike Tolbert anyone?
8 Rushing TD’s, and over 50 catches last season. I don’t know if he’s a full-time starting RB lead horse type of guy, but he’s a great RB to help in both the passing game and in goal line situations.
He might not be ideal to pair with Toby, as they both are very physical, but I would really like to see him in purple. He’s a great blocker and basically a bigger, better short-yardage Chester Taylor.
Would be a nice fit...
But will be asking too much.
The guy has shown he can be a #1 back, he is going to want #1 money.
Later rounds
Try undrafted. See Arian Foster.
by christian220896 on Jan 28, 2012 4:44 PM CST up reply actions
"Spielman" and "wheel and deal" in the same sentence makes me nervous.
It could mean we end up with butt loads of 5th round picks to go along with our new 1st round pick we get from the Patriots….making our first pick at number 32. Oh, and somehow the Pats end up with our 3rd round pick again, but we get Chad Ochocinco in return.
AWESOM-O is now initiating fart smell sequence.
Agreed. The Vikings have 8 picks this year and will have 10 when they get their compensatory picks so trading down shouldn't be a priority.
The compensatory picks are hard to figure out but I’ve read that they’ll most likely be a 3rd and 5th or two 4ths. Either way the Vikings will have 5-6 picks in the first 4 rounds so I’m not that eager to see the Vikings trade down to accumulate more picks this year. Spielman should be able to just stay put at #3 in each round and draft quite a few quality players this year. The only trades I’d be in favor of would be using some of our later round picks to trade up for an extra 3rd or 4th rounder. The Vikings have plenty of draft picks this year and I’d rather they focus on drafting quality players over the quantity approach.
by CanadianViking on Jan 27, 2012 6:37 PM CST up reply actions
Not me. I want him to wheel and deal as much as possible
He should be able to parlay those early picks into multiple picks including some in 2013. I think he can trade the later picks for future picks as well.
The #3 spot in each round sounds nice but you never know how a player will pan out.
I guess it depends on the trade.
If he trades down in the top ten and gets an extra 2nd rounder or future 1st round pick I won’t complain. I just don’t want him to get too fancy and pull any Gerhart or Cook type deals where he gives up too much value for a player or misses out on a player while trying to get a little extra value. If Spielman drafts well this should be a great draft for the Vikings because they’ll have 3 picks in the top 70 and as many as six picks(without trades) in the top 150. I don’t expect him to hit on every pick but with the Vikings cap room and strong draft position they should be able to add 2-3 new starters in free agency and another 2-3 starters with this draft. Spielman’s got every opportunity to add a lot of talent and I think this is offseason is going to be huge in determining if the Viking’s are on their way up again or if they’re going to be bottom-feeders for a few more years.
by CanadianViking on Jan 27, 2012 8:32 PM CST up reply actions
I would like to accumulate as many top 50 picks as possible.
I could see trading back to 6 or 7 while throwing in a late round pick or two to gain a couple extra 1st or early 2nd round picks.
The NDSU Bison rock.
by berserkerND on Jan 28, 2012 12:07 PM CST up reply actions
Spielman is an idiot.
He gets lucky quite often and only he could mess this up by trading the 3rd overall pick for MANY lower round picks, mostly of whom won’t pan out.
by christian220896 on Jan 28, 2012 4:46 PM CST reply actions
Spielman is an idiot.
Which is why he is the general manager of an NFL franchise, and you are sitting in your basement posting on DN in your underpants.
Wearing a mask.....
Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!
SKOL!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Former high-school star Brian Banks does serious time on trumped-up charge, now hopes for an NFL shot
- Former ‘idiot kicker’ Mike Vanderjagt in trouble after accosting junior-high heckler
- Adrian Peterson blows teammates away in footraces; appears to be on the mend
- UPDATE: Charlie Sheen didn’t buy Lawrence Taylor’s Super Bowl ring
- Alex Smith gets blown up by Jon Beason over Cam Newton comments
