Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

What In The Blue Hades Is Cris Carter Still Not Doing In Canton??

Man, if only he had played at a position that has any impact on a football game whatsoever.

Or, "How Stupid Are People That Believe Wide Receiver Is An Unimportant Position?".

OK, you all know by now that once again, for the stupidest reason I've ever heard, Cris Carter has been denied entry into the Hall of Fame. Again. For the fourth freaking time.

Now, if you haven't heard, the reason rumored is that the Hall of Fame voting committee considers Wide Receiver to be one of the more unimportant positions in the NFL, and the statistics absolutely show this. There is an incredible dearth of WRs in Canton- only Kickers and Tight Ends are less represented. And it's not just the Hall of Fame that has this opinion- I've seen and heard the most ludicrous suggestions out there that a top-level WR just isn't important.

Well, let's focus on that, shall we? Let's take a Leap of Faith and explore just how worthless that position really is.

Star-divide

This is a bit of a break-down, by the way, to enlighten the morons who hold to this position. Now, I'm not going to say I understand the game of football as well as the Hall of Fame committee... but I truly, truly disagree with them in their assessments of Wide Receivers and their value.

One of the stupidest things I've ever heard/ seen held up as proof that WRs are essentially ‘side shows' for a real NFL team is Randy Moss' final season. Moss leaves New England, New England picks up Deion Branch (who nobody can consider superior in any way to Moss), and they do just fine. Moss goes to Minnesota, does very little to help team win games, and is kicked out and then winds up in Tennessee, where he has equally little impact and is out of the league the following season. And since Moss is arguably in the top 3 of WRs all-time, clearly, this is a perfect example that the position isn't that important?

>smacks forehead... hard<

OK then. Let's sample another piece of Randy Moss-related history. Oh, say, the 1998 Minnesota Vikings and the 2007 New England Patriots. There are two very interesting similarities between those two teams: both set the record for most points scored in a regular season, and both featured... >gasp< Randy Moss, with absolutely no other player having been on both teams. Gee, that's a mighty coincidence- the arrival (as it was his inaugural season with both teams) of Randy Moss twice creates unprecedented offensive juggernauts.

What would you weigh more? This fact, or the previous one of his disastrous final season? It's amazing how many people seem to prefer the latter as evidence of a WR's value. As a side note, when Minnesota did pick up Moss that year, my friend (who is actually a Packer fan, curse his soul) texted me- "Well, AP just got his 2K yard season". Keep that little tidbit in mind... we'll cover it more later.

Now then, let's move along to another subject I'd like to discuss- last night's Super Bowl. Two top-tier quarterbacks. Two decent pass rushes, two decent run games. Two talented, seasoned, intelligent head coaches- themselves likely headed to Canton one day (alongside their QBs, in all likelihood). Now, this one could be argued very effectively either way, but personally there was one key difference that the Giants- you know, the team that won- had in their favor that the Patriots did not- a group of very talented WRs. Yes, Wes Welker had a great game, that drop aside. Deion Branch was okay. Chad Ochocinco... well, he made a catch and then I think tweeted about it so much he never saw the field again. On the other side of the ball were Victor Cruz, Hakeem Nicks, and Mario Manningham, doing his best David Tyree impersonation of saving the day in a critical moment. (Oh yeah. It was a WR who essentially make the Giant's success possible... in a single play.) While you can't knock Wes Welker, even despite that one critical dropped pass, the WR corps as a whole for the Giants trumped the Patriots' WR corps... and lo and behold, it was the Giants who won. (Again, I know there are other factors, and the overall weighted importance of this one part can be debated ceaselessly- but to me, it was the main part of the Giant's win.)

Now, I said we'd return to my friend's text earlier, and we'll do so now. I wanted to cover the Giant's WR corps first because it plays into this. Ever notice a top-level WR do a ‘disappearing' act? When the Pats made their SB run in 2007, Moss pretty much did just that in the playoffs. And while Cruz had his TD (and salsa dance!), he himself made a lengthy disappearance after. But therein lies the threat of a top-level WR- they draw so much attention that they open things up for other players in other positions- TEs, RBs, lesser WRs. Now, WRs aren't the only ones to do this- Adrian Peterson's trend of drawing eight men in the box has an opposite effect, so to speak. But how do we get the best out of our superstar running back? It's no secret around here- we need a top-tier WR to stretch the field. Outside of our offensive line, it's our biggest gap on that side of the ball, and it's well known it would immediately make our offense much better.

This is a passing game, ladies and gentlemen. And that's not exactly a recent trend. Yes, offenses have become more prolific in recent years thanks to new helmet-to-helmet rules and rules regarding hitting a defenseless player, but football's been a passing game since the 70's. Is WR the most important guy on the field? No, that honor remains uncontested- the QB. But let's consider too, just as a great QB can make average WRs look equally great- so to can great WRs make average QBs look great. (Another Randy Moss reference! See- Matt Cassel, career comparisons between Patriots and Chiefs of.) It is the most ludicrous assumption that WRs are the most unimportant guys on the offense.

And with that in mind, it is absolutely ludicrous that the man who finished his career number two in career receptions and touchdowns, and still currently stands number 4 in touchdowns is not in the Hall of Fame, just because some people are so stupid as to genuinely believe that WR is an unimportant position. How well would the Vikings have fared in 1998 with just Randy Moss? Would we have won 15 games? I don't believe so- we would have still been good, but not 15-1 good. Cris Carter absolutely was a game changer on two of the three teams he played for (Philadelphia Eagles and Minnesota Vikings- the whole ‘Miami Dolphins' stint at the end of his career is a bit of a ‘lost year', albeit for a guy well past his playing days by then).

And yet... he's still not in the Hall of Fame. All thanks to the stupidest reason imaginable.

Comment 28 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

You know

if I listed every single reason why considering Wide Receivers as the least valuable players on offense is the height of stupidity, this story would still be being written… might be able to post it by Thursday or so. I tried to stick with recent-ish stuff, but that would be another great point.

261 Daily Norseman readers and counting say I am a genius... the masses have spoke!

...and those who voted 'moron' were secretly Packer trolls.

Daily Norseman

by KJSegall on Feb 6, 2012 2:32 PM CST up reply actions  

I don't normally read MMQB

As mostly Peter King doesn’t say much that interests me, but reading between the lines of his column this week might suggest that there is divided support for Cris, Andre Reed and Tim Brown.

I don’t get why that matters, exactly, but I also don’t get how Carter isn’t head and shoulders ahead of those guys. He changed the way receivers play the position.

by amiller92 on Feb 6, 2012 2:39 PM CST reply actions  

The HOF doesn't hold much credibility...imo!

Randy Moss is obviously a 1st ballot HOF’er, but I would take C. Carter twice before I took Moss.

I’m pretty sure Paul Krause still holds the all time INT-record, but it took like 17yrs before the HOF accepted him.
The HOF likes SB-Rings. If the Vikings of the 70’s/90’s/09’s would’ve won a SB, there would probably be a bit more purple in the HOF.

by chaosg on Feb 6, 2012 2:51 PM CST reply actions  

Bingo!

It really bugs the he’ll out of me that Michael Irvin who is a complete jackass is in and was a 1st ballot nominee I believe. Everyone of Carter’s numbers is better than everyone of Irvin’s – and they played at the same time. I guess when you have a silver star on your helmet you have a lower threshhold to clear.

by Torstein on Feb 6, 2012 7:21 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Having E. Smith in the backfield certainly helped Irvins numbers too.

Guaranteed single coverage every time E. Smith was on the field…. even on 3rd & long!

by chaosg on Feb 6, 2012 8:27 PM CST up reply actions  

I'm honestly not sure...

… that Moss gets in first time. With his talent, he should hold every single receiving record in the book (except for the most Superbowl rings). His problems happened during his playing career – ‘I play when I want to’ when accused of taking plays off – walking to the locker room when the game with the Redskins was still being played – totally disappearing from sight when with the Raiders – having a hissy fit when he wasn’t given an extension by the Patriots – virtually begging to be brought back to the Patriots in the post game press conference whilst playing for the Vikings – ripping the Vikings team caterers saying that he wouldn’t feed that food to his dogs.

Yes, Moss was a great talent who did great things – I still remember in the Madden game John Madden stating that Moss is a rare talent you build your franchise around – and he also had one of the best seasons ever by a WR when with the Patriots, but he should not get in to the HOF as a first ballot.

by blowfishes on Feb 7, 2012 7:41 AM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Yeah, those caterers are powerful

You are right, of course, but it amazes me that people bring up the caterers like anyone should care. Those must be some well connected caterers.

by amiller92 on Feb 7, 2012 8:17 AM CST up reply actions  

It's just when even Brett Favre...

… avoids making a comment to the press, it was obviously an embarrassing situation. Seems to me that he wanted out – and he ultimately got himself out. I can’t blame him totally as Childress had lost the plot by then, and the Vikings tended to use Moss more as a decoy than actual threat, but you don’t kick off against someone who has done nothing to deserve such treatment. I couldn’t care less if it was the caterer, cleaner, an intern, admin etc, he should have dealt with the situation differently. Can I just add that I still wear my Moss shirt, just now it’s a bit further down my list of favourites.

by blowfishes on Feb 7, 2012 11:16 AM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Hey...

Does anyone have any idea why Lions fans hate Cris Carter so much? I was over on the POD site the other day and they seemed to have a deep hatred for him, laughing at his getting passed over and everything.
I don’t think it’s just cuz he’s a Viking player cuz they didn’t seem to have much to say about Chris Doleman…..in fact, a couple of them were happy he got in.

Just wondering.

by gerkvoltage on Feb 6, 2012 7:25 PM CST reply actions  

Probably something to do with...

… Cris Carter not including Calvin Johnson in his top 5 WRs current playing. Although he has since retracted this by saying that Johnson is obviously one of the best, the whole of Detroit (including the team owner) seem to keep bringing this up whenever they get a chance to.

by blowfishes on Feb 7, 2012 7:30 AM CST via mobile up reply actions  

Oh I see....

That’s pretty ridiculous. Well whatever. Haters will hate I guess.

by gerkvoltage on Feb 7, 2012 9:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Cris Carter, Tim Brown, Andre Reed, Irving Fryar...the era of the great reciever.

maybe there is such a glut of top recievers now that the game has turned into such a passing league, and if they vote in these guys, then they will have to vote in any subsequent reciever that amasses similar stats. And there are going to be more and more, now that we have multiple 5000 yard passing seasons by qbs.
Still, I say get these guys in there, I think they belong.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_career.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_yds_career.htm

You don't tug on Superman's cape
You don't spit into the wind
You don't pull the mask of the Spiderman
And you don't trash talk about him

by REVENGE4WEBB on Feb 6, 2012 11:33 PM CST reply actions  

Voters need...

… to accept, although the NFL is now a passing league, when the guys like Carter were playing, it was still a running league! When they put up the numbers they did, they were pioneers at the position. The fact that a player like Carter posted those gaudy figures on a regular basis just shows how good he was. Carter was good for the NFL – bad boy come good – and Calvin Johnson comment aside (the reason why Detroit dislikes him), he has always continued to be good for the League since. Many HOF voters have stated their admiration for Carter, some stating that during his playing days he was one of only a few players that they would be willing to pay to watch, but Carter has always lost out to partisan/non-objective voters promoting their favourite of that year, rather than actually thinking ‘this guy deserves to be in the Hall, my guy can get in on his second attempt!’
The only way Carter gets in is if someone takes control of the HOF voting – like Paul Zimmerman did for Art Monk’s selection – by saying ‘Every year we end up discussing Monk – let’s just put him in so we can take him off the table’.

by blowfishes on Feb 7, 2012 4:31 AM CST via mobile reply actions  

What about Martin?

That CC isn’t in is embarrassing, but has anyone looked at Curtis Martin’s numbers? Overall they are good and they do compare to other top notch RB’s (Franco Harris, Tony Dorsett…Ricky Watters(?)). I’ve heard that everyone loved him off the field, but was he ever anyone that you would consider the best at his position? If you had a CC highlight reel playing next to a Martin highlight reel…..

by DBQViking on Feb 7, 2012 9:20 AM CST reply actions  

the only thing I remember about Curtis Martin is Chris Berman calling him CURTIS “MY FAVORITE” MARTIN! in the highlights during PrimeTime.

I would laugh because My Favorite Martian was funny to me as a kid. :D

by Odin'sDrunkenSon on Feb 7, 2012 11:15 AM CST up reply actions  

Martin was a very good back for a long time

And was certainly one of the best at has position while he played. But I don’t think he’s one of the best of all time.

He’s the kind of guy who I wouldn’t advocate for, but I don’t have a problem with his inclusion.

by amiller92 on Feb 7, 2012 11:22 AM CST up reply actions  

I saw Peter King...

… saying it was the voters split between Andre Reed and Cris Carter canceling each other out. They can’t decide who is best between the two, and so Carter doesn’t get enough votes. That despite the fact that, by numbers, Carter is statistically much better. It really seems an injustice. I’m not sure about Andre Reed but Carter is a clear cut case, he should have been first ballot HOF. Seems ridiculous.

by HammeroftheGods on Feb 7, 2012 9:49 AM CST reply actions  

The think I didn't get from King's article

Is why it’s an either or choice for the voters.

Well, that and how anyone could really think the Reed was better than Carter.

by amiller92 on Feb 7, 2012 11:24 AM CST up reply actions  

Yeah I can't see Reed being better than Carter either

but then I may be showing my homerism here. Ok I’m not there is no comparison.

The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.

by Grime on Feb 8, 2012 7:29 AM CST up reply actions  

absolute travesty!!!!

chris has got to go on dancing with the stars! then perhaps he will get the votes for hof. enuf is a FN nuf already!

by Harryaz on Feb 7, 2012 11:27 PM CST reply actions  

How would you all feel if Moss got in before Carter...

The Vikes aren't in a remodeling or reconstruction they are in a burn the place down and start praying they don't mimic the Lions rebuilding process.

by Grime on Feb 8, 2012 7:29 AM CST reply actions  

Would not happen,

Moss will have to wait at least four tries to get in. The Hall does not like WR’s, especially if you have no SB ring. The Hall and voters hated Moss off the field (some of it was overblown, some he deserved). Carter has to plow through the Tim Brown’s, and Andre Reed’s. Hell the may put in Ricky Williams before Randy Moss…..

by DBQViking on Feb 8, 2012 11:54 AM CST up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

DN strives to be the best blog about the Minnesota Vikings on the internet, doing so with a unique blend of insight and analysis, as well as (hopefully) wit and humor. We hope you enjoy the site, and make it your home for Minnesota Vikings info!

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
You Can Breathe Slightly Easier
Small
Vikings Roster Analysis: Secondary
Russian_arms_control_small
Season in Review: Chris Cook's Best and Worst performances in 2011
Biggun_small
1st New Vikes Stadium Image

Recent FanPosts

Jg_small
UBVs Special| Trivia! Can you name the Minnesota Vikings Starting QBs?
Small
Roster Analysis: Quarterbacks
Biggun_small
SUCK IT MARTY! - Stadium Passes MPLS 7-6
Imagescaj02y87_small
We get NO RESPECT!
Small
Supplemental Draft and our Safety Situation
Small
Vikings Roster Analysis: Receivers and Tight ends
Grover_small
Purple Kool Aid - Oh Ya!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Photo_10_small
Percy Harvin and the 2012-13 Passing Game

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


Triangle Of Authority

Dailynorseman_small Christopher Gates

Ted_logo_small Ted Glover

Victory__small Eric J. Thompson

Assistant Coaches

Minnesota-vikings-logo_small MarkSP18

Wiggy_7_small Skol Girl

Headshot_small KJSegall