FanPost

Black Monday Victims--Anything Worthwhile?

First off this story is probably a little premature, but with Black Monday showing many coaches the door I got a little curious. Do the fans of our favorite team think Musgrave has done enough to keep his job? Do we want a different offensive coordinator? BTW, this one is a kinda long so if you wanna take the trip with me I suggest grabbing a drink.

Some possible suitors Greg Knapp from Oakland, maybe Norv Turner if he choses to go back to his role as OC which he has had more success as than HC, Chan Gailey, and Pat Shurmer. These are all Black Monday victims, if they want to take a shot at a retread as opposed to try and bring someone up from college.

Greg Knapp

He, according to all I can find, is a WCO kinda guy. He has been an OC for the 49ers in '01-'03, Falcons '04-'06, Raiders '07-'08 and '12.

On the 49ers he had a decent offensive roster all 3 years.

  1. He had some of Jeff Garcia's best years, but he started spiraling in '03 and missed 3 weeks due to an injury.
  2. He had Terrell Owens when he went for 1412 yards, 1300 yards, and 1102.
  3. He seemed to favor a tandem back system with Garrison Hearst and Kevan Barlow. Combined they ran for over 1700 yards all 3 years.

On the Falcons in '04-'06 he had Vick and Dunn in their crazy style offense.

  1. Vick threw for about 2400 yards each of these years with a 54.7% completion rate. He also ran for 902, 597, and 1039.
  2. Dunn ran for 1106, 1416, 1140. T.J. Duckett ran for 509 in '04, 380 in '05, and Jerious Norwood ran for 633 in '06. I seem to remember they ran outta the I formation a lot that year so Felton could be a necessity in his offense.
  3. Also, Alge Crumpler had pretty amazing seasons for a TE in those years as he averaged 810 yards receiving and 56 receptions, which could make Rudolph a pretty happy camper.

On Oakland in '07-'08 he probably wishes he could drown these two years of misery out of his brain with copious amounts of alcohol.

  1. I have no idea what he was trying to do here, but he had Josh McCown, Daunte Culpepper and JaMarcus Russell. All 3 were bad. I find it amazing that any of their running backs had anything close to a 4 ypc average because when people say WE have no threat of a passing attack... well they forget how bad this offense was.

He came back in 2012 to Oakland and had a little more success.

  1. Carson Palmer threw for 4k yards, completed 61.1%, 22 TD's, 14 INT's.
  2. Darren McFadden only played 12 games and ran for 707 yards.
  3. Lots of people had lots of yards here, 4 people over 500 yards. But interestingly enough their TE had the most yards and receptions with 79 for 806 yards. Methinks Rudy would really benefit from his style of offense.

Overall he seems to really like his TE's. I went back and looked at the stats for his TE in San Fran. Eric Johnson had 40 receptions for 362 yards in '01, 36 for 321 in '02, and Jed Weaver had 35 receptions for 437. But back in '01, '02, '03 if your name wasn't Tony Gonzalez or Shannon Sharpe you probably weren't seeing 60 or 70 touches a year. (See TE numbers in: '01, '02, '03) He also runs his RB's hard, but seems to like a guy like AP. Warrick Dunn was the unquestioned starter. Darren McFadden is a workhorse back. The only question is who would sub for AP, because he seems to like change of pace guys and Toby just isn't that. From what I've noticed he seems to use a lot of the same type of personnel we already use. AP is the type of back he likes, Rudolph would get a lot of looks, Felton would be solidly employed, Ponder would probably get a lot of bootleg passes. Only thing we don't have that he could use is a tall fast WR, but he probably couldn't find a TO/Roddy White/Darius Heyward-Bey in this draft.

Norv Turner

I will only include his career as OC, and won't include his HC stints. He has been an OC for Cowboys '91-'93, San Diego '01, Miami '02-'03, San Fran '06. He is an Air Coryell disciple which tries to stretch the field vertically to open up the rest of the offense. You can read it here in his own words.

In '91-'93 he had a pretty talented roster of Troy Aikman, Emmitt Smith, and Michael Irvin. This was a very talented offensive roster and I don't even know how many Pro Bowlers they had but I would assume they probably sent close to 8 people to Hawaii those years on the offensive side of the ball alone.

  1. Aikman had a pretty amazing completion percentage of 66% over the 3 years.
  2. Emmitt Smith averaged almost 1600 yards rushing over these 3 years. He also had insane amounts of touches. He had 365 attempts in '91, 373 in '92, and 283 in '93. He didn't play in 2 games and didn't start in 3.
  3. We all know Irvin was a monster averaging over 1400 yards over these 3 seasons.
  4. Jay Novacek was their TE and he saw a decent amount of action 59 receptions for 664, 68 rec for 562, 44 rec for 445. He went to the Pro Bowl all 3 years.

'01 Turner had Flutie at the ripe old age 39, LT, and Curtis Conway was doing just fine. I'm not quite sure why they fired him but I'm assuming since Mike Riley (HC) got fired then Marty Shottenheimer (the new HC) wanted his guy and brought in Cam Cameron.

  1. Flutie tossed the ole pigskin around for 3464, but had a little trouble with throwing picks. (15TD/18INT)
  2. LT had 1200 yards rushing on 339 attempts.
  3. Curtis Conway had 71 rec for 1125 yards, and Jeff Graham had 52 rec for 811. This should attest to him stretching the field with their average yards per reception were 15.8 and 15.6 respectively.

'02 and '03 he was down in Miami with the Run Ricky Run Offense. After these years he got called up to do the big boy stuff for Washington.

  1. Jay Fiedler was his QB both years and barely threw for 2k each year.
  2. Ricky Williams had over 380 carries both years for 1853 and 1372 yards.
  3. Chris Chambers was pretty young then and had 52 rec for 734 (14.1 ave ypr) and 64 rec for 963 (15.0 ave ypr). Again the Air Coryell yielding a decent downfield passing attack.
  4. Randy McMichael his TE had 39 rec for 485 (12.4 ave ypr) and 49 for 589 (12.2 ave ypr)

'06 started the Alex Smith revolving door coordinator. I think this is a PRIME example of trying to fit a round peg in a square hole. Air Coryell fits Alex Smith like telling AP he's only gonna touch the ball 12 times. I'm not sure Air Coryell fits Ponder either.

  1. Alex Smith threw for 2890 yards, at a 58.1% and 16 TD's and 16 INT's.
  2. Frank Gore and for 312 carries and 1695 yards.
  3. Vernon Davis didn't get many touches as he seemed to split time with Eric Johnson but the two combined had 54 receptions for 557.
  4. Arnaz Battle and Antonio Bryant had 59 rec for 686 (11.6 ave ypr) and 40 rec for 733 (18.3 ave ypr)

Norv Turner runs RB's into the ground. He loves them to run and catch outta the backfield. Over these 7 years his RB's (Gore, Williams, LT, Smith) averaged 54 receptions. I'm not sure I like Turner for our Offense. Ponder isn't Troy Aikmen, and Alex Smith struggled heavily in his system, who Ponder really seems to mirror in skills. AP would most likely benefit from his playcalling, as would Rudy, but I'm just not sold. Purely my opinion about Norv, so take it with a grain of salt.

Chan Gailey

He is an Erhardt-Perkins guy, a ball control style offense. Musgrave uses most of the Erhardt style of language in his offense because he doesn't like long WCO verbiage... He was an OC/WR coach for Denver in '89-'90, OC for Pittsburgh in '96-'97, Dolphins in '00-'01, and KC in '08.

Denver in '89-'90 had Elway, Bobby Humphrey and Vance Johnson and Mark Jackson.

  1. Elway averaged 3288 yards and 56.1% completion. He threw 18 TD's and 18 INT's, then 15 TD's and 14 INT's.
  2. Bobby Humphrey had about 290 attempts each year. He also had 1151 and 1202 yards.
  3. Vance Johnson had 76 rec and 1095 yards in '89 and 54 rec and 747 yards in '90. Mark Johnson had 28 rec for 446 yards and 57 rec for 926 yards.

In Pittsburgh '96-'97 he had Mike Tomczak, "Slash" Kordell Stewart and Jerome Bettis.

  1. Bettis has 320 and 375 touches and 1431 and 1665 yards.
  2. Tomczak threw for 2767 yards and a 55.4% completion in '96. Stewart threw for 100 yards and 36.7% completion. In '97 Stewart was handed the keys and dropped the "Slash" role. He had 3020 yards and a 53.6% completion. He threw 21 TD's and 17 INT's. He also ran for 476 yards. This was probably close to his best year as a QB. That was the most TD's he threw for in a year, but he did up his Comp % as he got more experienced.

In '00-'01 he was down in South Beach. He had Jay Fiedler as a QB, and Lamar Smith as his RB. Oronde Gadsen had decent years under him. They also drafted Chris Chambers in '01. In '02 he was hired to be the coach for Georgia Tech. I only point this out because Norv Turner (see above) took his job. After Turner left the HC Dave Wannstedt went 1-8 and got fired mid-season.

  1. Jay Fiedler had his 2 best years as a QB under Gailey throwing for 2402 yards and 57% comp 14/14 in '00. In '01 he threw for 3290 and 60.7% completion with 20/19. (not world beating, I know)
  2. Lamar Smith had 309 for 1139 and 313 touches for 968.
  3. Orande Gadsen had 56 rec for 786 yards in '00. In '01 James McKnight had 55 rec for 684, Oronde Gadsen had 55 rec for 674, and Chris Chambers had 48 rec for 883.

In '08 he went to KC and like Greg Knapp in '07 and '08, and probably wants to forget it drunken stupor style. He had Tyler Thigpen, Damon Huard, and Brodie Croyle playing as QB that year, Larry Johnson and Jamaal Charles at RB and had Tony Gonzalez and Dwayne Bowe.

  1. Thigpen started 11 games but played in 14. He threw for 2608 with a 54.8% completion with 18 TD's and 12 INT's.
  2. Larry Johnson played 12 games and ran for 874 yards. Jamaal Charles ran for 357 yards.
  3. Dwayne Bowe caught 86 rec and 1022 yards. Tony Gonzalez had 96 rec and 1058.

Gailey has a reputation of getting the best out of his players. He definitely had good years from Gonzalez, Bowe and Fiedler, and possibly Stewart but Leslie Frasier is also doing a pretty bang up job of getting every ounce from this team. But in his defense he hasn't had a great QB since he coached for Elway and had to deal with his fair share of scrubs.

Pat Shurmer

He was an OC for St. Louis in '09-'10. He was credited with turning that offense around in '09 to '10 after being in the cellar in almost every offensive category. But I say after going 1-15 there's nowhere to go but up for that offense. But to be fair they had almost no talent on the offensive side of the ball. He's a WCO type of guy too, and it worked well with Bradford. He's credited with helping Bradford read the blitz pretty well. I'm not going to list their playmakers because we know it was Bradford, Steven Jackson, and Danny Amendola (when he was healthy). They had a very weak offensive line and very limited playmakers.

Now I pose the question to you, Vikings fans. You've read a little bit about each coaches offensive philosophy, who they had at key positions. Who would you like to see at OC next year?

This FanPost was created by a registered user of The Daily Norseman, and does not necessarily reflect the views of the staff of the site. However, since this is a <em>community</em>, that view is no less important.

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